Welcome to Canada - ZAP!

http://www.cbc.ca/mrl3/8752/bc/ondem...TASERVIDEO.wmv

Dunno if many of you have heard of this - pretty sad times for our Mounties, all the scandals, and now this. What the hell were those four (4!) guys thinking? They didn't give him a minute before they fucking tazed him.

Man died after 4 Taser jolts, witness alleges (This is a news link, above is the video)

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Locke

http://www.cbc.ca/mrl3/8752/bc/ondem...TASERVIDEO.wmv

Dunno if many of you have heard of this - pretty sad times for our Mounties, all the scandals, and now this. What the hell were those four (4!) guys thinking? They didn't give him a minute before they fucking tazed him.

Man died after 4 Taser jolts, witness alleges (This is a news link, above is the video)

He died? Is this confirmed?

It's an awful pity. The poor guy seemed like he was really upset - if only they had gotten an interpreter in there before they sent in the troops. Yes, he was destroying some computer or something, but really - he seemed REALLY upset, and no one knew WHY it seems.

And then he DIED? From being tazered??

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Yeah, I just saw that on the news an hour ago. I think that's an awful thing, and the people responsible should be held accountable for it, as tasing him four times was excessive and they should have know it could potentially be fatal. That's why they are trained to use those instruments, to prevent this kind of thing.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by Sassafrass

And then he DIED? From being tazered??

This is actually the 16th person in Canada to die from being tasered since 2003, and about 50 deaths have been attributed to tasers in the United States. I still think they're a good tool for law enforcement, but they do kill on occasion.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

This happened nearish to my hometown, so its been all over the news. Obviously the distraught Polish man was causing a disturbance, but the Police should have tried alternative methods before tasering him, 4 times in succession. Clearly the police force around here is not responsible enough to possess tasers.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by knkwzrd

This is actually the 16th person in Canada to die from being tasered since 2003, and about 50 deaths have been attributed to tasers in the United States. I still think they're a good tool for law enforcement, but they do kill on occasion.

This [link] looks like it could be an adequate non-lethal replacement, as long as it is not based on the kind of laser that permanently blinds you.

Anyway, this was something that I was wondering, but was the guy having some sort of seizure? the way he was running around before he was tasered leads me to believe it's more then him being pissed from lack of communication.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by knkwzrd

This is actually the 16th person in Canada to die from being tasered since 2003, and about 50 deaths have been attributed to tasers in the United States. I still think they're a good tool for law enforcement, but they do kill on occasion.

Huh. I never hear about it. I'm glad you said something about it~

This situation could have certainly been dealt with in another, less HOSTILE and ALARMIST fashion. I hope those cops are held accountable for that shit.

How ya doing, buddy?

@pokey:

The guy had just arrived from Poland and apparently couldn't understand english. This occured after he'd been held at the airport for 10 hours. From what I've seen so far, his mother was supposed to have went to the airport to pick him up and had been told he never arrived and so she went back home. I can only imagine the shock she suffered when she learned the truth.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Quote:

The guy had just arrived from Poland and apparently couldn't understand english. This occured after he'd been held at the airport for 10 hours. From what I've seen so far, his mother was supposed to have went to the airport to pick him up and had been told he never arrived and so she went back home. I can only imagine the shock she suffered when she learned the truth.

Jesus, I would go fucking mad too. 10 hours? So, did this guy go up to people and try to at least signal that he was lost, or make the point that he needed a translator? I don't see how in that much time no help could be found whatsoever.

Most amazing jew boots

Fuck that. Imagine the mother grieving. Saved just to see her son and the son just goin' to die? Massive heartbreak.

Incompetence, I tell you.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

That's why I am glad that I know some basic English vocabulary

Most amazing jew boots

The guy wasn't "held" at the airport. He STAYED at the airport for 10 hours. And several people attempted to try and communicate with him, but he was frenzied. Now, should the police have gotten an interpreter first? Hells yes. The RC's here were bloody stupid. But, it's not like this guy was just hanging out. He was aggressive, stand offish, refusing to let anyone near him. He threw chairs, destroyed property, and thoroughly did everything possible to make himself seem like a threat. Should he have been tased? I don't know, I'm not up on standard police procedure for the RC's. If they were within SOP, I don't think they should be strung up for it. Now, if they stepped outside their boundaries with this, by all means, lynch the fuckers. But do remember they used what is, far more often than not, non lethal force.

That being said, SOMEONE in this city had to speak bloody Polish.

Most amazing jew boots

Originally Posted by Sassafrass

And then he DIED? From being tazered??

Hundreds of thousands of volts coursing through your body.

Sounds like fun.

I was speaking idiomatically.

I've been listening to this incident quite a lot on CBC radio over the last few days. It is sad that it had to come to this. I don't think a tazer should of been used.

It is true that the man became agitated due to the amount of time he was at the airport and he was destroying property that there were some spectators that tried to communicate with him, but the police absolutely went too far in trying to detain this man in my opinion, but I don't think its necessarily all of the police officers fault. I remember during the interview the person that had filmed the incident heard one of the officers ask his superior if he could use the tazer. He also witnessed one of the officers press his knee against the back of the victims neck.

The first though that hit in my mind, is why did it have to come to a tazer being used, four officers were at the scene and it should of been more than enough people to bring the man under control. I also remember during the interview on cbc radio, that the security personnel at the airport informed the police officers as they arrived that the man could not understand any english but still no attempt was made to get an interpretator. It should of been fairly easy to find one being at an international airport and all. The incident seemed it was the result of people quickly judging and acting in an unprofessional manner.

I know because of this incident the Royal Newfoundland Constabulary in my home province has delayed a tender to bring tazers into their police force due to recent deaths concerning a tazer being used.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Angel, you should do your homework. The knee on the back, or the back of the neck is standard operating procedure. They'd have done that to him even if they took him down physically. It's how you detain someone, especially when they're violent and agitated.

Also, four people or not, if he was stoned out of his gourd on something, possibly PCP or Meth, four people aren't going to do the trick. People are going to get hurt. That's why they used the tazer.

Quickly judging? Yeah, that dude who threw chairs at people who came near him. Definitely a calm, cool guy to be rationalized with.

FELIPE NO

It seems that the Polish government has, as anyone probably could have predicted, wasted no time in putting pressing on the canadian governement to put those responsible for the man's death "named and prosecuted". The debate over this incident is most certainly gonna be a long one in the media, IMO.

Here's a little linky: Taser officers should be prosecuted: Polish official

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Whatever happened to good old fashioned pepper spray?

"DON'T TAZE ME, BRO!"

Jam it back in, in the dark.

They said that they couldn't use it because there were too many people around and that it might be harmful to them. Also, there was a danger that it might go into the ventilation system. Now, wether that is as bad as a man dying, I'm not so sure, but I guess they didn't really predict it would happen (I sure hope not anyhow).

Also, pepper spray can be fatal if it used excessively, just as a taser can be.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Dark Nation

Whatever happened to good old fashioned pepper spray?

"DON'T TAZE ME, BRO!"

They were saying that they didn't want to use pepper spray because it may bother the other people around them. They also refrained from using their batons because of what it would look like int eh public eye

Additional Spam:
Personally I feel as if a lot of the coverage on this situation has been extremely biased with the "omg ban tazers" business. You hardly, if ever, see things on the news about how tazers helped save lives, it never looks pretty.

The guy was clearly in hysterics, so using four police officers is a very viable option. Te reason you usually see officers "gang" up on someone, is simply to prevent injuries, to the officers and the individual.

Clearly they were rather hasty with the tazering though, probably better to get an interpreter first.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

So they swapped out Potentially-lethal-weapon-A for Potentially-lethal-weapon-B =\

What about Bean-Bag-Bullet Handguns? Non-lethal and to my knoweldge, they haven't killed anyone.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Dark Nation

So they swapped out Potentially-lethal-weapon-A for Potentially-lethal-weapon-B =\

What about Bean-Bag-Bullet Handguns? Non-lethal and to my knoweldge, they haven't killed anyone.

I'm guessing it's an availability issue, I'm sure those aren't as readily available as a taser. Also it seems like the image of a firearm being pointed at someone by a police officer in the public eye wouldn't go over very well as compared to a taser.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Greykin

I'm guessing it's an availability issue, I'm sure those aren't as readily available as a taser. Also it seems like the image of a firearm being pointed at someone by a police officer in the public eye wouldn't go over very well as compared to a taser.

Well if you make the gun stand out too much, it could be mistaken for a toy gun or something, but if you make it too similar to a firearm, well that's obviously going to not go over well either.

My suggestion would be to equip all officers with a normal .9mm Firearm and a secondary Bean-Bag-Bullet Handgun which is Painted with Reflective Yellow Stripes to distinguish it from a normal handgun.
Maybe make the gun a bit bulkier too.

Example of what I mean by the stripes:


--Edit--
Also, a public awareness campaign might also help for getting enough of them out to the field.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

I thought police protocol on tasers was "use only in place of a bullet". :/

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Greykin

I'm guessing it's an availability issue, I'm sure those aren't as readily available as a taser. Also it seems like the image of a firearm being pointed at someone by a police officer in the public eye wouldn't go over very well as compared to a taser.

Supply and demand regulate the market.

If they wanted to use something less lethal, they could.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

My view will probably be different because I have family in the military and police force, but I see nothing wrong with what was done.

First the language issue. Our official languages are English and French, thats it, that is all we are required to provide service in. People are saying we should have brought in an interpreter to help, but are we suppose to have an official police interpreter for every language at every airport? be more realistic.

Second, the 10 hour wait. While this fault falls on several parties, it was no single persons fault. It was miscommunication or something, but even his mother is partially at fault.

As for his actions, no matter what they were not justified. If I traveled to a country that had no support for my language, I know it's going to take awhile. Sure, after 10 hours I would be very agitated, but I know that throwing a temper tantrum , destroying property while shouting in a language they don't understand is NOT going to help, and would fully expect the police to show up and take me down.

Lastly, the Taser. Too damn bad is what I am going say. He was out of line... If he was some 10 year old I could understand, but he was 40. A rational adult should be smart enough to figure out when someone is trying to tell them to calm down, even in a different language, by simply reading their body signs. What he was doing not only damaged property that wasn't his, but it was putting others in danger. People tried to calm him down to no avail. So the police walked in and took him down in a manner that minimizes injury to innocent civilians, and to themselves. Sure, the 4 officers could have used brute physical force to take this guy down, but there would have been a few issues with that.

1. Others around might have gotten hurt

2. The officers didn't know if he was or was not under the influence of some drug, perhaps one with muscle/adrenaline enhancing properties that may also surpress pain. What then? What if they had to beat him down real hard since he couldn't feel anything just to prevent his fit of rage? Then we'd be sitting here discussing "well they should have jabbed when they punched instead, that's police brutality for you, beating him until he couldn't move". which leads to...

3. Using physical force might result in permanent damage, where as a taser is typically not. If any physical damage were to result, you know full well a lawsuit would be in the works.

4. The police have the right to protect themselves, they have families and friends just like the rest of us. If some had it their way, police would not be allowed to use ANY means to take down offenders. It's almost like people expect them to throw themselves on top of offenders wielding uzi's, while of course wearing soft padded pillows as to not hurt the criminal.

It was an unfortunate situation, but it happens. The man went out of line, and the standard taser did more harm than it was suppose to, perhaps due to a heart problem, or increased stress levels etc..., it doesn't matter. I am sure it would be a different story if some unknown person started trashing your house, while shouting in a language you can't understand, you wouldn't sit there for over an hour trying to calm him down with words. What would you do if he throws something that hit your wife/child/husband etc.. and seriously injured them?

Amazing how *noble* people are until they are faced with the situation.

Jam it back in, in the dark.