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You would think anyway.

I'm irritated about the world-wide attention this shit in Virginia is getting but it made me think about something. If your friend or family member got killed as one of 30+ victims of a mass murder spree, (do you think) it would affect your emotions more than it would if Blaze Fatboy cracked your brother over the head with a Louisville Slugger and killed him in some random robbing? Think about it and tell me what you come up with.

Me, I don't give a shit. My brother or whoever is dead and nothing changes that. It's not like these shits were tortured or anything. As long as that gunman is dead after the fact there's not really much I can do or grieve over other than the fact that my brother's dead. At least the relatives and friends of these poor dead bastards know this Korean fucker's dead.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Maybe? I assume my brother or whoever would be safe at school. They are away at a college, of course something can happen there but I think it's a little more disheartening to have them die there than in some alley.

They're not coming back but I'm sure there's a myriad of feelings the victims have so I don't think it's as simple as "They're dead get over it."

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Omi-Cron Kenobi

Me, I don't give a shit. My brother or whoever is dead and nothing changes that. It's not like these shits were tortured or anything. As long as that gunman is dead after the fact there's not really much I can do or grieve over other than the fact that my brother's dead. At least the relatives and friends of these poor dead bastards know this Korean fucker's dead.

Wait, I may be just slow on this... but Is your brother actually dead or are you speaking in hypothetical terms?

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

No, no. I'm not saying these fuckers should just get over it. I'm just curious and want to see other perspectives on why this would hurt you more than it would if he just got shot for ten dollars. I said he's dead in both scenarios, but I never said it wasn't a big deal either way.

And hell, I don't expect a College Campus to be fucking safe. Wasn't there some freak fuck that went into a daycare some years ago and took care of business this way too?

Hypothetically DN.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Ah ok. Well for me personally I guess it makes no difference, dead is dead and it wasn't torture as you stated before.

I'd think a campus would be more safe a city street but perhaps I'm just naive on that issue. I can't find anything on the daycare incident other than some events that took place recently.

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Personally, I believe in vengeance. If any of my family members were killed from some psychopath, I'd make that person pay. If that psychopath's dead, I'd vandalize their grave.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Only thing close to any sort of incident at my school was that there was a shooter on the loose near my campus (not ON it, but nearby) and they locked down the facilities as a precaution. The police caught the guy around 15 minutes later after he ended up going back to his own apartment. This was around January or so *Shrug*

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Omi-Cron Kenobi

No, no. I'm not saying these fuckers should just get over it. I'm just curious and want to see other perspectives on why this would hurt you more than it would if he just got shot for ten dollars. I said he's dead in both scenarios, but I never said it wasn't a big deal either way.

I think what's bothering most people is how the deaths are seen as being senseless. Like how if they're a soldier or a policeman or something like that, then they're giving their life for a cause (and it was taken as a known risk) versus getting shot in the back of the head while reading a book in the library.

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But aren't those deaths in the massacre senseless? If not, what are they?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

I think what's bothering most people is how the deaths are seen as being senseless. Like how if they're a soldier or a policeman or something like that, then they're giving their life for a cause (and it was taken as a known risk) versus getting shot in the back of the head while reading a book in the library.

See, the book comment, its almost like there's an underlying mentality with all this... Like I'm being told these people deserve to die less than others. That these people need to be mourned for more. That the world needs to be absorbed with this mess in Virginia. It pisses me off when I watch the Guatemalan news and see these reporters talking about this topic as if their Catholic ruler had just been assassinated when on a daily basis at least half of that amount die for no good reason in this city alone. Can you imagine the amount of deaths in some of these real shithole countries? And they're probbably just as senselessly wrapped up in this like the rest of the world.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I guess it comes down to level of surprise at what happened. You don't expect a southeast Asian kid to go into a large college in the US and mow down a bunch of his classmates, but you kinda expect gang members in east-LA to get killed pretty often.

Also, news in the US seems to just get a lot of attention. After we had all of those cave-ins trapping coal miners last year I remember seeing a thing about how there were some collapses in eastern Europe, yet nobody cared. Not sure if this is because people expect it to happen over there, or if there's just a fixation on disasters in the US.

Perhaps it's the same reason that news about celebrities getting in trouble is so popular. They're just not the people you'd expect for these things to happen to.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Well, yeah. Totally right. I'm pretty fucking surprised about this shit too like anyone else. It just seems like people are taking that surprise and turning it into some morbid shock. It's like all the flags on cars after 9/11 and Walmart taking advantage of that demand. Not nearly as disgusting though.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

I know there was a shooting in Canada a while ago where a woman-hating Arab ordered all the men out of a classroom and then they did nothing while the Arab proceeded to kill 17 women, continuing to do nothing as he left.

It didn't make much news hoopla of any that I can remember.


As for the topic, I guess I'd be more bummed out about a random senseless massacre, and more angry about the individual killing. When it's just your loved one who's killed, the effect is all the more personal.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Bradylama

As for the topic, I guess I'd be more bummed out about a random senseless massacre, and more angry about the individual killing. When it's just your loved one who's killed, the effect is all the more personal.

That hits it right on the head as far as my opinion on the difference goes. It's good to be aware of why you feel the way you. =p

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Even though I don't know anyone who was killed in that whole massacre I still feel a tremendous amount of sympathy for those families who are left holding the emotional bag. I guess I can't really feel THAT down about what happened because it's no one in my family that died out there but there's still a sense of security that died along with all those victims in this whole debacle.

Originally Posted by Omi-Cron Kenobi

It pisses me off when I watch the Guatemalan news and see these reporters talking about this topic as if their Catholic ruler had just been assassinated when on a daily basis at least half of that amount die for no good reason in this city alone. Can you imagine the amount of deaths in some of these real shithole countries? And they're probbably just as senselessly wrapped up in this like the rest of the world.

I guess that does make sense, but circumstances in each area you're describing are pretty much polar opposites. I know that when someone gets shot to death, per se, in Guatemala and it's described as a senseless killing I kind of have to realize that, hey... It's Guatemale: the country with the highest murder rate in all of Latin America. Senseless or not, deaths are just kind of a given down there; especially in large cities. You know what it's like, man. Shit, you LIVE there. You adapt or else...

When you think about that even though the U.S. has almost as large a murder rate, it's not as concentrated to one area and it's just NOT the kind of thing that goes down in a college campus as casually as, say, a drug deal gone bad in a third-world country. This kind of thing just shatters your perception of what safety REALLY IS in this country.

But hey, there's a reason why the words of Eazy-E still ring loud in some ears out here: "Never leave the pad wit'out packin' a gun".

FELIPE NO

Part of it is the macabre record-breaking nature of it all. This is the biggest body count of any US massacre, which is a big deal in and of itself. And, as noted before, it happened in a place where there's not a lot of open hostilities going on. That's scandalous, which is why it's getting so much media attention. Scandals sell newspapers.

Of course, individual acts of violence are going to provoke more emotional reaction. It's simply the nature of what happens as more and more people are involved in an event. At some point, all those victims stop being people and become statistics, numbers on a sheet of paper. I also think it plays a pretty big role whether or not the perpetrator dies in the process or not. It's hard to be as angry when the gunman also kills himself; it's a lot easier to channel rage towards a living target, after all.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Would a massacre like this, exact same setting and everything, be as big of a deal anywhere else in the world?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Omi-Cron Kenobi

Would a massacre like this, exact same setting and everything, be as big of a deal anywhere else in the world?

I'd have to say no. The reason that all this has made such a HUGE impact on the US is because its not something that happens every day. We look at news reports constantly about deaths in Iraq and Iran and other middle east countries, and just think 'Ho-hum, another day in the middle east.' But if you think about it, a person can open yahoo.com at any random time and almost always see a news article about deaths in the middle east... I did it just now, and sure enough, right at the top of the News section is 'Gunmen in northern Iraq kill 23 from small religious sect'.

Every day we read about suicide bombers and car bombs and school shootings in the middle east, often with greater casualties than the V-Tech massacre. You may say that its all part of war, but when the civilians are being killed by their own people, it doesnt change how pointless it is. We're not used to this kind of killing on our own soil. We've come to think 'that doesnt happen here, that happens there.'

As for what the people in Iraq think about all the deaths, that I cant say.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Bradylama

I know there was a shooting in Canada a while ago where a woman-hating Arab ordered all the men out of a classroom and then they did nothing while the Arab proceeded to kill 17 women, continuing to do nothing as he left.

It didn't make much news hoopla of any that I can remember.

Huh? You're not talking about École Polytechnique in Montréal are you? Where Marc Lépine killed 14 women before shooting himself... He wasn't Arab, or Muslim... Just a french-canadian with a hatred of feminism (that's a little bit of an understatement.)

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I also agree that while tragic, there are lots of other senseless deaths around the world. The US just seems to be able to amplify the coverage simply because it hits home for more people watching the news. Regrettably, it really is a fact that if say, 100 people were murdered needlessly by some psychopath in the Philippines or something, many people in the US wouldn't care to the same extent.

Point being, while our hearts extend to those impacted by the VT shootings, people should at least also extend some level of regard for just how crazy the world is overall, having some level of global awareness.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

Also, news in the US seems to just get a lot of attention.

I'm surprised ow quickly this story dropped out of the news over here. The day after there was a bunch of reports and analysis but since then, pretty much nothing.

I guess now you've had so many school shootings the shock value has gone and any potential analysis is pretty pointless since we all know you're never going to give up gun ownership.

From the news coverage here, one would say that most people in Britain think if you've got as high a level of gun ownership as America does, chance are a bunch of people are gonna get shot once in a while. Hard to see why anyone's shocked when it happens any more.

I did like how some elements of the media are trying to blame it on the film Oldboy, in which no school kids get shot and there's very little gun fighting (To say none at all in fact, really). If you're looking for a scapegoat, at least pick a plausible one.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Shin

I'm surprised ow quickly this story dropped out of the news over here. The day after there was a bunch of reports and analysis but since then, pretty much nothing.

I guess now you've had so many school shootings the shock value has gone and any potential analysis is pretty pointless since we all know you're never going to give up gun ownership.

We haven't had that many major shootings, really. In a country as big as ours, you can expect this kind of shit every now and then.

Remember - we're a lot bigger than Europe put together. And that makes for a LOT of square mileage for crazies. (Especially knowing that there seems to be little nooks of the country which breeds crazies for a living). I am sure Europe has seen some massacres itself.

So yea, it's no surprise that we have some kind of massacre every five years ago. We shouldn't, but hey. Crazies. Don't act like the US is the only one with crazies in the world.

Also, the gun control? It shouldnt be that EASY to obtain a gun, but you shouldn't be right-out restricted from owning one all together.

Thats why we're Yanks and you're all Brits. Because we didn't like how you ran shit, so we up and left - writing in the right to revolt if need be (with our arms). =D

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

So how does Canada figure into the square mileage equation?

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Originally Posted by Omi-Cron Kenobi

If your friend or family member got killed as one of 30+ victims of a mass murder spree, (do you think) it would affect your emotions more than it would if Blaze Fatboy cracked your brother over the head with a Louisville Slugger and killed him in some random robbing? Think about it and tell me what you come up with.

It depends on whether you think the universe happens for a reason or it's random. If you believe in the whole grim reaper thing then when it's someone's time it's someone's time: whether they get shot in a killing spree or a piano falls on their head or they eat Ecoli spinach doesn't matter.

Of course, if you factor in true evil (some people believe in evil/hell, some don't) then you could see certain things as acts of evil that come from Satan that wouldn't otherwise have happened absence the presence of Satan.

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