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Saddam Hussein to receive death penalty
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Hachifusa
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Old Jan 1, 2007, 02:43 PM Local time: Jan 1, 2007, 12:43 PM #151 of 175
I don't want to sit here and say, "Yes, they're EXACTLY the same," because obviously they aren't. But damnit, if people and their gods are allowing for gray areas when humans kill eachother, then there sure as shit needs to be some more thought on the word "justice".

And what the fuck are you talking about? If the words 'killing' and 'murdering' aren't considered taking life then what do they mean? Has it meant "having a tea party" all this time and I didn't know?
kill - to deprive of life in any manner; cause the death of; slay.
murder - to kill or slaughter inhumanly or barbarously.

First off, don't be a bastard. I know it's the rule around here and whatnot, but I was just pointing out what I thought was obvious. Anyway.

I agree that if we use religious justice as a defining force of our actions, it's pretty disturbing. I'm using simple English, here. To be more specific, killing is 'taking life', murder being more specifically taking life 'inhumanly or barbarously'. Stepping on an ant while on a walk is hardly murder. Keep your definitions in check.

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Bradylama
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Old Jan 1, 2007, 05:31 PM Local time: Jan 1, 2007, 05:31 PM #152 of 175
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Trouble is, these nasty little things called 'opinions' get all muddled up in a whole lot of those distinctions we've made up.
Which completely refutes thousands of years of written and spoken language. Ok.

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When a country enters a conflict under false pretenses or for reasons that a great deal of it's people feel are unfounded, when many believe there is no justice in the war itself, does that mean all the (religious) individuals in the millitary, the ones actually committing the killing for an unjustified reason are still somehow in the clear with their god? I know you aren't exactly saying that, but you're certainly leaving room for someone else to say it.
There's actually no room to say it. Soldiers in the field are justified in killing an enemy combatant because it comes down to simple matters of self-defense. The exception comes in the case of war crimes, which not every US soldier commits, but which should ultimately fall on the shoulders of their superiors, all the way to the top.

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If it was true that Jews were poisoning wells and hoarding money, then I can most assuredly see a justification for war.
First of all, there was never any kind of "war" against the Jews, and second you know that's not true at all. My point is that reason is determined by perspective, and whether what one has done is right or wrong ultimately depends on personal and majority opinion. Nowadays we have a different opinion of Jews, so we think it's wrong to up and kill them for being Jewish.

I don't really get your point at all. Unless you're trying to say that Justice is subjective, and therefore you're right. Which would be retarded.

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There are many "modernist" style Muslims that tend to get ignored because a lot of people have this image of a person wearing a head covering and a smock.
And why shouldn't they be ignored? If they've conformed to the dominant culture, then they're about as visible as the guy who runs the pumping station.

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RABicle
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 01:05 AM Local time: Jan 2, 2007, 02:05 PM #153 of 175
I'm not sure how they managed to do it, but somehow after no doubt months of preperation into the execution they managed to make Saddam look far more dignified than the thugs in balaclavas taking him to the gallows or the Iraqi government ministers jeering him from the crowd.

Jam it back in, in the dark.
Bradylama
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 01:54 AM Local time: Jan 2, 2007, 01:54 AM #154 of 175
It's the beard.

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takeru
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 04:18 AM Local time: Jan 2, 2007, 11:18 AM #155 of 175
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Is that codeword for fags?
I'm not English, m0ron, so don't fack me up with that sh!t. It's quite understable what I wrote. So, if you can't undetstand it, buy a brain.

Well, back to the topic --> http://observer.guardian.co.uk/world...846511,00.html

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Bradylama
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 04:23 AM Local time: Jan 2, 2007, 04:23 AM #156 of 175
It's so hard to remember if The Guardian is a tabloid or not. Can't trust any British publication, it seems.

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Interrobang
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 06:09 AM Local time: Jan 2, 2007, 05:09 AM #157 of 175
I'm not English, m0ron, so don't fack me up with that sh!t. It's quite understable what I wrote. So, if you can't undetstand it, buy a brain.
I'm still not quite understanding why you used "butt soldiers". Your insistence, that you're an illiterate cretin from Spain that doesn't even have the balls to type out "moron", doesn't help my understanding.

Your article is from five years ago and isn't related to the matter at hand. If you're trying to divert attention away from yourself, you're not doing very well.

How ya doing, buddy?

Last edited by Interrobang; Jan 2, 2007 at 06:13 AM.
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DRUNKARD


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Old Jan 2, 2007, 11:05 AM #158 of 175
Which completely refutes thousands of years of written and spoken language. Ok.
Nah, I wasn't trying to refute anything, I was just trying to make it a 'grain of salt' kinda thing.

But whatever, I lost my point somewhere in the haze between yesterday and today, so let's say I was merely pointing out that justice is subjective.

In which case... yeah, I'm mildly retarded.

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Minion
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 01:27 PM #159 of 175
It's so hard to remember if The Guardian is a tabloid or not. Can't trust any British publication, it seems.
http://www.economist.com/

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Bradylama
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 03:58 PM Local time: Jan 2, 2007, 03:58 PM #160 of 175
I was hoping somebody wouldn't bring up The Economist. Thanks a lot, Minion. =/

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Minion
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Old Jan 2, 2007, 05:23 PM #161 of 175
Always a pleasure.

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Dojomaster
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Old Jan 3, 2007, 02:14 PM #162 of 175
I don't know if this has been posted earlier, but Saddam's execution was caught on tape via camera phone:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tVG5_F5Ado

I find it kind of disturbing that I can easily find an uncensored video of this man being killed. He sure deserved it though...

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Rock
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Old Jan 3, 2007, 02:42 PM Local time: Jan 3, 2007, 09:42 PM #163 of 175
SADDAM: "Oh my God!"

NUMEROUS PERSONS start praying aloud: "May God protect those who pray for Muhammad and his descendants. Peace be with Muhammad and his followers. Further the arrival of the Mahdi and condemn his enemies!"

A SINGLE MAN shouts: "Muktada! Muktada! Muktada!"

(addressing Shiite leader Muktada al-Sadr)

SADDAM (surprised): "Muktada? This is how you show your bravery as men?"

A SINGLE MAN: "To hell with you!"

SADDAM: "Is this the pride of us Arabs?"

A SINGLE MAN: "Go to hell!"

SADDAM: "The hell that has become of Iraq?"

ANOTHER MAN (probably attourney Munkith a-Farun): "Please, this man is going to be executed. Show some respect, if you please ..."

ANOTHER MAN: "Long live Muhammad Bakir al-Sadr!"

(A relative of Muktada al-Sadr executed in 1980 by the Saddam regime)

SADDAM starts praying the Muslim creed: "I acknowledge that there is no God but God and Muhammad is his ..."

(he can't speak the last word because the executioner has already pulled the lever)

A SINGLE MAN: "The tyrant has fallen! May he rot in hell!"

NUMEROUS PERSONS: "Muhammad be praised!"

ANOTHER MAN: "Let him hang for three minutes!"

ANOTHER MAN: "No, no, step back! Let him hang for eight minutes, don't take him off!"

ANOTHER MAN is starting to pray, but is being interrupted by ANOTHER MAN yelling: "You don't pray for him!"


I translated this from a transcript posted by German news magazine "Der Spiegel" which was construced from witnesses' reports and the inofficial video.

Source: http://www.spiegel.de/politik/auslan...457586,00.html

The latest news is that the execution of Saddam Hussein was being "hijacked" by Shiite radicals.

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Old Jan 3, 2007, 08:09 PM Local time: Jan 4, 2007, 12:09 PM #164 of 175
I'm not sure how they managed to do it, but somehow after no doubt months of preperation into the execution they managed to make Saddam look far more dignified than the thugs in balaclavas taking him to the gallows or the Iraqi government ministers jeering him from the crowd.
Have to agree with this. Shameful is the one word that springs to mind regarding the general behaviour of the executioners and observers, but I guess this is what happens.

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Balcony Heckler
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Old Jan 3, 2007, 09:03 PM Local time: Jan 3, 2007, 11:33 PM #165 of 175
speaking obviously like a n00b, I would think the big question is what type of retaliation is his death going to bring? Bush said probably the most intelligent thing I've heard him say when he said that this will not bring an end to terrorism. yeah, give him a fuckin miller for that one. it's just going to result in worse terrorist leaders than saddam coming out of the woodwork now

I was speaking idiomatically.


You know what? you just might be full enough of shit to apply for congress
Hachifusa
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Old Jan 4, 2007, 02:32 PM Local time: Jan 4, 2007, 12:32 PM #166 of 175
ANOTHER MAN (probably attourney Munkith a-Farun): "Please, this man is going to be executed. Show some respect, if you please ..."

...

A SINGLE MAN: "The tyrant has fallen! May he rot in hell!"

...


ANOTHER MAN is starting to pray, but is being interrupted by ANOTHER MAN yelling: "You don't pray for him!"
I don't see what they expect; this man led their country like this. I mean, I'm sure it's "undignified" or whatever, but I wonder if they thought that the crowd wasn't going to jeer him at all.
Quote:
ANOTHER MAN: "Let him hang for three minutes!"

ANOTHER MAN: "No, no, step back! Let him hang for eight minutes, don't take him off!"
I like how they picked the most random numbers they could.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?
darkrose16
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Old Feb 22, 2007, 12:47 AM Local time: Feb 22, 2007, 12:47 AM #167 of 175
I watched his execution on youtube because I wanted to see if it was the real video. I know he was a terrible man, but he was praying and they dropped him in the middle of his sentence which I wasn't expecting. I heard that after his body was taken down that they danced around it or something along those lines. It sounded like something totally disrespectful, but for someone like him, I guess people felt like he deserved it.

FELIPE NO
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