Drakengard 2

Anybody playing it? It's a little repetitive, yeah, but it's got an improve comboing system, a great story that ties into the original, and surprisingly strong voice acting. I'm hoping I'm not the only one playing the game.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I hope to get it very soon. It's out tomorrow i do believe. Well, that's the date on amazon for it. I'll probably wait for it to come down in price a bit because i've heard it isn't as good as the first one (even then, i bought the first one for £5...)

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I've heard people complain that it's mediocre, but I've never heard anyone say the first is better. Everything was pretty much improved over the original (except for ground combat, which was redone).

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Are you sure this game is even an RPG? I've been playing it for awhile, and it's totally an action/adventure game.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

A Drakengard 2 thread is one of the first I wanted to make when the forum came back up. Here's a copy and paste reply I worked on in advance.

Well, Drakengard 2 has been out since last week, along with Grandia III. No doubt the game is immediately overshadowed by that RPG, but I’m here to tell you not to count it out completely. During GFF’s downtime, I’ve been thoroughly playing this game, and have been enjoying it quite a bit.

The first game had unremarkable gameplay, an unapologetic Dynasty Warriors clone, but it won me over with its utterly twisted, unforgiving story. Themes of incest, child murder, suicide, and revenge driven insanity made up the darkest game SE ever cooked up. Drakengard became one of those games where I looked past the gameplay in favor of aesthetics (other examples include Xenosaga and Silent Hill). Needless to say, I was excited at the announcement of a sequel.

The premise won me over from the start, continuing the twisted fantasy theme from the start. I honestly can’t recall any other RPG where

Spoiler:

the main hero becomes the main villain, and the main villain the main heroine

There’s much more then that, but I’d hate to give it all away. If anyone stuck with the first game’s story, consider part 2 a reward. There’s a great deal of continuity and nods to the previous storyline, and practically all the characters either make a return appearance or at least referenced. Half the fun is seeing what everyone’s been doing the past 18 years. But given the source material, I won’t consider it a spoiler to tell you none of them have had a happy ending. I’m especially pleased the way they handled

Spoiler:

Caim, who looks exactly as I expected him to look 18 years later. Which is “completely fucked up”. He was an unstable psychopath before, but now he’s pretty much rejected humanity altogether. The eventual battle with Caim ranks up as my personal favorite moment in the game, with the cool setting and gorgeous music adding to the effect

Manah is another personal favorite, given the unique premise of the character, along with a cool design and moves. Hearing her story told in full is also interesting, begging the question on whether she deserves the punishments she’s endured after the first game (Caim may have spared her life, but he made sure things wouldn’t be easy for her from then on either).

As for the main lead, Nowe, I’m sure he’ll end up being the focal point of much love/hate debates. He is indeed somewhat whiny. His Manah lusting in particular dredges up memories of Xenogears’ Fei. Regardless, I consider Nowe to be a breath of fresh air after Drakengard’s gloomy “heroes”. He’s hopelessly sentimental and naïve, but these traits are clearly shown as flaws for the character. The beginning FMV on which he rides with his dragon, arms stretched outward as he embraces the sky around him shows you just what kind of character he is, one full of hope and innocence; someone very out of place in a game like this.

Speaking of the dragon, Legna remains my favorite new character in the series. His voice is very cool and he’s full of neat quotes (“I shall give them a light roasting.”), but the real highlight is his relationship with Nowe. Raising Nowe since birth, Legna and him have one of the most touching relationships I’ve ever seen in a game, one that truly captures the love of Father and Son, and is on par with the similar parent/child relationship with MOMO and Ziggy. In particular,

Spoiler:

the final boss battle for the first ending was a real tearjerker

Yes, Drakengard 2 is rated T, and things never get quite as insane as the first game (after acquiring the first game, I can confirm, at the moment, that this game remains “baby free”), but there’s still plenty of dark themes and moments present that push the rating pretty well. It even has an openly homosexual character that isn’t played for comic relief for a change. I do wish the enemy fights would have been gorier and featuring dismemberment on par with Berserk for PS2. It would’ve helped to lessen the tedium of the actual gameplay.

Yes, gameplay is still the same, slice and dice hundreds of enemies along with a few sky battles on your dragon. But it should be noted that some notable improvements have been made. Aside from the new attacks, switching characters has an actual purpose to it, as some characters are well equipped to handle certain enemies (Eris, for example, does major damage to undead enemies). The dragon has been given quite a bit of new moves as well, including more special attacks (the best being an attack that has Legna munching down on the enemies, gulps included). Boss fights are the most welcome addition, as they require actual strategy to them as well as being fun.

But make no mistake, it still plays about the same. There isn’t enough enemy variety, the camera still needs work, and things are still pretty repetitive in the end. But at least they’re improving, and there’s still some satisfaction in carving up thousands of bad guys at once during the more intense levels.

Voice Acting is quite good, and seem to be from the same group that dubbed Dragon Quest VIII (I’m almost certain that Yaha is played by Ishmari), and returning characters are all played by the VA’s in the first game (though it’s pretty amusing how one in particular now has a british accent), with the exception of Manah. I was really hoping Sherry Lynn would reprise the role, since she’s been known to do adult voices as well, but the new VA is decent enough. The best returning voice goes to

Spoiler:

Angelus, who really raises her octaves in this sequel. If you liked her work in the first game, you’ll love her blood curling screams of rage in this one

Music is much more coherent here too, although I was a big fan of the techniques used in the first game’s soundtrack. They took existing pieces of famous orchestras and looped it around to create a chaotic effect. It worked really well with the general insanity of the story. The second game still has some great works of music though, especially the opening theme and the later boss battles. I especially loved the rearrangements of Growing Wings, taking the same English lyrics from the last game. I’m very bummed that the new song isn’t available in the soundtrack, and I’m requesting that someone does a gamerip pronto.

So in the end, it’s still a meh game, but the story is still awesome stuff, to the point that I wish Drakengard was an anime or manga series instead (there simply aren’t enough dark anime stories out there). I’m a sucker for dark fantasy stories that pull no punches, so I continue to enjoy Drakengard’s narrative, even though the in-game cutscenes still need much work, as they either contain still pictures, or feature no mouth movements in the ones that do move. Regardless, I enjoyed the hell out of this game, and I really hope it does well enough to make a Drakengard 3. By the third game, they might just be able to craft a game that’s fun to play as well as a dark story.

I was speaking idiomatically.

I have the first one and I liked that, I want to get drakengard 2 but it's 39$ now and can't find it cheap on ebay either, I might have to wait a while for me to be able to find it for arround 20$ on ebay and then I'll get it.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by SOLDIER

-snip-

Everything you said, I second.

Drakengard 2 is a great sequel.
I still hold Drakengard 1 in higher regard, however. This is why:

-Menu selection of any verse (level / FMV / in-game story scene) in any chapter.
-Much darker storyline.
-5 endings instead of just 3.
-Soundtrack one of the most brilliantly insane I've ever heard from a game.

So, ultimately, I feel that:
D1 is a 10/10
D2 is a 9/10

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I second your second. Or uh, third your second. Point is, I aggree with your points on Drakengard 1. It bugged me that you couldn't replay missions or watch all the cutscenes. I still haven't seen the other 2 endings, so I don't know if they're extensions of the first ending, or alternate apocalyptic insanity like in the first game.

Like I said, the story sarcrifices a bit of the darker themes for coherence, but I consider it a good alternative, sort of an optimist's view of the events of the first game and its characters. I do hope that if future sequels occur, they'll always remain a certain dark level. This is about as close to a Silent Hill RPG (not really an RPG though) as we'll get.

Oh, and it should be noted that loading up a completed game and starting over in Hard Mode (though so far it's much easier, as my high level characters kill early enemies in a single blow) will add new cutscenes inbetween the existing ones. One in particular is already talked about, in which Eris recalls herself and Nowe in younger times, in which she tells him how she "became a woman". :eyebrow:

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Hey, good to see there are some people who talk about it.

I have to disagree about the soundtrack though, as I thought was superior to the original's. Drakengard has some pretty unusual stuff, but it really boiled down to being an unnerving clash of various instruments. Drakengard 2 trades off the clash for flow while remaining relatively unique for video game music. Breakthrough, for example-- we don't see enough super-fast tempo violin stuff in video games.

I also believe that the characters and plot have benefitted from the lack of morbidness. Characters are still very tragic (such as Urick or Caim), but it's not in an insane way where you feel bad for them yet still think "ooookay there, buddy". You genuinely feel bad and/or pity some of the characters for their struggles, and at least can comprehend their strife.

That didn't happen for me in the original. I could not, for example, feel bad for Leonard, a person who was extremely tragic, when he was blinded and pestered by a psychotic pixie. That just freaked me out.

Anyway, I'm definitely a big fan of Urick after playing through this. They did a fair amount with his character in the few chapters he was in.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Do the other playable character's in the game have dragons?

There's nowhere I can't reach.

No, and that's actually one of my gripes with the game.

If you're fighting as someone else and you want to hop on the dragon, you have to switch back to Nowe to do so. It's a minor inconvenience, but still an inconvenience.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Well it makes sense, as Legna made it very clear that Nowe is the only human he cares to be around.

I don't think you were ever supposed to symphasize with Drakengard 1's cast (Caim may have had a traumatic childhood, but he was still an unlikable asshole. Which, consequently, is why I liked him), but rather understand the circumstances of their torment. It's a terrible period to live in, so guys like Caim are actually the norm.

On that note, I was always confused by this one cutscene in the first game where Arioch is doing "something" to the corpse of a dead child, but you never see what it is, and the shocked reactions of the other characters don't help confirm things. So I read that the japanese version spelled it out clearer; she was eating the corpse. :eek:

I also heard that Leonard is actually a pedophile, which is why he secluded himself in the woods, but that sounds a bit far-fetched. He showed feelings for Seere, but that was most likely because he reminded him of his dead brother.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Wait a minute...I've been kinda been in a cave when it comes to Drakengard 2, and I've played Drakengard 1, so I have to ask...is Manah in this??!!!

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by midais

Wait a minute...I've been kinda been in a cave when it comes to Drakengard 2, and I've played Drakengard 1, so I have to ask...is Manah in this??!!!

Yes she is.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by SOLDIER

On that note, I was always confused by this one cutscene in the first game where Arioch is doing "something" to the corpse of a dead child, but you never see what it is, and the shocked reactions of the other characters don't help confirm things. So I read that the japanese version spelled it out clearer; she was eating the corpse. :eek:

I thought that was pretty clear in the US version. Didn't she constantly talk about her "hunger" or whatever?

I'm assuming her obsession was heightened due to her giving up her womb as a pact sacrifice. It's probably symbolic that she wanted a child in her, one way or another.

Plus, it's especially relevant/ironic in one of the extra endings:

Spoiler:

...where she gets devoured by the demon babies.

Drakengard brought an awesome philosophical scenario to the table in the idea of pact-sacrifices. In Drakengard 2, I was always on the look-out to find out who gave up what and how it related to their personality. Unfortunately, the pact-partnerships in D2 aren't as cool as in D1.

FELIPE NO

Quote:

I thought that was pretty clear in the US version. Didn't she constantly talk about her "hunger" or whatever?

Yeah she did, but it was still hard to tell what she was exactly doing in that scene (she could've killed a surviving child, or among other things). A fetus devouring cutscene like in Silent Hill 3 would've been a freakishly welcome addition.


I thought the sacrifices that the lieutenants gave up were pretty cool. The only one whose sacrifice wasn't revealed was

Spoiler:

Gismor, though the common belief is that he gave up his physical body.

I like how only Verdelet got the easy end in the pact; he sacrificed his hair. ><

How ya doing, buddy?

Wow, other Drakengard fans.

I love both games, but I do have to agree that the first was better. If only because it was so much darker. Sure Babygeddon was really creepy, and odd but the other endings were excellent. It's refreshing to play a game that doesn't turn out perfect in the end. Life usually doesn't work like that.

Can't say I'm a fan of Nowe either. He whined a bit too much for me, and he was far too quick to just betray the knights. Seemed strange for someone who had trained all that time and been raised by the former leader of the knights to so quickly turn on them.

Anyway, have a couple questions here. I'll put them in spoilers.

Spoiler:

What exactly did Gismor make a pact with?

Who are Nowe's real parents? A few people are saying it's Inuart and Furiae, but I just can't see that happening... It would mean that both of them survived since Nowe was born two years after the war.

Dragons created humans to defeat the gods (which I'm assuming are the Watchers)? Seems kind of silly since humans are so much weaker than dragons.

Does it ever say why Manah's mother hated her so much? I remember in the first game Seere talking about how their mother used to beat the crap out of Manah. Never said why though.

Why did Verdelet alter the seal? The history on Caim's sword mentions how that was a betrayal by Verdelet, and Caim killed him for it.

That's all for now^^'

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Spoiler:

I'm going to base my answers off of the first playthrough.

What exactly did Gismor make a pact with?
They don't exactly say, I'm guessing some sort of demon in exchange for his humanity/limbs.

Who are Nowe's real parents? A few people are saying it's Inuart and Furiae, but I just can't see that happening... It would mean that both of them survived since Nowe was born two years after the war.
Someone had an image from the official art book with Inuart, Furiae, and Legna standing behind a young Nowe. It is my belief that I+F are Nowe's parents, if not in a biological sense, then in a "Inuart put himself and Furiae's dead body into the bone casket/seed of resurrection and out came Nowe." I also believe that Legna is Inuart's black dragon from D1. If you look at the evolved form of Legna with the hook tail, it looks pretty much exactly like the black dragon.

Dragons created humans to defeat the gods (which I'm assuming are the Watchers)? Seems kind of silly since humans are so much weaker than dragons.
I think their plan was to use the "new breed" of human in combination with the Watcher's bone casket to create a creature (Nowe) that could destroy the gods.

Does it ever say why Manah's mother hated her so much? I remember in the first game Seere talking about how their mother used to beat the crap out of Manah. Never said why though.
I forget, let's just say Manah's mother hated little girls and leave it at that. That's what made Manah seek out the Watchers for companionship.

Why did Verdelet alter the seal? The history on Caim's sword mentions how that was a betrayal by Verdelet, and Caim killed him for it.
I'm assuming Verdelet was too naive about the painful sacrifice needed to keep the seals intact and the demon world out of our world.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Quote:

Spoiler:

Someone had an image from the official art book with Inuart, Furiae, and Legna standing behind a young Nowe. It is my belief that I+F are Nowe's parents, if not in a biological sense, then in a "Inuart put himself and Furiae's dead body into the bone casket/seed of resurrection and out came Nowe." I also believe that Legna is Inuart's black dragon from D1. If you look at the evolved form of Legna with the hook tail, it looks pretty much exactly like the black dragon.

Really? That's news to me. You have that image anywhere? It would make sense if those two were his parents, except that

Spoiler:

The woman mentioned in the sphere was "blind", but like someone in Gamefaqs said, the "blind" term doesn't neccesarily mean that she couldn't see, but perhaps that her eyes were closed on account of her being dead. It's a possibility.

Quote:

Spoiler:

Dragons created humans to defeat the gods (which I'm assuming are the Watchers)? Seems kind of silly since humans are so much weaker than dragons.

Spoiler:

It's true that Dragons created humans, but I don't think it was to fight the gods (I'd have to rewatch that part again). I know they created the new breed (Nowe) to fight the gods.

Quote:

Spoiler:

Does it ever say why Manah's mother hated her so much? I remember in the first game Seere talking about how their mother used to beat the crap out of Manah. Never said why though.

Spoiler:

It's never said why, only that she gave Seere all of her love and attention, while she used all her anger towards Manah. Even if Seere did something bad, Manah would be the one to accept his punishment. It's pretty odd, but maybe she just wasn't right in the head and split her personality between both her kids.

Quote:

Spoiler:

Why did Verdelet alter the seal? The history on Caim's sword mentions how that was a betrayal by Verdelet, and Caim killed him for it.

Spoiler:

He altered the seal so it would be harder to break. He was just taking a precaution to protect the earth, but this in turn caused greater pain towards the dragon. Being the only creature that he actually cared about, Caim wasn't happy about that.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Here ya go.

The image is called "Birth and Awakening."
IMAGE LINK, SPOILERS

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Very interesting. Maybe this will be revealed in the other two endings.

This only raises further questions though, what happened to them after the first game? I would've thought they implemented the scene from ending 3.

Spoiler:

where Caim prevents Inuart from resurrecting Furaie, and dies alongside her.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Spoiler:

Ending 3 from D1? D2 disregards all endings except for the first, remember. Those were just possible outcomes.

Did you pay attention during the Book of Seeds in the Dragon Tomb in D2? That's where it is mentioned that the Black Dragon led the "weak man" to use the bone casket to create the "new breed" with the "blind woman who held a forbidden love and gave herself to the gods". Or something along those lines.

Black Dragon = Inuart's Dragon = Legna
weak man = Inuart
blind woman = Furiae

Check some of the threads on the gamefaqs.com forum for this game, there they discuss the relationships between the characters.

Also, level up some of the D1 characters' weapons in D2 to see what happened to everyone during the 18 year break.

Awesome Drakengard 1 artwork here -> http://www.oritsuru.com/games/DoD/artwork.php

and here (you have to register for this one, though)
http://www.kawaiidream.net/categorie...8ad0&l=english

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

I know it follows ending A, I was just saying that they could've taken that one scene from ending C and add it to normal continuity.

Also,

Spoiler:

though they might be related, I'm certain Legna is not the same dragon that Inuart made a pact with in the first game. They look similar from afar, but up close there's quite a few differences

And I appreciate the D1 artwork, but I'm dying to find some scans from the D2artbook.

FELIPE NO

Spoiler:

Dragons change shape all the time, they evolve to fit the situation. Legna is regarded as a "blue" dragon in the beginning, but by the end, he is repeated mentioned to be a "black" dragon ("Show Angelus the power of the Black Dragon" or somesuch was a mission description). His hook tail looks JUST like a form of Inuart's dragon. http://www.rpgfan.com/pics/dod/art2.html

Come on, it's pretty obvious by now.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

But the thing is,

Spoiler:

If Inuart is dead, his dragon must be dead as well, since they're pact partners. Unless it turns out he's still alive...

Jam it back in, in the dark.