The 2005-2006 NBA Season Discussion Thread

Off topic again, but this is a great rebound by Nate Robinson:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1MDCjkAjvo

FELIPE NO

Daaayam, Dirk's 22 points in the fourth quarter in a key Playoff game is impressive. 50 points for the game is awesome.

The Suns will need to win the next game to force yet another Game 7.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by bishop743

I'm rooting for them so hopefully Alonzo Mourning and Gary Payton can get rings.

I lost some respect for Alonzo after he refused to suit up and play for the Raptors. He didn't even report to the team, essentially forcing the Raptors to let him go. I mean, as a professional athlete, you should honour contracts and trades as part of the sport.

And I love Gary Payton, and I think he deserves a ring. But he's been a ring-chaser the past couple of years, basically latching himself to whatever team Shaq's on.

I've always found curious, ring-chasers in the twilight of their careers, signing with contenders just to win a ring. The most blatant example is the 2003-2004 Karl Malone and Gary Payton.

I wonder how much that ring would worth to them had they actually won it that year. Imagine how the annals of NBA history would talk about them, as ring-chasers jumping on teams virtually guaranteed to win it all. Imagine them explaining to their grandchildren years down the road, "Oh, I couldn't win a ring after leading my former team for 10-15 years. But then I began to age and decline, and so I joined a team led by Shaq and Kobe as a last desperate attempt to win it all. And that's how I got this ring. See how shiny and big it is."

Or in Payton's case this year, Shaq and D-Wade.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by bishop743

As far as Alonzo Mourning goes, yeah that was a very low-class move he made. People are investing millions of dollars in him, he should have went out there and honored his contract as you said. It was a mistake, and a big one, but I don't think that should tarnish his whole career or anything.

Oh no, definitely wouldn't tarnish his career accomplishments. But people have lost some respect for him, after admiring him for his passion and tenacity coming back from kidney ailment.

Originally Posted by bishop743

I dunno about this "ring-chasers" thing man. I mean, when Karl Malone and Gary Payton left their respective teams, the Jazz and Sonics were beginning to move in a different direction. Malone and Payton had given them all they could. Neither were good enough to carry a team anymore but they still had talent. So, I don't have a problem with them singing with a contending team to contribute. What, you expected them to sign with the Hawks or Raptors? :P

Well ... not the Hawks or Raptors. Haha.

But it's just that it was so blatantly obvious what they were trying to do. I mean, how much would you value that ring, knowing that you only won it because of Shaq and Kobe (Wade) and another hall of famer?

I think it's unfortunate that many sports pundits judge your career by how many championships you have. And I think it's unfair that such an emphasis is placed on it, above all else. So much so that aging superstars on their decline feel it necessary to latch themselves onto a contender, just to win a ring to solidify their greatness.

But I think most people would rather have a Charles Barkley career, rather than a Robert Horry one. Or a Reggie Miller, rather than a Rip Hamilton. Or a John Stockton, rather than a Steve Kerr.

Allen Iverson put it very well this year: "I think I deserve to win a championship for everything I put in as far as trying to win one, but I'm not going to chase it. I can end my career without a championship and be happy with the effort I gave to try and win one."

It's the same way I feel about Kevin Garnett. But the only difference between the 2006 Garnett/Iverson versus the 2004 Malone/Payton is that the former two are still in their prime. They can join a different team right now and instantly be the focal point. Hence, any success they have with their new team can be directly attribute to them.

It's like in 1993, had Barkley won a ring with Phoenix after leaving Philly, that ring would've meant everything to him.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I'm still hoping for a Garnett-Iverson tandem. I'd be buggin' out



On an unrelated note, I came across this article: The reason Carmelo Anthony doesn't wear a Detroit Pistons uniform.

How ya doing, buddy?

Kind of cool: Not since 1971 have we had two NBA teams who are in the Finals for the very first time. I'm gonna say Heat in 7.


I came across this, Dirk getting Punk'd:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWmuUFKX1QA

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Wow, 5 points by perhaps the most dominant force outside of Wilt in league history in an NBA Finals game. That ain't right.



Two four-point plays (by Stackhouse and Howard) in one Finals game. Prior to that, there had only been six in the history of NBA Finals. At first I was surprised at how small that number is, but considering the fact that the three-point line hadn't always been existence, it makes sense.

Let's see here ... according to news sources:

Before yesterday's game, the last four-point play in the Finals was six years ago: Reggie Miller did it in Game 5 against the Lakers in 2000.

The other players to complete four-point plays are: Glen Rice (Lakers, 2000), Hersey Hawkins (Sonics, 1996), Toni Kukoc (Bulls, 1996), Scott Wedman (Celtics, 1985), Andrew Toney (Sixers, 1982).

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Originally Posted by bishop743

No team has ever won all 3 of those middle games at home since they went to the 2-3-2 format.

Exactly just what I was about to post

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Timberwolf

Exactly just what I was about to post

Er, never mind. I forgot the 2004 Pistons as well.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by bishop743

Also, Jerry Stackhouse might miss that game because of a suspension after that flagrant foul against Shaq last night. We'll see....

Yep, suspension. One game.

This may cost them.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

We're going to OVERTIME!

DWYANE WAAAAAAADE.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

What a finish.

Yeah, that Howard timeout really destroyed their chances at a last shot. Damn, Dirk Nowitzki was so mad after the loss, kicking everything in sight on the way to the locker room.

But this was Dwyane's night. The Finals MVP trophy has his name on it.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by han89

how did The Mav lose by one point?

Dwyane Wade.



Oh, is anyone else happy for Gary Payton who hit that clutch, left-handed, high-off-the-glass layup? He's hit big shots in two of the Heat's wins.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by bishop743

That's exactly why you pick up a Gary Payton during the offseason. He's not good enough to carry a team, but if you need a big bucket late, he's a veteran guy who can still deliver. I like how for 3 quarters, Jason Terry abuses him and Jason Williams, but Terry always gets burned in crunch time.

If Miami does win the series, GP will have had played a key role. I was watching the postgame press conference, and GP was mad cool, very veteran-like, very chill. GP is gangsta.


Oh, and just in case some people believe the Mavericks' insinuation that Wade was not fouled on his last drive:



The only odd thing was that the refs called the foul on Nowitzki, not Harris. But in any case, Wade was fouled.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by bishop743

I don't think anyone was debating there being a foul. I think the main criticism was that the refs let that decide the game. It was a ticky-tack foul, they should have swallowed their whistles on that play. But of course, star players get certain calls, and that's the nature of the game. Dallas doesn't have anything to whine about though, they had their opportunities.

I'm doing my post-game surfing this morning, and a lot of people are debating whether or not there was a foul call.

I found another picture, and there seems to be a gap between Harris's hand and Wade's arm. The angle in that first picture I posted isn't the best. This is the second angle:




There's also an animated .gif from the ABC camera. Nowitzki definitely didn't foul Wade. But it's hard to tell whether Harris's hand came down on Wade's forearm (I didn't add that caption at the end):



I was speaking idiomatically.

I'm still staring at the animated .gif. Harris' hand came down pretty hard. Had he actually hit Wade's arm, Wade's arm probably would not have been able to continue its normal upward motion.

If that's true, then there was no foul on that play.





The only Cuban not welcome in Miami.

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Originally Posted by bishop743

Going away from the NBA Finals a bit, I was skimming ESPN and found a couple of articles about Len Bias. He died 20 years ago today. This guy was a beast at Maryland and would have been a SUPERstar in the NBA right off the bat. It's tragic what happened to him. Check out these articles:

The legend of Len Bias
By Scoop Jackson

Len Bias gone, but not forgotten
By Bomani Jones

I'm a big fan of Scoop Jackson. I really like his writing style. The Bomani Jones article is good too.

Nice. I'm also a fan of Scoop. I liked his stuff, ever since his SLAM days.

I had always been under the impression that Len Bias was a good player drafted by the Celtics in '86. I never knew that he was that good.

I'm just learning now that, had he lived, he would've changed the history of the NBA. The Celtics would've continued to win championships, since Bird and McHale would've had their careers extended as they wouldn't have had to play those heavy minutes. Michael Jordan would've had a serious rival in his own conference to deal with.

It's unfortunate what happened with Bias.

Originally Posted by bishop743

Timberwolf: If you can SOMEHOW find a video or animated GIF of the dunk Jackson is referring to from that Carolina game, you'd be my hero. It'd probably be hard as hell though, so I don't worry yourself if it's too much trouble.

I couldn't find an animated .gif. But I found a clip of what seems to be the dunk Scoop was talking about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsE0Th50SII

It's the one at the 1:34 mark (with replays until the 1:53 mark), where he stole the inbound pass against the Tar Heels and reverse dunked it, spreading his legs and arms.

The tribute clip itself is pretty awesome. He really seemed to play like a bigger, taller, young Michael Jordan. He could jump and hang, and the block at the 1:23 mark was absolutely ludricrous.

If you want, I can send that clip to you in .flv format.



Edit:

Here's another one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qHB7TAoUUc

That dunk is the first play you see. And I am certain it's the one Scoop is talking about.

Again, I can send both clips to you in .flv if you like

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I almost cracked up when Gary Payton was dribbling the ball at the top of the key, mouthing off to the referee. Then he passed the ball, extended both his arms, gesturing and still talking to the referee.

And then the pass suddenly came back to him, and his panicked reaction was like, "Oh my god, it's the ball."

I'm very happy for GP. Finally, he's getting his ring.

Originally Posted by bishop743

Dude, T-Wolf, you're the best man! Thanks so much. I owe you one. Thanks for the offer, but I have a plugin for Firefox that lets me download .flv files. Again, thanks, I really appreciate it.

The tribute video was really good. Bias' game was beautiful to watch. He looked like man amongst boys out there. I think he would have been one of the greatest to ever play the game.

No problmen, man. Glad to help.

Thanks for pointing me to the direction of the Scoop Jackson article. It was a nice read. I never knew just how talented Len Bias was.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by bishop743

Yeah man, I think Scoop Jackson is the best sports writer ESPN has right now. Like you, I also read his stuff back in SLAM magazine as well. I try to catch him on Jim Rome is Burning when he makes an appearance too. Like I said earlier, I just like his style.

I'm glad you enjoyed the article.



This offseason is going to be an interesting one. Guys that could be possibly changing teams include: Allen Iverson, Kevin Garnett and Ben Wallace.

What's Jim Rome is Burning?

Yeah, should be an interesting offseason. Kevin McHale has gone on record saying that they're not looking to trade Kevin Garnett. Unless Kevin Garnett flat out asks for a trade, or unless they're getting another elite player in return (eg, Kobe, Lebron), they are not entertaining any proposals involving KG.

Iverson's situation seems less certain. I am still hoping for a Iverson-Garnett hookup. That would be dope.

I'm also curious as to how the Raptors will fare with that first pick. The Raptors have done well in some drafts:

In 1995 they went with Damon Stoudamire with 7th pick. It was a terrific choice at the time, consider how Stoudamire won Rookie of the Year, and gave the Raptors an identity. It's obvious now that the best player in that draft was that 5th pick, a pick that also opened the floodgate and ushered in a new era. But the Raptors did well for themselves with that 7th pick.

Toronto messed up SO BAD in the 1996 Draft. They went with Marcus Camby with the 2nd pick, when they could've picked up any of the following: Kobe Bryant, Ray Allen, Steve Nash, Jermaine O'Neal, Stephon Marbury, Antoine Walker, Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Peja Stojakovic.

1997 was genius, when they got the most exciting, and second-best player in that draft, despite drafting 9th. Too bad idiot Darrell Walker dogged him and benched him, and said he'd never make it in the NBA. Where's Darrell Walker now.

1998 was also an awesome maneuver. They picked Antawn Jamison, but knew they wanted Vince Carter, whom they immediately traded Jamison for. They even got some cash out of that trade. And let's face it, even though Vinsanity soured in 2004 and they may have even kept the wrong cousin, Vince Carter was the best thing to happen to the Raptors.

In 1999, they drafted 5th and selected Jonathan Bender (essentially for Indiana), who they used to trade for Antonio Davis. Good move, considering what a steady workhorse Davis was, and that Bender was oft injured and has now retired. But bad move, considering that Richard Hamilton, Shawn Marion, Jason Terry, Corey Maggette, Ron Artest, Andrei Kirilenko, and Wally Szczerbiak were all still available.

In 2000, they went with Mo Pete for the 21st pick. Good choice in a very weak draft. Kenyon Martin can't do anything except dunk and puff like an idiot. Darius Miles and Stromile Swift have been disappointing and inconsistent. Mike Miller was rookie of the year -- Mike Miller. In retrospect, if I had the first pick in that draft, I would've picked Desmond Mason.

In 2001, Toronto picked Michael Bradley with the 17th pick. A turd of a pick. Tony Parker and Gerald Wallace were still available, not to mention Jamaal Tinsley, Zach Randolph, and Samuel Dalembert.

In 2002, the Raptors picked Kareem Rush for the lowly 20th pick and traded with the Lakers for Lindsey Hunter. Whatever. Too bad Tayshaun Prince was still on the board.

In 2003, Chris Bosh was a sweeeet 4th pick. He seems to be improving every year, and is drawing the Kevin Garnett comparisons. Even Miami wanted Chris Bosh, but they had the 5th pick and had to settle for this Dwyane Wade kid.

In 2004, it was another crappy pick. Selecting 8th, Toronto picked Rafael Araujo. What the hell is that. Why couldn't they pick Andre Iguodala or Josh Smith.

In 2005, they redeemed themselves by picking Charlie Villanueva at 7th. This kid scored 48 points this past March.

2006 -- NUMBER ONE PICK. DON'T SCREW THIS UP.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by bishop743

After the season the Pistons won the championship against the Lakers, they had a chance to take Carmelo Anthony but chose Darko instead. As far as Darko is concerned, yeah that was a pretty bad pick, but 'Melo may have messed up the chemistry on that team since he is a guy who needs to score a lot. .... That being said, I cannot condone their picks in '96 and 2004. That's just unacceptable.

They didn't pick Melo because they already had Tayshuan Prince at that position. This is how much they love what Prince brings to the Pistons. Melo wouldn't really fit with the current roster of Pistons.

Yeah, you're right though ... a lot of it is simply blind luck, or a crapshoot. And sometimes it takes players years to before we even start to see development (eg Jermaine O'Neal), or brilliance (eg Steve Nash).

The worst Number 1 draft pick since the inception of the lottery might just be Michael Olowokandi.

Originally Posted by bishop743

Jim Rome is Burning is a show on ESPN that comes on weekdays @ 4:30PM EST. On the show, he has a roundtable segment with different columnists, writers, former atheletes and such. Scoop Jackson is a frequent contributor to this segment.

Ah I see. I don't get ESPN here

There's nowhere I can't reach.

So, Tracy McGrady will be the cover boy of the upcoming NBA Live 07.



This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

LARRY BROWN IS OUT! Zeke is taking over.

Originally Posted by han89

I know this may sound stupid but i had to ask it:

What is the draft in NBA?

As i have started watching NBA truly since this year, this is the first draft i hear about. I used to only see scores and not care a lot.

The NBA Draft is held each year at the end of June, where all the NBA teams select new players. These young players are usually from the college level. The teams that didn't make the Playoffs participate in a lottery, with the worst team having the best chance of drafting first.

For example, in 2003 Cleveland won the lottery and was awarded with the first pick. They picked Lebron James.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by han89

Ah ok. That's good to know. So it's a nice thing to wait for. So who gets to choose first? Who came last year in last place?

The team with the worst record doesn't necessarily get to draft first. It gets the best chances (i.e. highest probability) to win that number one pick.

This year, the Raptors beat the odds (since they didn't have the worst record) and won the lottery. So they have the number one pick.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Hahaha, I just found out that the Shane Battier/Rudy Gay trade also included Stromile Swift, who ends up back in Memphis. So much for the Rockets needing athleticism to complement Yao. The Stro Show has been a big disappointment anyway.


And the Raptors swapped Charlie Villanueva (who scored 48 points as a rookie this past season) for TJ Ford from Milwaukee. Bryan Colangelo doin' his thang.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

The Pistons offered Ben Wallace a four-year, $49.6 million contract.

Big Ben doesn't like it.


It's not really an unreasonable offer. I mean, Wallace is turning 32 in September, and much of his game relies on athleticism and quickness. He has a near-zero offensive game, and shoots freethrows like that's the hardest thing in the world. For all his defensive prowess and lockdown abilities, he is not a go-to guy.

I don't think he commands more than the $12+ million per year that the Pistons are offering.

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