Losing belief

Has anything in your life caused you to stop believing in something? Was it tragic? Dramatic? Traumatic? Do you feel like posting the details? Or is life just vampiric all-around?

There was a time when I believed in God. I spent years praying and waking up to the same stuff everyday. It soon got to the point where I just wouldn't talk much but I kept my beliefs. As soon as I reached twenty, that all changed. I was punched in the face pretty hard and had my tooth go through my lip. I stopped believing that day, mainly due to the "Don't slap the other cheek" phrase in the New Testament. Most people say I'm wrong and that I should keep my beliefs. I don't know. I'm atheistic right now.

So what about you? Anything similar?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

That's a really stupid reason to become an atheist.

I stopped thinking about "higher power" magic in my teens. Doesn't take a punch in the face to figure out it's just a mind-trap of fear and guilt. You don't need that.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

"Don't slap the other cheek"? Don't you mean "turn the other cheek"? The way you worded it was so...negative. Were you Catholic?

I agree with Cellius; if not being comfortable with not following one small suggestion that you be pacifist is the reason you turned away with Christianity...aren't there more egregious tenets of the Bible you could've decided you couldn't abide by? Like hating gays, or not masturbating? Something typical and lame? (What I'm getting at is the Bible says a lot of things that not everyone agrees with, so I can't quite comprehend why this one was so important to you.)

That said, I never felt like I believed in God, I just decided at 16 that I didn't. There was no falling out, there was no single act that pushed me in that way, I just concluded that that's what I felt to be the truth.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Friend poopsie, no matter what belief you adhere to, you're going to get in a few lumps while going through life.

If this single violent episode was enough to shake your belief, then I daresay it never was that firm in the first place. And you may have misunderstood some of the guarantees - you were never promised a cush life, at least in this world.

How ya doing, buddy?

I was raised Roman Catholic by my then-agnostic father. Because of all the women who had a hand in raising me, I learned pretty quick that one religion was no better than any other religion. I was sent to CCD by one woman for some odd years, did my communion, confession, all that.

After I did my first confession, my father approached me and asked if I "really believed in this Catholic stuff." I must have been about 12 at the time, but I laughed and told him no, I never believed it. I never had belief for which I could lose.

I have never had "belief" in much. The only things I know with any surefire faith is that I WILL die, and NOTHING is permanent.

I agree that Poopsie's reason for going atheist is kind of stupid. "I got hit, and I didn't do anything about it" is more YOUR fault than anyone else's Poopsie. You picked and chose what you wanted to gobble up.

I was speaking idiomatically.

I dunno. I mean, yes. I wholeheartedly agree with others in the thread in that getting punched in the face is a pretty idiotic reason to go OH KAY I DON'T THINK ANYTHING BESIDES THE PHYSICAL EXISTS NOW, cuz, you know, Christians got beat up and killed all the time for being Christian. The Bible never says anything about God being an almighty protector from all physical pain. Was this punch in RESPONSE to a profession of belief?

Also, the fact that you're using the word "belief" is interesting, what with the nuances of the English language and someone becoming an atheist usually says that they lose faith. Is there a reason for this? Just wondering, honestly.

Finally, personal thoughts: yes. I have lost faith at one point; I was dealing with a lot of shit, least of which was the reconciling of my homosexuality with something that I felt in my bones with no lick of guilt. It's just that my loss of faith was followed by an personal understanding of things that simply makes sense to me. I'm still a Christian, but my view of God and the world is simply different from most other people's.

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I never was a strong God believer. I did accept that god existed, but it did not influence my life.

However, after watching Zeitgeist (the first part of the first movie), I became a strong agnostic (hey, no one can tell for sure if there IS a god). Almost everything in the ''revealed'' religions is taken from pagan religions : virgin birth, death on the cross, resurection after three days, religious symbols, death cult...

FELIPE NO

You do know that Zeitgeist is really full of shit, right?

Zeitgeist, the movie Debunked - Part One - Conspiracy Science

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

My parents are Anglican as far as I know, but they've never seemed all that religiously adherent. Oddly, I got landed in a Christian boarding school for ten years (I figure it gave them something to boast about at social engagements while they were still together). That significant a chunk of your life spent being belittled for faithlessness is no charitable experience. Three hours' detention spent analysing bible passages in return for skipping on a half-hour service? Oh, yeah, seems fair to me. Not really sure what I was thinking, willingly distancing myself from endless hate speech and patronisation like that.

I was never committed to anything as a kid, but being put through the christ-grinder was enough for me to drop any notions of spirituality forever.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I think catholic schools should be outlawed, personally. When you're that young it's not fair to have such a belief shoved down your throat. You're susceptible and vulnerable to believing whatever an adult tells you is truth.

I grew up going through catholic school after catholic school, accepting christianity as truth. From the ages of six until I was about fourteen I was terrified that I was going to hell. I had sinned and often times, my teachers would tell me that my disobedience in the classroom was unforgivable in the eyes of god, that I better pray extra long tonight.

Fortunately, once I reached the age of fourteen or so, I just stopped believing. It wasn't due to some traumatic event or some kind of grand finale, I just stopped. After years of debating with people and defending my beliefs, everything I read just finally made sense. I can't explain why I felt this way, maybe it's just a part of growing up.

I don't waiver anymore, despite my mother telling me that I'll change my mind once I hit adulthood.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I've gone the opposite route starting out being raised a devout atheist and transitioning away from that with time. Going from atheist to agnostic after getting over my stupid strident atheist crap when I was in my teens and then riding right on into heathen silliness do to some experiences with ghosts. It's damn hard to maintain a belief that science has all the answers when something it has no grasp on comes out and bites you on the nose figuratively speaking.

Now it's settled into a everything is true and total bullshit at the same time paradigm. Not sure how it works but it seems to be doing ok for the moment.

I'd like to hear more about this punch so mighty it knocked poopsies faith clean off. Context would just be swell plus we need whoever did it to be the next mortal combat character. A fatality that destroys your enemies very belief structure would be totally sweet.

How ya doing, buddy?

Are we really supposed to talk religion with a guy named "Poopsie"?

But I digress: Jewish, raised through six years in a Jewish day school. That was enough to push me toward non-religiousness.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

I've never been a very religious person. My parents are both Catholic but they never really tried to make sure I believed. I remember praying a few times when I was REALLY young but by the time I was in about 3rd grade just about any talk of religion trailed off.

That said it's hard to really be religious or flat out deny the existance of god for me. I'm kind of one of those gotta see it to believe it types, but at the same time there are so many things about life and the universe that science simply can not explain.

I'd like to believe there is a god and an afterlife. But there really is no way to know. And it's just creepy to think that when you die, you might just cease to exist. If there is a god though, I'd like to think he's alot less worried about certain things then alot of religious groups would want you to believe.

I was speaking idiomatically.

I was raised Mennonite, went to a Mennonite high school, and go to a Mennonite University. The two institutions i attended are surprisingly liberal minded when it comes to most things though, and i found myself quite surprised when i actually got there. I grew up very agnostic, but still called myself a christian, not only because of the people surrounding me's sake, but also because i honestly do like some of the things Christianity offers and teaches.

I never really had solid faith to "shake" per say, but i'll never forget the year i had my beliefs regarding Christianity shaken. In grade 11, as part of the required course load in my high school, i took a christian ethics class with a teacher who's basic philosophy regarding the class was that he would present the material, teach us everything he could about it, and let us form our own opinions while not giving any slant of his own. He showed us how most bible passages are misinterpreted by today's audience because of translation issues, and the change of historical context. It was here that i learned to form my own faith, and the same has been happening at my university since i got here. I arguably am less of a christian that i ever have been, but i still call myself a christian.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

I used to go to Catholic school when I was a young lad. Religion is so tedius and boring, that definitely turned me off right away.

Religion never made sense to me, really. I had been to a few different types of churches for one reason or another all through high school and they where all strange and made me feel uncomfortable. Rituals, beliefs without much foundation on truth, and the whole higher-power thing is too much work.

FELIPE NO

I've never been to a "hardcore" Christian school, but at my Primary school we used to sing hymns and say the Lord's Prayer at assemblies. I'm not sure if I believed in god at that point; religion was just not important to me at that age so I didn't really think about it. It's possible that I had a half-hearted belief though, although I gradually came to the conclusion that there is no higher power.

Oddly enough, my second highschool was supposedly Christian but during assemblies there the vicar would ask us to pray but always said that if you didn't want to pray you should just keep silent for those who wanted to. I always just kept silent.

As such I've not really had belief enough to be shaken, but there are certain things that have happened not just in my life but in the world at large which more or less prove to me that there is no way god could exist. I also have a theory which someone will probably be able to dismember, but nonetheless: Sometimes when people take drugs they say they have religious and spiritual experiences, but this is merely an effect of purposeful chemical alteration in the brain. To me this clearly states that god was truly created in the heads of men.

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Originally Posted by Bernard Black

Sometimes when people take drugs they say they have religious and spiritual experiences, but this is merely an effect of purposeful chemical alteration in the brain. To me this clearly states that god was truly created in the heads of men.

Interesting perspective.

Do you think a person can have a "religious experience" or something like an enlightenment authentically when they trip or whatever?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Considering that there are actual religions that use (or have used) drugs in their rituals (sup Native Americans!)? Yeah. I'd say so.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by wvlfpvp

Considering that there are actual religions that use (or have used) drugs in their rituals (sup Native Americans!)? Yeah. I'd say so.

Yea, I'd say so too. But I'm curious because she came to the conclusion that god is a delusion in part because people have "religious experiences" sometimes when on drugs.

(Yay peyote~)

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

I personally don't think people do have "authentic" religious experiences, on drugs or otherwise. I just think it's partly to do with the way the human mind works (and partly to do with background and relatives/friends influence etc). I am biased though because I'm an atheist, and I don't begrudge anyone else their opinions or faith.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Bernard Black

Sometimes when people take drugs they say they have religious and spiritual experiences, but this is merely an effect of purposeful chemical alteration in the brain. To me this clearly states that god was truly created in the heads of men.

What would you say to someone who claims to have had an authentic religious experience when not on drugs? I know a bunch of people who have gone from being complete atheists to practicing Christians because of such things.

I guess my next question would be how does that apply to ancient religions, such as belief in the Roman, Norse, or Greek gods.

I do agree with you to a certain extent though, if not God himself (themselves) created in the heads of men, at least his image was. I'm just interested in your opinions cause i think the same way (sort of) even though i call myself a christian.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Bernard Black

I personally don't think people do have "authentic" religious experiences, on drugs or otherwise. I just think it's partly to do with the way the human mind works (and partly to do with background and relatives/friends influence etc). I am biased though because I'm an atheist, and I don't begrudge anyone else their opinions or faith.

I'm an atheist too, but I don't think every "religious experience" or anything related to the acknowledgment of a deity has to be null and void because it was induced by chemicals in the brain. Emotions are all in the brain too - does that mean they're not real, or that they're easily discounted?

Sometimes, awesome thoughts occur to a person. Sometimes, it changes them for the better. Sometimes, they regard these epiphanies as "religious," just in a sense of the word. "Religion" doesn't necessarily mean the acknowledgment of a deity - at least as far as I see it. To me, it means seeing a greater purpose and serving that purpose, in general.

I respect your opinion. I'm actually intrigued by it. Don't think I'm attacking you. =D

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

I'm still in a transition period deciding what I believe in. I haven't found an organized religion that I beleive in yet, and I doubt I will. I was raised lazy-Christian (did secular easter and christmas, but never went to church), so religion wasn't an important aspect of my upbringing. In high school I decided I was athiest because it was the cool hip thing to do, but I'm starting to re-think that now that I'm in college. What really turned me back to Christianity, or any sort of religion was taking an art history class. Learning about and seeing images of the cathedrals, tapestries, paintings, frescoes and stained glass windows really got me thinking about how people can be inspired to create things so spectacular and awesome because of their beliefs in a fictional character.

And I dunno, Believing that there's nothing out there and that we're alone in the world isn't very fun. I'm not hoping that there's life after death or an omnipotent deity watching over my every move, judging my actions, I'm just hoping that there's something cool an interesting that we're not seeing. So right now I tell people that I don't believe in a deity or messiah, but I believe in some kinda energy or power that balances everything out in the end. (I realized recently that that sounds a lot like the force, so I sometimes say I should just join the church of the Jedi :P)

And my beef with some atheists is that they're not realy atheists, they're just anti-christian. They go "OH YEAH, LIKE NOAH COULD BUILD AN ARK PSHHHH THAT'S NOT REAL" or "YEAH RIGHT JESUS CAME BACK HAHAHA WTF WORLD BUILT 7000 YEARS AGO??? THAT'S CRAZY. THERE IS NO GOD." I mean, come on. And I hate hate HATE HATE RAAAAGE HATE the kind of Atheist who tries to force their beliefs onto others. At the club fair last year, they had a table set up with a poster that said something like "believe in god? We'll prove you wrong!" It just disgusted me. They're just as bad as the guys who stand on boxes telling everyone homosexuality and women with short hair are going to hell and we all need to repent. (They appear often in the warmer months, it's kinda funny.)

FELIPE NO

Quote:

That's a really stupid reason to become an atheist.

Well, I went through a lot more before that and I just figured something would've happened if I didn't hit back. Nothing really did, so I lost belief.

Quote:

Are we really supposed to talk religion with a guy named "Poopsie"?

It's just a name.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Poopsie

Well, I went through a lot more before that and I just figured something would've happened if I didn't hit back. Nothing really did, so I lost belief.

What did you expect to happen if you didn't hit back? God to magically come down and put a gold star on your chest for the day?

Jam it back in, in the dark.