[General Discussion] Suikoden Club v7!

I dont think they are lacking...we are just giving them high expectations because of how much we have overrated 1 and 2. I picked up 1 because I had 20$ to spare about 7 years ago and loved it. Shortly after...II came out and I figured what the hell...I will give it a shot and loved it also. Eventually because the game was somewhat simple in graphics (compared to other hit rpgs at the time ..FF8, Legend of Dragoon..lol and Star Ocean II) but the story and gameplay mechanics made it great. We had a long wait from II to III so we played II again and made it almost immortal in our minds. III was a great game (Id go on record and say it was better then FFX) and the cartoon graphics fit the game in my opinion.

Suikoden has only had a few games out but because of how well perceived I and II are...when a new Suikoden game comes out...we tend to hold Suikoden II up on a pedastal and compare it to the game coming out. Now...I admit IV did simply suck...but I think Tactics managed to provide a pick me up for the series.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Ok fellow Suikoden Clubbers, Suikoden V is upon us. In honor of it's release, I am proposing another Suikoden Week(the first one went over pretty well, yet the second one never even took off). Suikoden avs and sigs and spreading much Suikoden love around the boards. Anyone up for it? Or are all of you going to ignore it again this year?

I was speaking idiomatically.

I'm not the biggest supporter of V, but I'd do it.

I've already got my av/sig combo.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Well, with the improved features over the lackluster IV. This game has to be really good. Because you certainly can't go wrong with that 6 man/woman party. And that like with FFX, you can switch out the characters and bring the benched characters into attack. Making a total of a 10 active party member combat.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by RunemasterJeane

Ok fellow Suikoden Clubbers, Suikoden V is upon us. In honor of it's release, I am proposing another Suikoden Week(the first one went over pretty well, yet the second one never even took off). Suikoden avs and sigs and spreading much Suikoden love around the boards. Anyone up for it? Or are all of you going to ignore it again this year?

I'll do it, despite the release date for V over here not being for about six months...

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

A Suikoden week, eh? Okay then, here's my Suikoden II set, I'll celebrate the chance for me to order V tomorrow

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I need to find me a suikoden avatar...and a sig too.

I got the game today along with a fancy little Limited Edition Suikoden V artwork cell. Its not too shabby although I would of preferred a NICE artbook (IV's sucked). Its pretty funny really because I went to pick it up yesterday but i didnt have it preordered. Gamecrazy didnt have it yet but he said I could pay for it now and hed call me when it comes in. So I did, so that was considered a pre-order so I got the cell.

I havent played or read about the game too much. Is...the prince (main hero) supposed to be a guy? Because if he is...thats the girliest looking guy ever.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I just played it for about 6 hours today, and I'm happy to say Suikoden is back. I really hated the fourth game. Even though I love the series, Suikoden 4 is one of the worst games I've ever played. Most of that probably due to the fact that I was expecting a game as good as the first three.

Luckily the fifith is great. It feels just like the first two games in the series, and I couldn't be happier. Massive political backstabbings building up to a huge war. The way it's supposed to be. I'm so happy I could cry. My favorite series returns to its former glory T.T

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Ok fellow Suikoden Clubbers, Suikoden V is upon us. In honor of it's release, I am proposing another Suikoden Week(the first one went over pretty well, yet the second one never even took off). Suikoden avs and sigs and spreading much Suikoden love around the boards. Anyone up for it? Or are all of you going to ignore it again this year?

If I had a av/sig combo I'd definitely join in. Actually, I should have the av. I'll make it in a bit.

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I got the game today along with a fancy little Limited Edition Suikoden V artwork cell.

I got an artbook and a music CD as a preorder bonus.

Most amazing jew boots

I admit it, I've lapsed considerably in my love of the Suikoden series. I simply couldn't stand the change from 2d to the 3d that they employed in the PS2 games. It didn't help that they screwed with the battle system and the classic music that was present in parts I and II. However, I just read the IGN review and they made it very clear that V returns to the roots of the series, big time. This will be the first Suikoden game I have purchased since II.

I'm still concerned about the soundtrack, and I don't feel that any Suikoden game can be truly Suikoden without the presence of Ms. Higashino.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

I'll be getting the game soon, but I first want to finish the new Shadow Hearts (which I've only just started), I'm really anticipating this one.

In other news, I recently finished Suikoden Tactics, and I've taken the liberty to review it:

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I’ve been interested in the Suikoden Series since the third game, and after tracking down the first two, it has quickly grown to become one of my favourite RPG series. Unfortunately, IV was a disgrace in comparison to its predecessors, and for a moment, I feared that this would be the start of the decline of the Suikoden world. Now that Suikoden Tactics, the first strategy RPG set in the Suikoden Universe, has been released, it looks like there are steps being taken towards the old glory and epic view that I loved in the first games. It’s already a huge improvement when you compare it to IV, but alas, there are still some flaws to be found. Please note that this review will contain inevitable spoilers for its predecessor.

The story is a direct sequel to Suikoden IV. The Island Nations have declared their independence, and Fort El-Eal has been destroyed, together with the Giant Tree, one of Kooluk’s symbols of power. Now, a group of adventurers from the Scarlet Moon Empire is investigating the Rune Cannons and their main power source, an entity from another world called the Evil Eye. It’s not for too long that they discover that the Kooluk Empire is making manoeuvres again, and gathering the remaining Rune Cannons for a mysterious purpose.

Suikoden Tactics’ story is surely a step up from the one we had in IV. From the first hour or so, it already managed to captivate me more than its prequel. The game starts out with a flashback, which teaches you the characters motivation to search for the rune cannons, and from the scenes following that, you get an epic feeling that IV was lacking. The few naval battle scenes that the game has look a lot better than the boring strategic battles. The story also concludes the start that IV made, by giving an answer to some of the unresolved connections between certain characters, and even better, it gives us a lot more insight in the Kooluk Empire. Despite being the main enemy in IV, you barely get to see a glimpse of its motivations, and you don’t know who’s pulling strings behind the scenes. Tactics manages to give more insight in this, and it provided me with a satisfying conclusion.

Unfortunately, the story has its flaws. For one, some of the plot lines are too predictable, and feel forced. It’s clear that Tactics’ story was thought up after IV had already been released, and they had no choice to force a few changes through. The biggest problem I had was the Evil Eye. You know where it’s coming from, what it can do, but there’s still something lacking. I personally would have found it much more interesting if the Rune Cannons drew their power from a True Rune, which would make Tactics important in comparison to the other Suikoden games. Now it feels like nothing major has been accomplished, and the story is overly insignificant in the Suikoden universe. It is nice to see a glimpse of the higher forces that are controlling the world, as was hinted in IV before.

The three main characters, Kyril, Andarc and Seneca get more than enough screenplay and are developed pretty well, and some of the other major story characters (Kika, Simeon, Corselia), also get more than enough light shed upon. A great feature is the rest option when you enter the caravan, where you can see various interactions between the members of your group, which gives you more insight in their relations. You’ll also see some familiar faces, not only from IV, but also from other Suikoden games, like Jeane, the mysterious runemaster.

A problem is that most of the character development happens before you actually recruit them, after which they are hardly shown at all. Take Kika for example, she has a rather big role in the flashback in the beginning, and in the first hours of the actual game, but afterwards, she only makes one or two insignificant appearances. This is the understandable nature of strategy games, something that also bothered me in Final Fantasy Tactics, but I guess it can’t be helped.

As for graphic, it’s obvious that not much time and money was spend on this, which is the main complaint that people will have. Personally, I really like it. While you can’t actually walk around cities or fields, you are presented with some nice artwork, which will be familiar to those who played IV. Battle Maps also look great, although it would be nice if they were a had a more complex design, since they are pretty straightforward now. Character animations look awesome, in my opinion. They are not too detailed, but they move fluid, and look nice with overall bright colours. I generally don’t care about the graphics, so it really doesn’t bother me that much that there isn’t as much detail as most gamers would expect.

The only minor disappointment is the character artwork for Kyril and Andarc, which makes them look incredibly dull, and the spell animations, which have been imported straight from IV, and don’t really have the majestic feeling that was shown in II or III. I doubt that we’ll ever see CG used for spell effects, like it was in II, in a next Suikoden instalment.

As for music, there isn’t much variety in the chosen tracks. Most of the tunes are pleasant, and some of them even remind me of FF Tactics battle themes. There is one theme in particular, that plays during sad scenes or during resting that I really like, and it reminds me of the old favourites from the Playstation Suikoden games. I wish I could say the same from the main opening theme, but it’s just not as good as Transcending Love (III) or La Mer (IV).

Voices are a mixed bag for this one. While most of the characters have decent voices, there are some moments in the game where they can sound incredibly dull. This is not to say that they are bad, in fact, Kyril’s voice actor does an excellent job in some particular scenes, but the quality isn’t consistent. There have also been changes, Lino El Kundes, the king of Obel has a new voice, which I don’t understand since the one in IV was perfect for the job, and one of the better voices in the game.

The gameplay is the biggest factor that can make or break a game. The first steps that Suikoden takes in the tactical RPG genre are done pretty well. While the system is not as complex as Final Fantasy Tactics, you still need to carefully plan your manoeuvres. One of the main factors that can decide the outcome of a battle is the terrain element. Each character has a specific element (thunder, fire, water, wind or earth), and when they step on a tile with that element, they recover health, and their stats improve. But if they step on a tile of the opposite element, their stats decrease and take damage. The game gives you items that let you change the terrain elements, but the enemy can also change this. The best tactic in battle is to set up a good terrain defence, but keep in mind that the enemy will do the same.

Aside from that, it’s a nice combination of traditional Suikoden gameplay elements, like the use of Runes, each with four different levels of spells, blacksmithing to improve your weapons, and typical Tactical RPG elements, doing more damage from behind, limited move range, etc. The overall battle system is enjoyable, challenging for some specific battles and easy to learn. I don’t see a lot of flaws, except for character deaths. Characters that play an important role in the story don’t die when their health hits zero, but they withdraw. Characters that don’t have a significant role and can be recruited optionally, will only rarely withdraw, instead they’ll die for good. This can be incredibly frustrating later on in the game, when you’ve spent hours powering up a character, only to have them die in a few seconds. This is the main reason that I often have to restart battles, and it made me throw around the controller in frustration.

Aside from the battle system, the main gameplay comes from the quest guild. You start out with some easy fetch quests, but as you do more quests, your rank increases and you get harder missions. The common reward for a completed quest is money and skill points, used to activate skills that can fine tune your character, and the occasional piece of armour or recovery item. The most time-consuming quests are the one that force you to explore the Ruins of Obel, which brings me to the next point. The Ruins of Obel is a 6 floor dungeon, with an elemental chamber at the bottom, that offers some of the strongest enemies in the game. The levels get progressively harder, and the Elemental Chambers are the hardest battle fields in the game, that will require careful planning and positioning, but the rewards can be huge.

One last point of criticism is the overall localization. While translations were okay in the beginning, near the end of the game it looked like they just wanted to finish the job, and the translations got progressively worse. It would be understandable if the written text contains some errors, but when the voice actors just repeat the errors without noticing the mistakes, I have to question the efforts they put into the localization.

The game offers a New game+ option, which I have yet to try out, and aside from that there’s always the Medal challenge. Depending on your performance in battle, you get a rank awarded in battle, ranging from C (worst) to S (best, and incredibly hard to achieve on a first playthrough), and you receive a unique item that will boost some stats. It’s an extra challenge for those who can’t get enough of the game, although I myself haven’t really bothered much with it, except for a few battles.

In conclusion, Suikoden Tactics is a highly enjoyable game, that will give you at least 30 hours of entertainment. It’s a shame that it’s rather insignificant in the Suikoden universe, since it would earn a place there a lot more than IV. If you’re a fan of Suikoden and Tactical RPGs, I’d really recommend checking it out.

I'd be more than happy to participate in the Suikoden week, if any would be kind enough to provide me with a ava/sig set.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Having played this for the last 4 hours I don't see where the load issues were such a major detraction from the game. I mean if you are playing blazing fast FPS and action games all the time I am sure its noticeable. But they aren't nearly as annoying and terrible as I've seen most of these reviewers make them out to be. Few seconds here and there at most. Magna Carta had load issues. Shadow Hearts:Covenant wasn't exactly blazing fast either.

So far the game is everything i expected it to be. While some might feel antsy about the slow pacing I find it very nice to get to know the characters you are going to spend hours playing. Alot of foreshadowing and backstory on events can be found everywhere if you take the time to talk to NPC's and characters. If anything it excites me to really play the adventure once the reins are let loose.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Damnit! I forgot to pre-order Suikoden V. No pre-order bonus for me. I can't wait to play this game - alas, it will have to wait until after finals. Yay to the return of the 6 person party!

FELIPE NO

Yeah, I don't understand the load time complaints at all. They're normal speed for any RPG. I think the problem was that while in most RPGs you just go to a black screen, this game says loading. So you notice it. Reviewers overreacting again.

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While some might feel antsy about the slow pacing I find it very nice to get to know the characters you are going to spend hours playing. Alot of foreshadowing and backstory on events can be found everywhere if you take the time to talk to NPC's and characters. If anything it excites me to really play the adventure once the reins are let loose.

It does a really good job of building up to the crap hitting the fan so to speak. It's not until like 6 hours in that it all goes down. Makes it much more personal since by that time you know these characters pretty well.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

It is good to see the positive outlook on Suiko 5 so far

Although I don't have much time for console RPGs lately (grr WoW taking all my gaming time!), I think I might try to make a good effort to play this when I pick it up. I too was disapointed in 4, although I liked 1-3. I agree with how I played Suiko 2 so much that it became immortal to me, but then that's why a good game keeps you coming back again and again

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Knighthawk

III was a great game (Id go on record and say it was better then FFX)

That's like going on record as saying that one plus one equals two. You're not exactly going out on a limb there.

I only got to play SuikoV for a few minutes last night, between work and a fantasy baseball draft after work, but I fully intend on getting some serious play time in tonight. The battles {all five of them that I fought} already reminded me of SuikoII, and that's a good thing.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by russ

That's like going on record as saying that one plus one equals two. You're not exactly going out on a limb there.

III is an underrated game. When FFX and Suikoden III came out...more copies of FF were available....Suikoden 3 I had to search for to find it...and I know alot of people who considered FFX to be the end all of rpgs (im talking of course about 2002-2003 era of games). Alot of people came down hard on Suikoden III because they felt it should of been voiced ...and I admit there were parts that looked like it should of been but I still find it to be a great game.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Suikoden III is underrated eh? It's about as underrated as the value of a gallon of gasoline is in the US right now.

When Final Fantasy X came out, more copies were available because clearly, Square had the power to make more copies. Suikoden has always been a mixed bag with Konami, as they've focused more on things like MGS and such in the states.

No one came down hard on Suikoden III because it had no voices, they came down hard on it because it was mindless and repetitive garbage. Going through the same areas 500 times every chapter, having "treasure bosses" as your only means of getting anything valuable, and the god awful war battles that played more like a board game. The soundtrack also clearly proved that Michiru Yamane needs to stay under Castlevania instead of trying to spread out.

The story/lore is the only thing that saved Suikoden III's ass even a little bit.

Originally Posted by Mucknuggle

Damnit! I forgot to pre-order Suikoden V. No pre-order bonus for me. I can't wait to play this game - alas, it will have to wait until after finals. Yay to the return of the 6 person party!

Just walk into your nearest Gamestop or EB, and tell them you pre-ordered the game (even if you didn't) to receive your free artbook set. Most local locations received more copies of the artbook set than they did games, so you won't be cheating anyone.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

I don't get why Suikoden 3 catches so much flak. I thought it was a great game. Yeah it had some problems, especially when compared to Suikoden 2, but it was far better than FFX. And I'm not a Square basher either. I liked FFX, but Suikoden 3 was far superior.

People come down hard on Suikoden 3 because it wasn't Suikoden 2. If it had come out after Suikoden 4 then it would be nowhere near as maligned. My only problem with the game was that the main conflict wasn't really a war. It was a minor skirmish between the Grasslands and Luc's forces. Harmonia was only your enemy for like 2 battles (both of which you have to retreat from, which is really no surprise considering it is Harmonia).

I was speaking idiomatically.

Suikoden III catches so much flak because the gameplay itself is no good. It has nothing to do with it "not being Suikoden II" or anything of the sort. Regardless of the order it released at, the things I outlined still exists. This has little to do with comparisons to FFX or even Suikoden II.

The "minor skirmish" would have also led to...

Spoiler:

... the destruction of several elemental True Runes, throwing the world out of complete balance. Luc tried to avoid his destiny by taking everyone and everything else down with him, by destroying the True Runes. The Grassland unification was meant to stop that, and it certainly wasn't "minor" in any sense.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

As for your spoiler, that's not what I meant at all. I was refering to the actual amount of military action. Obviously a RPG isn't going to be minor in that sense, that's just being silly. I like the focus to be on politics and armies, not on Luc's plan. I can get that kind of plot in almost all other RPGs. It's why I liked the first half of the game more than the second. Sorry if I wasn't clear on that, thought it was kind of obvious...

And your outlined problems, were not problems at all to me. I never even noticed them while playing the game. I was never playing the game and found myself going "Damn, wish I could get something other than what's in these treasure chests!" I will add another flaw though. The amount of retreating and holding out you had to do in the war battles. I think they only let you fight back in like one of them.

How ya doing, buddy?

The politics focused more on Harmonia's overall plan to acquire all the runes, which died out once Luc decided he'd had enough. Neither Suikoden III or Suikoden IV were in the traditional sense "Suikoden" style games, but were required to convey that part of the lore. Without that, you have an incomplete puzzle when it comes to explaining further Suikoden games.

You must like repetition a lot then, having to run through the same areas so many times with so many different characters and setups. It's like you were replaying the game three different times on the same playthrough. The way the story progressed walking into Chapter 4 earned the most disdain from me though.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Suiko V came out in Japan already, right? Are there any spoiler plot summaries online yet?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

It came out in the US this week too lurky. We only had to wait like a month after it came out in Japan for an English version. GOD, don't you know anything? =p

I wish more companies would take a hint and begin localization during the game's development so we don't have to wait as long. As for the game itself, I'm enjoying ti so far. It does have odd pacing and a slow start but it all gets much better 6 or so hours into the game.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Then it should be easier to make with the spoilers you homo fox.

How ya doing, buddy?

Oddly enough, there hasn't been much in the way of information on the game-- a full guide for recruitment didn't come out until just recently, in fact. Fucking hard as hell to try to recruit characters when you have to go of off hearsay.

You can't get the damn game spoiled even if you search. Except--


This is a really major spoiler, so I don't recommend reading it unless you've beaten the game and/or don't care.

Spoiler:

Lyon and Sialeeds, respectively the Prince's bodyguard and aunt, die if you fail to recruit all the Stars of Destiny.

How ya doing, buddy?