[Manga] non-Japanese manga

I'm really just curious what everyone thinks of manga made outside of Japan. Not really manhwa from Korea, because I tend find it generally okay. I'm more focusing on manga from America and Europe than anything.

It's been a while since Tokyopop's "Manga Revolution" started and I was really just curious what everyone thought of it now that there are quite a few non-Japanese made titles have been released.

I'm kinda on the fence here with whether I like it or not.
I'm working on some stuff myself(who's not nowadays?) and for me it's at least refreshing to see that it's possible to do something like this. It doesn't really seem to being going anywhere either. It's turned out to be a lot less of a fad than I think most of us thought it would. I like Sokora Refugees(seems cool so far but she's slow to make new volumes) and Vampire Kisses(at least artwork-wise...I haven't read Vampire Kisses yet but the art rocks). Dramacon is okay, too.
At the same time, there is a lot of shit coming out and it's no wonder a lot of the "otaku" crowd hate non-Japanese manga. Go look up Divaliscious(sp?) and MBQ. Some of the stuff looks nothing like manga at all and really feels like it's the reject stuff that Marvel and DC said "hell no" to(and with good reason). I've seen one that looks like a bad Archie comics rip off. That's just wrong, dude. Just because it's packaged like a manga doesn't mean it is one.

What do you guys think? Find anything good? Do any of you think that if the quality got better and they found better artists and writers that non-Japanese manga might be more popular? Discuss.

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From the little I've seen, I'm not particularly captivated. Especially seeing samples of some Korean manga first of all like Alichino and Tarot Cafe. Korean stuff seems to have a distinct art style and you can seem to be able to tell exactly when it is Korean from first glance. It annoys me unexplicably for some reason, the way the eyes and hair and such are drawn.

However looking at American stuff I'm disenchanted. The stories of each one I want to check out sound decent, but in the end they turn out to give the impression of "American black and white comics" to me. There are no interesting premises to look at and the only one I was slightly intrigued by was Bizenghast. I think it's more attributed to a predisposition against NA attempts at manga.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Because you excluded manhwa, I really cant say I like manga outside Japan. I've read Ragnarok and Demon Diary and other manhwa and really enjoyed them... but Americanized manga/anime just tick me off. I felt like most were just trying to sap into the whole 'Pokemon/YugiOh' phenomena... kids would see it, think of these shows, and want to buy/watch it.

In fact, I cant think of any American-created manga that I felt any interest in. They either appeal to the kids or use the Japanese model to draw more risque characters. I think American needs to stick to the 'real' comic books, and leave the 'real' manga to Japan.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

I've read a few that I've liked, and a few that I didn't like. I don't really see why where it comes from should mean anything, as long as it's good.

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I have read some Korean manga, and my feeling is bit mixed. The best korean manga I read so far would probably Rebirth, Zero, and Hot-blooded girl, other than that, there are nothing but cliche shoujo titles and most with crappy artwork. They do have potential, but they should somehow not draw men being too girly on shoujo titles.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Well, I excluded Korean stuff just because I haven't really heard anything bad about it. I decide to focus this thread more on American and European manga than anything. I like most Korean stuff myself.

eriol33 you should check out Ragnarok. It was pretty good, and was one of the first manga I ever read. The only downside is that the guy who makes it is the same guy who does the character designs and such for Ragnarok Online, and he stopped making the manga at volume 10(or at least thats all we've gotten over here in America anyway), so the series just kind of stops for seemingly no reason.

Anyway, back on the topic. My opinion of American manga in particular is kind of poor as well. Personally, I kinda feel like there should be better...I don't know...quality control? That might be the best term for it. There's a lot of crap that's being put out that really doesn't look or feel like manga at all. It's no wonder so many people think the whole thing is a cash-in. Let's make some stuff that looks like manga and see if it will sell. Some of this stuff just really looks like the shit that Marvel, DC, Image, and Darkhourse said "hell no" to and for whatever reason Tokyopop said "Sure, why not?". It also kinda seems like the artists aren't really puting enough effort into their stuff either. It all has that American Saturday morning cartoon look to it. The tone work is horrible, and even the Photoshoped covers look like some of the bad stuff I've seen off of DeviantArt.
At the same time, I can't help but feel sorry for them because I kinda know how they feel. It's one of those things where no one really thinks you can do it, you know? So you try anyway, because it's what you really want to do. I'm a creative person and drawing is how I use my creativity. I've been doing it for a long time, and my style has always kind of been anime or manga-like even when I didn't realize what it was. So making my own manga seems natural to me. People have been making fan art and manga for years on the internet before manga ever got big in the States, so it's not like this is something new. It's just more publisized now. I'm certainly not going to just give up now. Also, what people forget is that over in Japan, not only have they been making manga for a looong time now, they also have whole college courses just for learning to make manga. We don't have that over here in America. I think the University here has like one manga course, which is certainly not enough. Everything I know, I learned on my own. We have a long way to go before we ever catch up to Japan anyway, just because we are so many years behind them as far as our actually skills are concerned.
My personal opinion is that, as artist and writers, if we want our manga to be taken seriously, we need to take a lot more time to get our skills much better than they our before we attempt to have our stuff put in print form. If it doesn't look like a manga, no one will even give it a chance.

I guess I was just trying to see if anyone agreed with me. I mean, to me, If it was just better quality and at least generally looked and felt like a manga should when you read it I think it would appeal to a wider audience. I think then we could really say "Well it depends on the title and whether or not it fits my tastes." Instead of "Well, it's not Japanese." What do you guys think?

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

somewhile ago i had read some korean manga (forgot the name) and it was really good
like the art and everything but it got shunned by other manga fans cause it was korean

sad but most think japanese > over any other asian artwork
if only these guys knew that most of the anime out now is drawn by koreans.

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I would probably find any DC/Marvel comic series appallingly unpalatable in manga style. Just my two cents. I enjoy reading Batman / Justice League / Iron Man / whatever in the style it was meant to be articulated. It has a distinguished, beautiful art style of its own already, why ruin it? (Probably similar to what Temari said above. )

Korean artwork while different in flavor from the Japanese manga, it's very similar in style. I tend to enjoy most of the Korean manwha's I come across, but as far as Japanese manga go, I like going to my local manga-book rental store and propping up my feet on a comfy sofa for 3 hours reading through a 6-8 vol. series while sipping a smoothie - all for the low cost of $2 an hour.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Aside from the occasional Korean manhwa I've come across, I've also read Dramacon, which I found alright. The art style was a little different, but things like facial expressions and the superdeformed style were also present. The first volume came out way before the second volume was released though. I stopped reading it a while back.

Jam it back in, in the dark.