Dealbreakers

I said kissed, not nailed. But a virgin she is, which is off subject and something I won't discuss. I'm wondering if I should stop diving in and wait for her to come out of the box. I think that might give her the impression that her lack of experience has caused me to lose interest, though. But I don't want to keep embarrassing her when I do move in. All in good fun, we laugh it off (but she doesn't seem to be improving).

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Wow. That's the soundest possible advice, coming from a woman. Appreciated and set in motion.

Double Post:
Heh. I was just taken by surprise. I spoke too soon.

FELIPE NO

The ultimate dealbreaker for me is when the women I go on a first date with expects me to pay for dinner simply because, “I am the man.” I hate this, a lot.

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Quote:

The ultimate dealbreaker for me is when the women I go on a first date with expects me to pay for dinner simply because, “I am the man.” I hate this, a lot.

Why, it's just money? Typically when I've dated girls, we just alternate who pays for what. I could care less if I have to be the first one to pay. Although, I don't really do this official date thing, where you go out all fancied up and then if it went well you go on another date. It's more like, "hey you wanna hang out and do something tonight?" I like stuff more laid back.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s not the idea of paying for a date I don’t like. It’s the attitude of the female in this scenario. The way I see it, if I barely know a person, why the hell should I be required to pay their expenses? If a female agrees to go on a date with me, I’m going to go out on a limb and assume that she wants to get to know me. As far as I’m concerned, unless there’s already some type of history between us where we willingly do things for one another, a woman expecting me to pay for the entire first date is roughly the equivalently of me expecting them to give me head on the first date

We’re not even on that “level” yet.

One time I went on a date and the waitress asked us, should I split the bill? And I said "of course." Then the bitch gave me this look. Never bothered talking to her again.

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I have to agree...when a girl like, expects you to pay, its not something I like because, if its a first date, you aren't commiting to anything, you're just spending some time together to see if something clicks. If its like a 10th date or something and you two are going out then why not treat her, just don't make it seem like you're trying to get something out of it, which, now a days is a bit hard.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

I just thought of another dealbreaker. A guy who asks me out on a date and is then too cheap too much of a progressive thinker to pay for the thing.

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I'm so glad that I repulse you Alice.

But for the hell of things, what if you asked some guy out to dinner? And yes, I've had girls do this before.

I was speaking idiomatically.

In that case, I would fully expect to pay. But I'd never ask a guy out.

Oh and also, you don't repulse me. It just seems that we have completely different opinions on everything.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

So you basically think the initiator of the date is responsible for the bill?

Then, what happens when there’s no clear cut initiator? More than often, when I end up on a date with a girl, it's not a clear cut "hey can I take you out" kinda deal. More of mutual agreement that we should get to know each other better. Also, what’s so ‘progressive’ about expecting someone – that you barely know – to handle their own weight? I’d replace progressive thinking with flat out common sense, but I might be retarded.

FELIPE NO

You do realize that traditionally men have paid for dates, right? I believe this practice originated back when men were pretty much always the breadwinners, but it's still something that a lot of the more traditional women expect. I'm of the opinion that whoever asks the other person out is responsible for paying the bill. If there's any uncertainty at all about who did the asking, I think the man should step up and pay. It's just good manners. And just because you didn't technically "ask" someone out, doesn't mean that you weren't the pursuer.

Keep in mind that I'm only talking about the first few dates. In an established relationship where both people have jobs, I don't think it's fair that one person has to always pay for everything.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

My rule is that if I can't afford to take a girl out to dinner, then I shouldn't be going to out dinner with a girl. If I can't afford to pay the bill, then I am not in in a financial position to be dating anyone. Regardless of whether the girl asked me out or I asked her out, by god, I'm paying for everything on the date. That's just how it is and how it should be. I mean my god, what kind of person would I be if I squabbled over 15 dollars for a meal or 10 dollars for a movie ticket or whatever amount for whatever activity?

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

In an established relationship where both people have jobs, I don't think it's fair that one person has to always pay for everything.

Yes, as a relationship progresses and both parties are capable of footing the bill, then I don't have a problem letting the girl take me out occasionally. But even so, I still end up paying for things more often. That doesn't bother me, and it shouldn't bother me.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

You do realize that traditionally men have paid for dates, right? I believe this practice originated back when men were pretty much always the breadwinners, but it's still something that a lot of the more traditional women expect. I'm of the opinion that whoever asks the other person out is responsible for paying the bill. If there's any uncertainty at all about who did the asking, I think the man should step up and pay. It's just good manners. And just because you didn't technically "ask" someone out, doesn't mean that you weren't the pursuer.

Keep in mind that I'm only talking about the first few dates. In an established relationship where both people have jobs, I don't think it's fair that one person has to always pay for everything.

You do realize that it was also 'tradition' for women to submit to and obey men, don't you? It was also 'tradition' and 'good manner' for us black folk to not even think about touching a white women. You don't just go and fucking keep the stuff that benefits you when they don't make any damn sense.

My problem is with the utter lack of any reasoning, not paying for something.

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Originally Posted by SMX

You do realize that it was also 'tradition' for women to submit to and obey men, don't you?

I still believe that. I wouldn't be married to a man who didn't respect and ask for my input on things, but most of the time when we disagree on something, I defer to him since he is the head of the household. There are times when I dig my heels in, and when I do that he knows I mean business, but as a general rule, I trust his ability to make decisions. It's one of the reasons I chose him.

Quote:

It was also 'tradition' and 'good manner' for us black folk to not even think about touching a white women.

I don't think interracial relationships are such a great idea, and not because one race is better than another. More for the same reasons that I don't believe that having a relationship with someone outside your religious faith is a good idea. Too many cultural differences.

Basically, you and I have COMPLETELY different beliefs. There's no point in either of us trying to change the other's mind. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

I still believe that. I wouldn't be married to a COUSIN who didn't respect and ask for my input on things, but most of the time when we disagree on something, I defer to him since MY COUSIN is the head of the household. There are times when I dig my heels in, and when I do that MY COUSIN knows I mean business, but as a general rule, I trust his ability to make decisions. It's one of the reasons I chose him.

fixed.

And Alice, I will let this go one day, I'm sure... but right now, too good for me not to milk.

Though inbreeding might account for your daughter's taste in men. She may be borderline retarded.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

I have considered the possibility.

As far as the inbreeding goes, my bloodline is just too superior. I couldn't risk tainting it with inferior blood by marrying outside the family.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Dealbreaker: Try to make me into a cake daddy and you may as well get ready to find a new guy the next day.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Personally I think it's good manners for men to pay for the first couple dates, I was taught its the mark of a good gentleman. Because I always associate when I'm out with my guy friends, we'll go dutch but when I'm with a possible boyfriend or on a date, he pays for me to show interest, that's he's different from a "friend". I'm more traditional that I like a guy taking care of me. Some girls hate it when guys pay for dates, not matter what the circumstances, I have a friend who always insists on paying for everything to impose her sense of independence right from the start of a relationship. These are the same girls that don't like it when guys open doors for them. Because it's just so offensive.

My dealbreaker: I'm compulsive. I can't stand it when my boyfriend comes to my house and moves my shit around or makes a mess. I'll start fights over it and I have. I'm also so really moody, a small little thing could mess up my day and I'll be awful for the rest of it. It is managable if the guy knows how the manage it and not make it worst, but 80% of the guys I've known have not.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

There's no point in either of us trying to change the other's mind. We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not here to change how you see things. I’m just pointing out how mine actually makes sense while yours do not.

Originally Posted by kat

Personally I think it's good manners for men to pay for the first couple dates, I was taught its the mark of a good gentleman.

Since Alice won't/can’t, can you enlighten me on why its good manners? I can’t seem to figure it out.

At least outside of "I just want things to be like that logic." Which I find sickening.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Can't you read? I already explained that traditional women still believe that it's primarily the man's job to pay for things/be the primary breadwinner/take on the role of the head of a household or leader of a family and WHY THEY STILL HOLD THOSE BELIEFS.

As Kat explained, not all women expect those things, and some are downright offended by that sort of behavior.

I happen to be very old-fashioned. Why is this so hard to understand?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by SMX

Since Alice won't/can’t, can you enlighten me on why its good manners? I can’t seem to figure it out.

At least outside of "I just want things to be like that logic." Which I find sickening.

"Don’t get me wrong, I’m not here to change how you see things. I’m just pointing out how mine actually makes sense while yours do not."

Like russ said, if a guy can't fork over $20 for a dinner, then how can he afford to be in a relationship. I'm no good digger but I want to know a guy can take care of me, or more so willing to. This is just ME, some girls don't like so it's not some universal conspiracy. It's personal preference more than anything else.

Just like some cultures think it's good manners to take off your shoes when you go into someone's house, some cultures/people think it's good manners for a man to pay for the woman. My mom taught me that way, I agree with it, the end.

And Alice, is your husband your first cousin (parent's sibling's kid) or is it a more distant.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Alice, if you can read, you would realize that I don't understand the WHY DO THEY BELIEVE THAT part of the traditional women. “Because it’s tradition” is not reasoning, or should I say, it’s very very bad reasoning. But I guess I just have to accept that some people don't incorporate reasoning into their beliefs.

Kat, let’s assume for hypothetical purposes that you go on a date with a guy like me. Remember, money isn’t my issue at all; it’s more so a personality conflict that’s my problem. IE, avoiding women like Alice.

And no Alice, I don’t mean that in a disrespectful way. Let’s get real here though.

Does the idea that the guy doesn’t want to pay for the first date has any realistic connection to his ability to provide for his potential family in this instance?

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

In the context of first dates, it is "fair" to go dutch on a date but I don't think relationships are necessarily about what's fair and what's not fair. It's always a give and take, and I want to make sure that the man is willing to GIVE as well as TAKE. The question isn't of his ability to provide for any potential circumstance but more his willingness to. I hate to say it this way but I want to make sure that he has his priorities straight. You can have money and the ability to give your family everything you can, but if you don't have the heart for it, then there's no point.

That's why this isn't about dating a rich guy and knowing if he's rich on the first date and having him treat me out on a lavish dinner, but if you're dating a good, decent guy who is there for you and wants to take care of you, even if it's giving you the bigger half of the cookie. Because that's what you do when you like a person, possibly even love. Most women want the comfort of knowing that they come first for a guy. A way to verify it is if he pays for the first date, he shows you that you're important and you're special and that he sees you differently from every other girl he knows.

That's my take on it. I've had guys not pay for me and it's not the end of the world. Although ironically, I never got into a relationship with any of them. So I figure, hypothetical you and I would never make it.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

I have considered the possibility.

As far as the inbreeding goes, my bloodline is just too superior. I couldn't risk tainting it with inferior blood by marrying outside the family.

Beautiful. For all I hate everything you stand for, I appreciate your sense of humour.

Also, that guy sucks. Seriously.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

You do realize that traditionally men have paid for dates, right? I believe this practice originated back when men were pretty much always the breadwinners, but it's still something that a lot of the more traditional women expect. I'm of the opinion that whoever asks the other person out is responsible for paying the bill. If there's any uncertainty at all about who did the asking, I think the man should step up and pay. It's just good manners. And just because you didn't technically "ask" someone out, doesn't mean that you weren't the pursuer.

Keep in mind that I'm only talking about the first few dates. In an established relationship where both people have jobs, I don't think it's fair that one person has to always pay for everything.

To be serious for second now, Alice and to actually make a decent post...

You realize that a lot of men that I know, that are around my age, were raised by women. Our fathers either left, parents split, or the father was never around. This poses a MAJOR problem for men my age. I do believe this is the sole cause of metrosexuality. We grew up being men, raised by women.

A lot of girls are put off by this it seems. Who wants to be with a man who's more feminine than you? It's kind of sad when you get beauty tips or clothing tips from your BOYFRIEND or your HUSBAND.

Women my age are NOT traditional (generally speaking) and do not like guys doing anything for them or something along those lines. I'd say (from experience), 1 out of every 3 girls my age are damaged goods. I'd wager on that one any day, even to go as far as betting my bottom dollar that 1 in 3 girls has been hit by either her father or her boyfriend(s).

I come from the generation where children were handed Ritalin and anti-depressants as if it was some magic candy. I can honestly say that I don't know anybody my age (a few years younger or a few years older) that ARENT derranged or have some form of disorder.

I can understand where you're coming from, but not to SOUND rude, the younger generation is a lot different than yours. Everybody in my generation is fucked to the core, it seems. I don't know why either.

I've had a lot of girls expect me to be the Nice GuyTM. I'll admit, I'm an overly nice guy, but the moment you take advantage of my generosity, I will snap and bear fangs waiting for the taste of blood. In today's world, the best way to get by, is to be a dick. Niceness gets you nowhere fast these days.

How ya doing, buddy?