Why You Gotta Pick on the Amish, Man?

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

I heard an updated report this morning. Apparently he actually shot either 12 or 13 girls (I can't remember exactly), and five of them died - three yesterday and two more this morning.

This is the sickest thing I've heard in a long time. This just proves to me that there is no place on Earth that is safe anymore. What a horrible tragedy.

Well said Alice,

There is no place on earth that is safe, maybe one little help we could give to reduce these horrible crimes, as starters, would be to try and change the law which currently enables whomever to walk into a bloody gun shop and buy rifles or guns...common Amerika...we Romans were alive and ruling long before you guys and it is certainly not a coincidence that our law does not forsee 'free' distribution of weapons.

cheers

amman2003

There's nowhere I can't reach.

http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=2523941&page=1

Quote:

Amish Say They 'Forgive' School Shooter

By CHARLES GIBSON

NICKEL MINES, Pa., Oct. 3, 2006 — We arrived in this community of Nickel Mines, Pa., curious about how the Amish, who live differently than most Americans do, might react to what was an unthinkable act of violence.

It didn't take long for us to learn that the Amish families most affected by this tragedy have responded in a way that might seem foreign to most of us: They talk about Monday's school shooting only in terms of forgiveness.

"We're just trying to support each other and trying to let it sink in," said 17-year-old Dorothy King.

Two of her cousins were shot, and one is in critical condition, but like so many in the Amish community, she forgives the gunman, Charles Carl Roberts.

"We think it's all in God's hand," King said. "If this wouldn't have happened, something still would have happened … because their time was up. God's hand was in control."

Midwife Rhita Rhoads was present for the births of two of the five girls who were killed and also speaks of forgiving the gunman.

"If you have Jesus in your heart and he has forgiven you … [how] can you not forgive other people?" Rhoads said.

"I'm sure it's going to be a struggle to go on without a loved one like that," said Elmer Fisher. His 7-year-old cousin, Naomi Fisher, was among those murdered. "But I think they trust in God that he's going to take care of them and everything's going to be fine."

When asked if Roberts' wife would still be welcome in the community, Fisher said he believed she would, adding she would be welcome even at the funerals for the dead girls.

Such are the minds of the forgiving. Passages from the New Testament are taken literally in this community, and the Amish believe they need to love their enemies, which may be beyond the ability of most people, especially so close in time to the murders.

Peek at Amish Society

Amish people are cautious about technology. None use electricity or have cars.

"They won't play sports. They won't have music," said filmmaker Lucy Walker. Walker spent three years working on "The Devils Playground," a documentary about the Amish community.

She describes their strict dress code, which guides every detail of what they wear.

"They'll have a set uniform, including a haircut that's standard," she said. "The men, instead of wearing a wedding ring start growing a beard, but mustaches aren't allowed, zippers aren't allowed, buttons aren't allowed."

Their lifestyle is slow. Mass media and TVs and computers and electricity are all rejected. But perhaps most remarkable to the outsider who comes to this community is its ability to grieve together, forgive as a community and realize they must move on.

As one man noted, now there is harvesting that has to be done.

Damn.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

How admirable of them to have this rare gift of forgiveness, what absolute sense of the essential qualities of life...so much wisdom and respect for the others, so much love for life and nature...but in the wrong country.

amman2003

How ya doing, buddy?

Their 'gift' for forgiveness is insincere at best. The Amish will forgive anyone for anything if they think it helps in the afterlife. When people are ignored by the outside world and are left to account for themselves, things run amuck. I found the story about sexual abuse in the Amish community very interesting from ABC News. A girl tells her story about being raped since a young child by her family, and how her mother knew about it and turned a blind eye. I watched the court proceedings for the case and was blown away at the Amish community who came to court and were ashamed of the girl for involving the outside world in their affairs, but were crying for the release of the men who raped her,...her brothers.

Go to Google and type in "Amish Sexual Assault Case" and click on the ABC News link.

I was speaking idiomatically.

I just read about the forgiveness thing the Amish are doing. I guess if that is what they need to do, then so be it.

Personally, I would have a hard time forgiving someone who killed those young girls.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Whoa... makes you wish there was less of a stigma attached to sexual deviancy and the acquisition psychological help. I mean, maybe if it were easier to admit that you were a pedophile, it would be easier to get help? Maybe if he leveled with his wife instead of telling her in a suicide note, he could've gotten the help he needed, and those kids would still be alive. Alas, being sick is apparantly a terrible thing in our society, and not at all a symptom of the human condition.

I don't care that they're Amish. Innocent people get hurt every day, and it's always a tragedy. Where one person could've been healed, a lot of people were hurt, and that's always a testament to the fucked up state of affairs that the human condition has become.

----
I have a new respect for the Amish community. I think it's pretty arrogant and over-cynical to assume that they would forgive the shooter for selfish reasons, and that's coming from a cynic. You know nothing of the situation, and thus have nothing but your own personal bias to base such an assumption on. The fact is that we are all capable of doing terrible things of this nature, given the right stimuli and a lack of help from loved ones. Once you recognize this, the reason why they forgive even a child killer becomes pretty obvious.

It's also excessively lame to judge an entire way of life by the idiocy and depravity of a few individuals. If a person fails to understand their own religion, then they are an utter moron, since most religion is designed to be understood by all who seek it. The people who turned a blind eye, the people who would weep for the victimizers before the victim, have no understanding of the way of life that they, themselves, are a part of. Forgiveness is divine, but one should forgive the victimizers only after they repent, and after the victims have been helped. To see a sin and turn a blind eye is essentially the same as committing it yourself, as anyone with even a basic understanding of Christianity should know.

This is precisely why people should not be born into a way of life, but should instead explore all options and choose for themselves. If you don't understand the doctrine, than don't call yourself a believer. 'Nuff said.

Most amazing jew boots

Quote:

Police found evidence at the scene that seemed to suggest that Roberts had planned a sexual assault.
Along with three guns and ammunition, zip ties and a box of tools, police found two tubes of KY jelly, widely used as a sexual lubricant.

It makes you wonder. Like what the hell else KY Jelly is used for.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Capo

It makes you wonder. Like what the hell else KY Jelly is used for.

Quote:

The jelly is also used in many special effects driven films to give the appearance of slime, such as in Ghostbusters, Alien and The Thing.

K-Y Jelly is also used in medicine for many procedures that involve insertion of an instrument or fingers into a small or narrow body cavity or past a muscular sphincter, including various forms of intubation, endoscopy, and direct digital examinations (e.g., digital rectal examinations).

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KY_Jelly

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Yeah, ionuk tomb, because the entire Amish population must account for the actions of one family.

I'm not saying that Amish are incapable of sin or something. But don't be a dumbass.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I didn't say that the entire Amish community should account for it. I was just pointing out the lack of rationalization on the part of the members of the Amish community that were at the courthouse.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by ionuk tomb

The Amish will forgive anyone for anything if they think it helps in the afterlife.

I'm pretty certain that anyone would forgive most people if they really thought doing so would provide themselves a better afterlife; this is a somewhat moot point. Honestly, I think that most forgivness for murder and other heinous acts is "insincere at best."

I'd still really like to know what made the murderer go nuts.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Snowknight

I'd still really like to know what made the murderer go nuts.

Must not have been able to go through with the molesting... got angry and decided to shoot them all.

I think the cops showing up made him panic... and I think he had a lack of decision before hand...

I was speaking idiomatically.

Lemme guess, "he played Quake, GTA etc and listened to rap and metal music etc" too ¬_¬

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Chiribo

Lemme guess, "he played Quake, GTA etc and listened to rap and metal music etc" too ¬_¬

No one said that, second he's an adult, wasn't he around his 30s?

They'd be saying that if it was a 15 year old doing this.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Zio

No one said that, second he's an adult, wasn't he around his 30s?

They'd be saying that if it was a 15 year old doing this.

I think he was in his 40s.

But yeah, I would blame it on videogames.... just kidding:biggrin:

I don't think they will get a full understanding of what happened that day. Its unfortunate, but with him being dead, there isn't much to tell. Maybe on of the girls who was there can tell.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Yeah, definitely video games. Especially Counter-Strike: Amish Town.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I can't see how anyone has the ability to forgive such an evil monster like that pedophilic murderer. If someone like "him" ever killed my family, I would never be able to forgive such a monster. I'd hunt "him" down and kill "him" in a gruesome slow manner.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Those kids had it coming. The Amish are stinky tax evaders.

Sarcasm.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by ionuk tomb

Yeah, definitely video games. Especially Counter-Strike: Amish Town.

Gotta admit that did actually make me LoL irl.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?