[Movie] The Dark Knight (Batman Begins Sequel)

Originally Posted by Living Legend

For the guy who quoted me above.

I am barely on this site at all, it's great to come and read topics with interesting and well thought out opinions. I think you're to wrapped up in a message board if you get so angry over something so small.

What I am saying is fair, I am not trying to find anything 'wrong' with the movie. I loved every minute of it and I am going to watch it again tonight. The little things I pointed out weren't 'bad' at all, just little things that I took notice of, such as batman's voice.

You're the one trying to pull negativity out of my comments for some reason.

No, I'm saying that if you're going to be critical, be critical in an intelligent or at least informed way. The any number of people could have done it argument? What the hell? Useless.

I'm not angry with you, I just think you have an incredibly idiotic approach to what you're doing. Just because it's the internet doesn't mean you have to be completely without intellect in what you do. Just think about your argument concerning how people shouldn't praise Heath Ledger because MAYBE someone else could have done as good a job. If you really think that holds water, maybe you should spend even less time here than you already do.

Consider coming back never if you can't see what's wrong with the logic there.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

On the topic of Batman's voice, I think it's perfect. Voice is the one thing that superheroes in movies don't disguise, but Bale nailed it by doing so. Do you honestly believe that people who don't know Peter Parker wouldn't recognize his voice if they ran into Spider Man on the street? Bale goes the extra mile to fully disguise himself, AND hammers the point of Batman home - To instill fear in his enemies.

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Originally Posted by Sewer Overflow

Bale goes the extra mile to fully disguise himself, AND hammers the point of Batman home - To instill fear in his enemies.

Perhaps an unfair comparison but as damn good an actor as Bale is, its still not Kevin Conroy. Two entirely different mediums and approaches but a number of Bale's lines in Batman Begins (especially "WHEAR HAR THA DRUGS?!") didn't come off as ... cleanly as Conroy does it.

Then again, Conroy has been at it for ten years and actually has gone so far to literally dissect Bruce Wayne into Hamlet.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by LeHah

Then again, Conroy has been at it for ten years and actually has gone so far to literally dissect Bruce Wayne into Hamlet.

I think you nailed the biggest reason right there. This guy has had a lot of practice with this, and a lot of time to immerse himself in the role.

Though even early in TAS, he was ridiculously good. So he might just be some sort of voice acting freak.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Beard Overflow

I think you nailed the biggest reason right there.

I think the other reason is that Conroy is a theater actor. Aside from doing some small bit parts and a TV show, everything else is Shakespeare and the like.

Similarly, this is why we like Ewan McGreggor and Hugh Jackman and Bob Peck. Theres something to be said about that particular kind of training.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by LeHah

I think the other reason is that Conroy is a theater actor. Aside from doing some small bit parts and a TV show, everything else is Shakespeare and the like.

Similarly, this is why we like Ewan McGreggor and Hugh Jackman and Bob Peck. Theres something to be said about that particular kind of training.

Agreed. Entirely. They bring a certain depth to it.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Beard Overflow

No, I'm saying that if you're going to be critical, be critical in an intelligent or at least informed way. The any number of people could have done it argument? What the hell? Useless.

I'm not angry with you, I just think you have an incredibly idiotic approach to what you're doing. Just because it's the internet doesn't mean you have to be completely without intellect in what you do. Just think about your argument concerning how people shouldn't praise Heath Ledger because MAYBE someone else could have done as good a job. If you really think that holds water, maybe you should spend even less time here than you already do.

Consider coming back never if you can't see what's wrong with the logic there.

I'm not saying people shouldn't praise Heath Ledger, I am saying he did a good job. I think because of his death, he's going to overshadow how well the other actors were.

Whatever else I said is strictly opinion, yes he was badass and cool, but not something I fell in 'awe' of. I'm not even trying to argue, you picked apart what I said and told me 'it's wrong'.

Not trying to be an asshole, but you need to lighten up a little bit.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Living Legend

I'm not saying people shouldn't praise Heath Ledger, I am saying he did a good job. I think because of his death, he's going to overshadow how well the other actors were.

Whatever else I said is strictly opinion, yes he was badass and cool, but not something I fell in 'awe' of. I'm not even trying to argue, you picked apart what I said and told me 'it's wrong'.

Not trying to be an asshole, but you need to lighten up a little bit.

No, that's not what you said. Or at least you didn't do a very good job conveying that meaning. If you'd said that, I wouldn't have argued. Of course his death is going to be a major point of interest for people. And of course it's going to overshadow aspects of his performance and that of others.

What you said was that a lot of other people could have done as good a job, and insinuated that his abilities were somehow overestimated here. So either you're not doing a very good job of getting your point across or you're backpeddling because you clearly didn't know what you were talking about.

Not trying to be an asshole, but just because you have an opinion doesn't mean people won't dissect it when it's clearly flawed.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Just saw the movie 30 mins ago. And I am still in a daze from how good it was. The acting from the entire cast (thank god Rachael is now played by Maggie Gyllenhaal) was excellant, visual effects and stunts were mind blowing and the tension keeps escalating as the story goes on. The soundtrack also was fantastic and I was glad I refrained from downloading the leaked version before I see it, it was very effective in the movie. And the ending leaves open for a sequel like Batman Begins did.

And I hope a 3rd one does get filmed.

The only qualms I had was that the movie was a little long, which I think they could have cut some some mins from a car chase sequence in the middle.

And I swear to God, Joker's theme is like something out of Silent Hill. Creepiest character theme I have heard so far.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Living Legend

Not trying to be an asshole, but you need to lighten up a little bit.

You realize what you just said is "I'm not an asshole but I'm going to act like it anyway."

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

I wasn't trying to attack the person, I just don't think the responses should have been carried out the way they were.

Since the movie is being shown in theaters today, it's going to be great hearing what many people have to say about it. I can't imagine much negativity, but if people don't like it, it's going to be interesting to hear their views.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Living Legend

I wasn't trying to attack the person, I just don't think the responses should have been carried out the way they were.

A nickle's worth of free advice - stop talking for a while.

Review:

The problem with The Dark Knight is the exact same problem with V For Vendetta - hand-holding. Both movies set up specific push-button pins to be knocked down at the conveience of the writer and not the story. "Show, don't tell" Mark Twain famously said and The Dark Knight breaks that rule many times over.

Its greatest fault is exposition. The first scene is a set-up, not for character but for character *naming*. By name, the Joker is mentioned several times over in the most blatantly awful way possible: several of his cronies rob a bank with dialouge in the following...

ROBBER #1: Boy, whats up with that clown looking guy that hired us?

ROBBER #2: The Joker? That make-up scares me!

ROBBER #3: Yeah, I hear he paints his face and his hair is green!

ROBBER #4: (Other room) Boy, I better not fuck with my boss, the Joker!

There is no need to know why these people work for him - they're wearing clown masks as they rob the bank. We get the connection before a word is spoken. One mention would have done, even an insinuation - not enough expository detail to make a police sketch out of.

However, the exposition of character motivation is even worse. Instead of leaving moral judgements to the audience to interperet, we're brow-beaten with huge, long scenes of talking as characters discuss things like crime, the nature of chaos and mythos with the same dry, literal sense of a Jane Austin novel. The last scene in the movie involves Batman being chased out of a Gotham building, through the city streets and into the "daylight" above. As far as symbolism goes, thats on the level of Superman / Jesus or Hal 9000 / Humanity. But then add to it a huge, long voice over by Jim Gordon, explaining to the audience the great sacrifices made by Batman to uphold a greater ideal of justice and personal commitment.

Another astonishing idiotic twist that was pulled out of the hat pretty frequently was the long winded "character motivation" essay. I assume Nolan realized too late that no one was doing anything with all this jumping around and fighting police officers, so instead of leaving the audience to think for themselves on any moral subject, he decided what you should think. To again quote Twain, this time about James Fennimore Cooper's novels - "Every time a Cooper person is in peril, and absolute silence is worth four dollars a minute, he is sure to step on a dry twig. There may be a hundred other handier things to step on, but that wouldn't satisfy Cooper. Cooper requires him to turn out and find a dry twig; and if he can't do it, go and borrow one." Nolan creates similar problems by attempting bad comedy through worse Greek Theater. BATMAN MUST MAKE A CHOICE IN A DEADLY GAME OF CAT AND MOUSE - WHICH PERSON WILL HE SAVE? Of course he saves the obvious one because that sets up the second half of the movie! Leave no stone unturned, eh Mr Nolan?

The shining example of this is the scene where Gordon is shot dead, brought back and then Batman's girlfriend is killed. You don't jerk your audience around like that; you can't kill someone, bring THEM back and then actually kill someone else. Thats BAD writing and creates a giant hole in terms of pacing. Stop fucking with your plot developments, Nolan.

Heath Ledger's performance is amazingly bland. I should note I never found him much of an actor but the talk about his role in this movie is beyond overblown. Half of it is his fault - theres no sense of character motivation nor is there any exposition toward such (though I'll give them credit for avoiding any origin explaination), so now we have this "crazy" running over half the movie.

Yes, the Joker introduces himself as "an agent of chaos". For a guy who's suppose to be chaotic, you sure do have a lot of elaborate set-ups. Isn't that contradictory? More over, it makes less sense since its never bothered to establish WHY hes this way. So we're left blowing in the breeze. More over, every set-up the Joker does is something I've seen already. Calling a pager to set off a bomb has been done how many times? Using knives to make repeated copycat attacks is from how many other movies? For someone that everyone talks about with the same breath as Academy Award, the character carries absolutely nothing at any point in the movie.

I enjoyed Batman Begins immensely, but this movie is a fucking awful mess made to pander first year college students between drinking games.

I was speaking idiomatically.

I just got back. I thought this was great all around. Seriously perfect acting. Heath WILL win that Oscar.

However, honestly I was disappointed a bit. I was just expecting more I guess and waiting for a climatic point, and IMO it didn't happen for me.

This is coming from a huge Batman fan. I've probably watched Begins more than anyone on this site. I WENT ALONE tonight to go see the film so I could have no distractions. I even listened to the score ALL week.

All that, it was a great movie.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Andrew Evenstar

I just got back. I thought this was great all around. Seriously perfect acting. Heath WILL win that Oscar.

Originally Posted by Rotorblade

Stupid people, who else?

Keep dreaming, kids.

FELIPE NO

I always thought we would end up with a brokeback / bareback joker but after seeing all the TV ad's and watching X ammount of minutes into the movie I can clearly see I was wrong.


The whole Heath drug overdose /death may or may not over shadow every one elses acting, lets hope not because they all were good!!

I still think Jack Nicholson was a better joker but Heath did fit the role of a more sinister joker...

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Denicalis

Keep dreaming, kids.

Yeah, what was the last Oscar given to a dead actor? Peter Finch for Network? Trying to compare Finch's broken-down newsanchor with what I saw last night isn't fair to Finch.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I am thinking this movie will be close to one of the highest-grossing films in Australian history after all the coverage this is getting here. It's all about Heath, how it's unfair that he'll won't be alive for his Oscar win and other such nonsense. It's pretty pathetic, but I did enjoy the film. Not as much Batman character development this time around, probably done deliberately as that was the main focus of the first movie, but it still would have been nice.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Just saw the movie, I seriously didn't know what to say. Fantastic? I felt Christian Bale did a good job, and Heath Ledger was pretty creepy as Joker. I felt the dude that played Harvey Dent was good too. I'm impressed, and very entertained.

I'll probably going for a second round soon.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

$18.5 million for midnight showings ALONE

Yeah, this is gonna whip Spidey 3's ass.

Also, I loved it... Full review coming eventually.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

It was a fantastic movie. It exceeded my expectations, and it topped Batman Begins by miles. Ledger was great too, he definitely got into the role of The Joker, and didnt make it comic booky at all, and the same goes with everyone and everything about this film. To me, that's what makes it great..it has this realism factor, so you feel like this could happen.


Plus

Spoiler:

Who didn't love the 'white eyes' with Batman.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Karasu

Spoiler:

Who didn't love the 'white eyes' with Batman.

Me. Saw that gimick before in Batman Forever.

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They did that in Forever? I must be suppressing the traumatic memories of watching it.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by AniMechanic

They did that in Forever? I must be suppressing the traumatic memories of watching it.

The part where he destroys the Riddler's stupid TV gizmo at the end of the movie.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Ugh. I just remember everything being neon green and purple, Tommy Lee Jones chewing scenery, and the inclusion of Robin. Just remembering that much hurts my brain. Man I am glad I never saw Batman and Robin.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I'm super looking forward to watching this movie soon. And not just for the Heath Ledger hype, but I just love these sort of dark, brooding films!

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