Star Trek VS Star Wars

LeHah, I love your arguements! You give actual reasons for... whatever! That "subtexts" part... I hadn't even noticed that about Yoda.

So, when's George Lucas releasing that TV series that happens between Ep. III and Ep. IV? If they don't give it a *big* budget I hope they don't make it at all...

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by LeHah

So instead of Para saying it - you'll just making an awful neon sign of an insinuation in the following sentence...

Perhaps something is wrong with him, or perhaps he just doesn't like it Star Trek? Because between you and me, one of my earliest memories is watching reruns of TOS with my dad and loving every second of them. (When you're at that early age, you don't notice that the sets and effects are uber-cheap looking. You're just like "Wow! Space Monsters!")

Saying that your idiot 5 year old cousin doesn't like Star Trek is like saying my cousin's sister's half-brother's wife doesn't like it. That doesn't mean shit to anyone here since you can't quantify shit with age.

(Don't I remember having a pissing match with you earlier this year that ended with you looking like a fag and being tempbanned? Don't Marty McFly this shit and do it again)

The point is, Star Wars is easier to follow for him.

And I was never tempbanned. I helped save GFF in the first place. All I remember from the BSG thread is me making another argument and you never replying again.

My cousin isn't an idiot. Fuck you to hell.

You just don't understand real life. You can't accept that Star Wars is more likeable to the young ones because its easier to follow and understand.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

The point is, Star Wars is easier to follow for him.

That doesn't quantify shit, though. My cat is entertained by birds - that doesn't make Star Trek stupid or smart.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I helped save GFF in the first place.

WHAT

Originally Posted by Borg1982

All I remember from the BSG thread is me making another argument and you never replying again.

Oh yeah, thats right.

I didn't respond to your ass-fuckery after a while because you were going in circles like a retarded kid stuck on a leash and running around their parent's legs.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

My cousin isn't an idiot. Fuck you to hell.

Oh, eat the creamy, loving shit that comes out of my ass at 8:30 every morning, you jizzbomb. CRY ME SOME FUCKING TEARS, AFRIKA.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

You just don't understand real life. You can't accept that Star Wars is more likeable to the young ones because its easier to follow and understand.

Post of the Year.

How can you quantify liking a movie as "real life"? How is it that you demand that "Star Wars is more likeable" because its "easier to follow"? How is it that you continue to post the same nonsense repeatedly, get the same responses and then still demand that the other person is wrong? I mean - are you the *only* correct person in the world?

See, the problem is you don't make concise points at all. You never have, either. I understand "real life" - I hold a working job, pay my bills, pay my rent, drive a car to work, fight traffic, go out to the bar with friends, have a social life and if I'm lucky, cram my dick down some slut's throat. See, those things - work, friends, sex - are real life, not your asinine fucktard opinion for geekery in 2006. Real life isn't about Star Wars being easier to understand than Star Trek - because Topic A (Real Life) has nothing to do with Topic B (Star Wars / Star Trek).

In trying to get through to you, am I just trying to squeeze an orange to get apple juice? Is this futile? Am I the bigger idiot because I expect you to suddenly start having reasonable responses and posts involving deductive logic instead of monkey-shit-smeared dumbass niggerpot middle school fucktardisms? Is it too fucking much that I want you to make yourself a reasonable human being?

Well, perhaps - given that we're still both posting in a rather stupid thread subject.

But get this much - you *never* make points. See, you can say "Star Trek is smarter!" till you're blue in the face - but you don't have any facts to lay down as foundation. I can say "Niggers steal shit!" and then tell you that demographicly, black people have been second class citizens and are forced to steal and cheat and cut each other's throats because thats what they learned to do to survive.

Which statement has more weight? Mine does - I told you why black people are always taking shit off my laundry line and hiding in my garbage cans. You didn't tell me anything except the topic. Thats ... not interesting, or intelligent.

Get with the smart posting, dickless.

I was speaking idiomatically.

I like how my post was deleted for being off topic, and yet the previous posts remain.

As I stated before:

UT OH, INTERNET WAR

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Matt

I like how my post was deleted for being off topic, and yet the previous posts remain.

As I stated before:

UT OH, INTERNET WAR

UT OH, THREAD BAN

How ya doing, buddy?

You don't understand reality. The reality that if you asked a full classroom of children which one they would rather watch, the majority would raise their hands for Star Wars. If you think that is false, then you have a lot to learn about what majority rule thinks. If the kids were subjected to Star Wars and Star Trek, they would also raise their hands in saying the Star Wars movie was better & more entertaining to them.
If you disagree with the above, then... wow. In fact, sometimes I think you argue with people just to fulfill your sad little life, when in reality you don't even believe what you're saying. Nobody is stupid enough to actually believe that Star Wars is harder to understand.

I don't want to see you reply on it. I'm done talking about it.

Furthermore, arguing with you is like arguing with my 23 year old friend. After about one minute he resorts to personal attacks and swear words. You lost all credibility. You have zero credibility in any of your posts because of it. I'm done talking about it. I've never in my years at GFF or in any board seen anyone as pointless to argue with than you. I'm done fueling your mass immaturity or this "tactic" you have to have fun with yourself.

Go ahead, reply to each and every one of these sentances. You will be doing it for nothing.

Goodbye.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

You don't understand reality. The reality that if you asked a full classroom of children which one they would rather watch, the majority would raise their hands for Star Wars.

I want you to quantify that with facts. Let me see you do it - let me see a poll or a CNN pie-chart or a survey or something. Until you do that, you will not and cannot be taken seriously.

Telling me the sky is red does not make it red. Telling me rotten food is delicious does not make it so. Telling me that a room full of children agree with you does not make a plausable arguement just because.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

If you think that is false, then you have a lot to learn about what majority rule thinks.

You'd have a point if you were a majority. You speak for Borg1982, but not Mrs Krim's first grade class. Do you see what I'm getting at yet?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

If the kids were subjected to Star Wars and Star Trek, they would also raise their hands in saying the Star Wars movie was better & more entertaining to them.

See my original arguement. You can sell me all this crap but no one is buying it. The fact that you run a produce stand does not reserve you the right to throw rotten fruit at people because they will not buy it. Stop acting like the imaginary children you profess as your evidence.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

If you disagree with the above, then... wow.

I do disagree. Adamently. See, its not hard to fight against something when theres nothing there. You are a house without a basement, a church without pillars. There is no logical grounding for anything you're saying so far and I'm getting the feeling that you don't quite understand that. I'm trying not to lose my temper with you, in all honestly, because calling you out as the dumbass you're acting won't make you learn any quicker.

But you *do* realize that no one here is jumping to your defense? No on here is correcting me? No one else is agreeing with you? Silence is deafening and maybe I'm the patron saint of lost causes like you - but shit, I will teach you how to form a cohesive and legit line of thought if its the last thing I do.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

In fact, sometimes I think you argue with people just to fulfill your sad little life, when in reality you don't even believe what you're saying. Nobody is stupid enough to actually believe that Star Wars is harder to understand.

Well, see, theres nothing hard to understand about Star Trek either. TOS had a bunch of metaphorical stories - metaphors about racism, metaphors about the Vietnam war, metaphors about hard choices we all make. Thats not so hard to understand, is it? Good sci-fi - Star Trek at its best - is simply a morality play covered over with the gloss of special effects. Phasers and Klingons are just a new way of saying handguns and african americans.

There is nothing hard to understand about Star Trek. It's very accessable - the only thing thats hard to understand is why you continue this line of thought. Are you so adament at proving me wrong because you honestly believe you're right - or because you just don't want me to prove you wrong?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I don't want to see you reply on it. I'm done talking about it.

Coward's way out. Not to mention - you followed this statement with a paragraph. Way to leave the conversation.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Furthermore, arguing with you is like arguing with my 23 year old friend.

Again - how does age quantify anything? I know very mature and very immature 23 year olds. Now, if you had told me arguing with me reminds you of arguing with someone we both know - like, I don't know, Lt Cmdr Data - you'd have a brazen point because we both know who that is.

Now that you're saying "you remind me of a 23 year old I know", we both know thats bullshit because not all 23 year olds are as well spoken as I have been in this thread - and that there are 23 year olds who are better spoken than I.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

After about one minute he resorts to personal attacks and swear words.

Well, simply put, you're frustrating. I'm making specific, quantifiable and I'd like to think somewhat astute observations on why you make no sense - and you continue to not make sense. "Give a man a fish..." and all that jazz. I really want someone to chime in and tell me where I'm wrong in this - someone other than Borg1982. Where did I go wrong in this thread? I don't think calling someone a shithead on the internet really counteracts against my writing paragraph after paragraph about how wrong you are in the first place.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I'm done talking about it.

This is the second time you've said that - and the second time you've gone on anyway. Make up your mind.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I've never in my years at GFF or in any board seen anyone as pointless to argue with than you.

Because I refuse to understand you? Or because you refuse to make any sense? Your choice - but I don't think you'd like the correct answer.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Go ahead, reply to each and every one of these sentances. You will be doing it for nothing.

If it's any consolation - I skipped a couple.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Goodbye.

Sadly, I doubt that.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

The funny thing is that he could actually make a cogent argument about how Star Trek deals with many more complex social issues that children are not likely able to fully comprehend than Star Wars does (or so I've heard), but doesn't quite pull it off.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Minion

The funny thing is that he could actually make a cogent argument about how Star Trek deals with many more complex social issues that children are not likely able to fully comprehend than Star Wars does (or so I've heard), but doesn't quite pull it off.

Thats actually a valid statement because I certainly wouldn't understand any crazy alagory for the Vietnam War at a very young age. However, he completely circumvents that and says "NO U R WRNG" and leaves it at that.

I wouldn't be surprised if he comes back and points at your post as what he was meaning to say though. I don't buy that myself because it's not like your post is some incredibly complex thought process - you just happen to know how to present an idea with some meat to it.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

#1

Originally Posted by Borg1982

In fact, sometimes I think you argue with people just to fulfill your sad little life, when in reality you don't even believe what you're saying.

#2

Originally Posted by LeHah

Thats actually a valid statement because I certainly wouldn't understand any crazy alagory for the Vietnam War at a very young age.

Quote 1: Assumes something about Lehah.

Quote 2: Proves that Lehah is helping my point of view, and is therefore helping me affirm what I said on quote #1.

Thanks for helping!

Originally Posted by LeHah

This is the second time you've said that - and the second time you've gone on anyway. Make up your mind.

I said "I'm done talking about it" the first time to tell you I'm done talking about Star Wars & Star Trek. I said "I'm done talking about it" the second time to tell you I'm done talking about your lack of credibility and other such stuff. Both times i said that were for DIFFERENT things.

This post proves I came back anyway. OMG! LeHah wins! He beat me in a "Borg will come back to this post" argument! My life is over!
The fact is, what you said before with all the attacks & irrelevant swearing got irritating, so I didn't want to fuel you anymore. But you did a better job at keeping cool just recently, so I came back. Good boy!

Originally Posted by LeHah

But you *do* realize that no one here is jumping to your defense?

I was the one originally coming to someone elses defense. He just isn't coming back because he'd rather not get attacked by you. I couldn't give a shit what you say about me. It was sad to attack a 5 year old though. I also will choose whether or not to respond based upon how mature you choose to be in a reply. Your recent post dignified a response.

Finally, just by surfing for any script from any Star Trek show, seeing this:


Radiation bursts from the star's
surface are making precise sensor
readings difficult. It seems to
be exhibiting gravitational
instability.
Sir, I am detecting a
transmission... emanating from
within this system.
Indeterminate. I am attempting
to screen out sensor
interference...
Just studying the components in
your prosthesis.
We had to disguise it as something
innocuous.

...does not at all appeal to young children. I'm sure I watched plenty of TOS and TNG when I was little. I definitely did not care for when they used big words like this when I was very young. I'm sure I liked space battles, fights and easy to understand scenes more. But since Trek is a mix of both, I probably only liked parts of it. (Later it became my favorite series ever because I rewatched a lot and started to fully 100% understand it).

We aren't going to settle this argument through the internet. We cannot beg CNN to do a "young children Trek VS Wars report" poll. Why don't you go out and ask kids their opinion of both. But why should you? You already helped me! (see top of this post)!

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Quote 1: Assumes something about Lehah.

Quote 2: Proves that Lehah is helping my point of view, and is therefore helping me affirm what I said on quote #1.

You *almost* had something there. Almost. At least you're getting the idea of backing up what you're saying with other things.

However, in this case, you fail because you leave too much open. See, your quote is an assumption - which is basicly just you giving an opinion of me. Okay, thats fine - but then you use a quote of mine out of context when talking to someone else. Thats... not much of a leg to stand on.

But do you see what I did here? You posed something toward me - "Assumes Something About LeHah" - and I just said why it isn't. However, points for effort.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I said "I'm done talking about it" the first time to tell you I'm done talking about Star Wars & Star Trek.

So then we have several problems here:

1.) You didn't discern what you were talking about, you just said "I'm done" several times. Well, done with what? I had thought the whole conversation, but you kept saying it.

2.) By now saying you're done with the topic - you just admited to threadjacking by saying you're done with the subject, but you'll keep posting anyway.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I said "I'm done talking about it" the second time to tell you I'm done talking about your lack of credibility and other such stuff.

Thats a funny thing to say given that I give examples and explainations as to what I'm saying. You just assume people understand you when you leave things open ended - like when you said "I'm done" several times.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Both times i said that were for DIFFERENT things.

You didn't discern anything though. You didn't show us how it was different.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

He beat me in a "Borg will come back to this post" argument! My life is over!

I think anyone who reads this thread will show that I wasn't really pining for that. I think calling you nigger balls or baby eating fucktard would be more of a lure than saying "Sadly, I doubt that".

But see - heres another thing. You piss and moan about how I insult you to high heaven - but when I *don't* and go out of my way to make a clear, logical and rather solid post about why you're not making sense, you piss and moan anyway by making fun of me.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I was the one originally coming to someone elses defense. He just isn't coming back because he'd rather not get attacked by you.

Who? Where? Why is he so scared of people on the internet? Are you some kind of superhero? First you tell me you saved GFF and now you're telling me you're protecting someone.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

It was sad to attack a 5 year old though.

I told my girlfriend if she didn't shut up, I'd rape her.

So whats your point?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I also will choose whether or not to respond based upon how mature you choose to be in a reply.

Uh, thank you? Man, do you get a nose bleed from that high a horse?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Finally, just by surfing for any script from any Star Trek show, seeing this

I dunno. TRON is a pretty technical movie. I didn't know that TRON was the BASIC command for debugging. But I still enjoyed the movie when I was 5 or 6. Lights and motorcycles and crazy computer talk about programs and MASTER CONTROL and stuff. Its still fun - even now that it really doesn't make a lick of sense.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I'm sure I watched plenty of TOS and TNG when I was little.

...you just undid your entire arguement.

I was speaking idiomatically.

90% of the above post has nothing to do with the main topic here. Honestly, who cares if I said "I'm done talking about it" and who cares about your analysis of how I said that and any inconsistencies thereof (all of which have nothing to do with the main topic). Shall we stop the analyzing of our name-calls against each other and other irrelevant things?

The other 10% of your post finally went to the main topic.

1. Do you understand what I meant by the "big words" argument that I made, and do you completely disagree with me as always?

2. Allow me to clarify (I didn't at all clarify). I was subjected to TOS & TNG when I was little. (It is the same to say I watched it; aka had my eyes on it). I have clear and vivid memories of being bored for most of it, and since I had no control over the TV, I just sat there and watched anyway. I picked television over being 100% bored. (Later in life, as I said, I loved Trek).

3. Don't you recall that Para is the one that started this idea of one being easier to understand than the other? Clearly, he's just gone now. Probably doesn't want to put up with name-calls. To me, it's just a message board topic. I'll choose what to reply to when I want.

Originally Posted by Para

It is understandable that Star Wars would receive more popularity as it is an easier to understand story compared to Star Trek due to the depth difference between the two.

4. He said it was understandable. He didn't say "Easy to understand things are always better to the majority no matter what". He understands it. You probably don't understand it. Are you irritated in the fact that more people voted Star Wars in this poll? I knew that would happen, myself.
Please pick apart what he said and tell me why its disagreeable to you.

EDIT ADD: http://enterprisevsties.ytmnd.com/ Proof that Trek > Wars!
:biggrin:

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Honestly, who cares if I said "I'm done talking about it" and who cares about your analysis of how I said that and any inconsistencies thereof (all of which have nothing to do with the main topic).

...But it does have to do with why you're making nonsense posts. See, how do you expect anyone especially me to take you seriously if you hem and haw about this? The fact that you have these reoccuring "inconsistencies" is one of the reasons we keep having these shitfests.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Shall we stop the analyzing of our name-calls against each other and other irrelevant things?

I don't see how my saying "Water is wet, shithead" invalidates the fact that water is indeed wet. (Although, if you are offended by "shithead" either you see yourself as a shithead before I even said it - or you're James Caan in Alien Nation)

Originally Posted by Borg1982

1. Do you understand what I meant by the "big words" argument that I made, and do you completely disagree with me as always?

I don't know about always. I don't think I've read EVERY post you've ever made. But a lot of the ones I do respond to are in the vein of you saying "NO UR RONG". And why? Because I like taking cheap shots sometimes.

Do not put it past me to treat you like you deserve to be treated. If you are going to act dumb, I'm going to treat you like you're acting dumb.

As for the "Big Words" part - the Star Wars prequels have big words. Whats the opening crawl to The Phantom Menace? The taxation of trade routes to outlying star systems is in dispute....

I don't know about you - but what kid cares about trade disputes? BORING. Why not read him a Tax Code book?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I was subjected to TOS & TNG when I was little.

You're not allowed to backpeddle. If you're too stupid to see you stomped out your entire point, then there really may be no helping you. It's not a complicated thought that I plucked out of your post either - you'd been arguing that children wouldn't like Star Trek because of it's "big words" but then you outright said that you watched it as a kid.

No, sorry, thats an unforgiveable failure, even for you.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

3. Don't you recall that Para is the one that started this idea of one being easier to understand than the other? Clearly, he's just gone now. Probably doesn't want to put up with name-calls. To me, it's just a message board topic. I'll choose what to reply to when I want.

To coin a phrase "Give Para what is due to Para and give God what is due to God"

Don't go playing the hero card. It doesn't fly.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

He understands it. You probably don't understand it.

I understand it perfectly - he has an ego problem. He was saying "I like Star Trek more because it's harder to understand - thusly, I am more intelligent for liking it!" This is a similar problem with assholes who like Battlestar Galactica - neither show is "intelligent" per se. I don't see Picard and Riker exchanging blows over pre-Marxism ideals of the Russian monarchy.

Star Wars and Star Trek are equally "intelligent". Many people understand them and not all of those people are intelligent. To say one is smarter than the other is to have an ego problem.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Are you irritated in the fact that more people voted Star Wars in this poll?

Why would that mean anything? I have all the Star Wars movies in my room - but I also just bought the entire run of TNG two weeks ago. I like them both for their strengths, despite both their weaknesses.

(As an aside, YTMND was never funny)

How ya doing, buddy?

If you think when I say "But Trek was mostly boring when I was little" is back peddling, then how can the argument continue? Do you not believe me when I say that? If you think I'm starting to lie, or something, to get my point across, then why talk anymore about that? Go out and start asking kids their opinion.

But why bring up kids into this? The fact is, just by watching Trek, you know you are watching something with levels of dialogue that are a few notches up compared to other stuff. Star Wars may have a few scenes of this, but not many.

3 hours of class and 2 of driving time... gotta go.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

If you think when I say "But Trek was mostly boring when I was little" is back peddling, then how can the argument continue?

A wise statement - yet you posted again.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Do you not believe me when I say that?

Explain what this means, exactly. You seem to say it a lot. The fact that I question you does not mean I'm calling you an outright liar. Perhaps I should've been more exacting but I don't believe you because I can't understand you becuase you seem to have no reasoning, no clear line of thought and no understanding of how to show deduction - A leads to B leads to C.

I cannot believe you if you don't make sense because, well, you don't make sense. I do not speak German, so if someone told me that "The sky is blue" in German - he would be correct, but how do I know that if I don't understand him?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

If you think I'm starting to lie, or something, to get my point across, then why talk anymore about that? Go out and start asking kids their opinion.

You made the point of asking children. The proof of burden is on you. Notice how I didn't say "Three Out Of Four Doctors..." or "Fifty Percent Of..." because I cannot quantify that. Well, I could but that requires me to go out and bother strangers and doctors and they have better stuff to do.

I am not a spokesperson for a number of people - like you pigeonholed yourself as with the "ask the children" nonsense. You made that bed, you sleep in it.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

But why bring up kids into this?

WHAT

You are the one bringing kids into this. You started by citing your 5 year old cousin as a source and then a classroom of children.

Originally Posted by Borg1982, Mar 29, 2006, 07:58 PM

My five year old cousin likes Star Wars

Originally Posted by Borg1982, Yesterday, 01:57 PM

The reality that if you asked a full classroom of children which one they would rather watch...

That is YOUR doing. Do not blame me for your shitty inability to make a concise point, nor your inability to stick with it.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

The fact is, just by watching Trek, you know you are watching something with levels of dialogue that are a few notches up compared to other stuff. Star Wars may have a few scenes of this, but not many.

Star Trek may have a few scenes of mythos, but not many.

Star Trek may have a few scenes of starfighters, but not many.

Star Trek may have a few scenes of capital ship battles, but not many.

So... whats your point exactly?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

3 hours of class and 2 of driving time... gotta go.

OH SHIT GOTTA BAIL

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Back from my school/drive...(and I see you paranoia-drivenly thought that I quit the thread or something? Weird).

I didn't mean "Don't bring up kids in this argument anymore, LeHah."
I meant: "What's the point? Why bring that up anymore? How about we retract that and talk about the core episodes vs. Star Wars movies."

Secondly, you say the burden of proof is on me, but there is no way that I can conduct studies with children and show you them in person. But I already know what I personally believe about the world. If you are seriously curious about what majority thinks, start to ask people.

But again, lets retract the childrens opinion crap and get down to the main point: The episode quotes that I pasted in previous messages show thaton average, Star Trek episodes are going to be more intellectual, solely because of dialogue - not specifically world issues like "Vietnam". Star Wars movies may have "intellectual" scenes, but the vast majority is easy to understand stuff.

Nothing is black & white. Nothing is 100%. But remember what the word average means.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Never was a fan of either. If I had to decide though I'd go with Star Wars.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

You know, Star Trek TOS was defined as an age when men were men, women wore miniskirts, and shit blew up. Even though the science used in it was flimsy at best and horrid at worst, the science for the most part generally took a back seat to the plot and storylines of the show. Frankly, it was a good show.

Then along comes TNG, with it's man-skirts, a Federation that's become a bunch of peacenik appeasing morons who are willing to sell out the actual peace and security of the Federation for well, what they perceive to be peace and security, and a bald Frenchman with an almost religious belief in the "Prime Directive" which is basically a key word for "Moral Cowardice." It also gave the idiots at B&B the chance to introduce the "EPS," or Electro Plasma System into the show to the detriment of the Star Trek series. I can just imagen the conversation where this idea was introduced amonst the writers.

"HEY, I HAVE AN IDEA, INSTEAD OF USING REGULAR ELECTRICITY TO POWER THE CONSOLES, LET'S RUN SUPERHEATED FUCKING PLASMA THROUGH THEM INSTEAD, THAT WAY WE CAN INJURE AND KILL AS MANY CHARACTERS AS POSSIBLE WITHOUT HAVING TO ACTUALLY WRITE UP AN ACTUAL PLOT REASON FOR HAVING THEM BE INJURED OR DYING." Yeah... -_-

Then we get DS9, which is a Space based Soap Opera with about the same mentality as a regular soap opera, but with a lot more bullshit and bad plot devices trying to pass themselves off as "Science and creative writing," when the words bullshit and Technobabble is far more appropriate.

Then we get Voyager, which is the main reason that the people at B&B are referred to as Brainless&Brainless. What's worse, this series really did have a chance to be a good show, but instead, it stunk worse than a steaming pile of dog shit on a hot summer day. What's worse, it totally killed the notion of the borg as being a true threat and made them into something of a running plot joke time and time again. If you want bad writing, crappy acting, and even worse dialogue and technobabble, instead of substance and plot, then by god, Voyager is the show for you.


No, I acknowledge easily that Star Wars has a few bullshit technologies, but that comparison is nothing when compared to the scores of mistakes and flaws that Star Trek has. And no, the blame doesn't entirely lie on the series as much as it does with the writers at B&B. They are responsible for the death of Star Trek.

Most amazing jew boots

I love both. In fact, I have all Star Trek movies and all Star Wars movies.

I was speaking idiomatically.

TNG is my all time favorite TV series (season three being my favorite of the seven seasons) and the Star Wars OT (in unaltered form) is a timeless masterpiece of a trilogy that I can watch over and over again. I'll just say I love them both (when Star Trek is done right) rather than try to make a pointless comparison. However, if it's a movie to movie thing (which would be fairer than comparing a TV show to a motion picture), I'd give it to Star Wars for sure.

Originally Posted by Robo Jesus

Then along comes TNG, with it's man-skirts

Fortunately that didn't last past the first season and was a rare sighting either way.

Originally Posted by Robo Jesus

and a bald Frenchman with an almost religious belief in the "Prime Directive" which is basically a key word for "Moral Cowardice."

He violated it many times when he felt he had to. (The Drumhead) Otherwise they explain the principle of noninterference more than once, and they also bring up how it sometimes results in moral cowardice as well. (The High Ground)

Originally Posted by Robo Jesus

It also gave the idiots at B&B the chance to introduce the "EPS," or Electro Plasma System into the show to the detriment of the Star Trek series.

Well, I think Star Trek generally went downhill (even if there are some good episodes you can pick out from later episodes and series) after Gene Roddenberry died (and also after Ron Jones stopped composing for episodes), so I won't comment on the stupid ideas of Berman and Braga. Berman feels the need to have a "science conflict" in every episode regardless of whether or not it fits with what the episode is about. And he was against the concept of the episode Darmok, which most would agree is one of the best TNG episodes, so he just sucks in my eyes.

Originally Posted by Robo Jesus

And no, the blame doesn't entirely lie on the series as much as it does with the writers at B&B. They are responsible for the death of Star Trek.

Couldn't agree more.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Back from my school/drive...(and I see you paranoia-drivenly thought that I quit the thread or something?)

I'm not sure what telling us you're away from your keyboard is suppose to do aside from paint you as an asshole. "Hey I can't respond because I'm doing something else" is pretty silly - we all go outside, we all have jobs or school. So whats the point in telling us "I can't respond because I'm doing something else"?

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I didn't mean "Don't bring up kids in this argument anymore, LeHah." I meant: "What's the point? Why bring that up anymore? How about we retract that and talk about the core episodes vs. Star Wars movies."

If you had said that as your second or even third post - I'd totally agree and let this whole thing slide. But as it is - I just think you're throwing down the towel and putting up the white flag because you painted yourself into a corner.

Here - I'm going to let you be the bigger man - don't respond to this post. Don't even reply to this thread. Make me look like the ass for once.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Secondly, you say the burden of proof is on me, but there is no way that I can conduct studies with children and show you them in person.

That was my point entirely. Don't use numbers or sweeping gestures without having anything to back them up with.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

But I already know what I personally believe about the world.

Yet you earlier spoke of "majority". Which is it, now? You conflict with yourself every time you post. Besides, what you think of the world doesn't mean a shit, shake, fuck or damn to me. I didn't ask you what you thought a bunch of imaginary people think - I asked you what you thought and you can't even give me anything worthwhile.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

If you are seriously curious about what majority thinks, start to ask people.

I didn't say "a full classroom of children" - YOU did. I can't give less of a shit about what a bunch of people think. A bunch of people like awful things. Many people like terrible things. Millions of people like millions of terrible things.

How do I quantify that? You and I both know people that eat spinach which is awful, many people care what Paris Hilton does with her terrible hair and there are millions of people who think they know tons about politics but treat the electoral college like it's some giant conspiracy by the Bush Administration.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

The episode quotes that I pasted in previous messages show thaton average, Star Trek episodes are going to be more intellectual, solely because of dialogue

You've still not made a good example of that. At all. Ever. On this entire page.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

...not specifically world issues like "Vietnam". Star Wars movies may have "intellectual" scenes, but the vast majority is easy to understand stuff.

The "Vietnam" thing I was refering to was TOS, not Star Wars.

And would you listen to yourself? You're a snob. "I like this show because it is smart! That must mean I'm an intellectual!"

Stow it. You don't impress anyone here.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Nothing is black & white. Nothing is 100%. But remember what the word average means.

What the shit does that have to do with anything?

FELIPE NO

I think you got angry when this whole issue of me & para supposedly hopping on our "high horse". Allow me to clarify:

I don't like Trek because it is "smart". I like plenty of things that have not even one "intellectual" word in it.
I love Star Wars for many things that it does.
I love Star Trek for many things that it does.
I am entertained in different ways for each.
Star Trek is more intellectual. It's not a huge great deal harder to understand than Star Wars. Many people just prefer Star Wars. Trek definitely does not require only people who are gifted to watch. Star Wars just reaches a bigger audience. It appeals to many, many more. Huge demographic.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Actually both shows are probably intellectual in their own regard. Certainly both can stand as an intellectual read in paperback but none stands over the other as being harder to comprehend. Neither of these are philosophical inquiries nor are they educational material.

Both utilize the conception of thought, the imagination to fuel the human mind and that's is what I believe really matters in the end. Plus the comparison really depends on how extensive is the scope of comparison?

Are we comparing it in accoradance to all the levels of media (movies, tv series, animation, books, comics, etc.) or just the main things by which we know of both series?

How ya doing, buddy?

After a bunch of posts I kind of see Borg's point now... In Star Wars they *could* talk about stuff like... how does a lightsaber work, details on the Death Star beyond "a missile here and it blows up"... But they don't, as it wouldn't appeal to a younger audience that's more interested in the lightsaber fights and space battles.

In the game Knights of the Old Republic II, I saw how does a lightsaber work (kind of), it was nice to see a sort of explanation, but that explanation wasn't really necessary for the plot in the movies... even though Luke builds one between Ep. V and Ep. VI.

As Star Trek has some TV series, they must have a lot more time to explain this kind of things on the episodes.

It's not that Star Wars is not "intellectual", it's just they chose not to focus on that on the movies.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

I don't like Trek because it is "smart". I like plenty of things that have not even one "intellectual" word in it.

This is like telling me that telling me Intelligent Design has nothing to do with God.

But thats the point - Trek is *not* smart. Trek is enjoyable - but I don't think a show that deals with kids being put on trial for killing flowers, people that have their heritage in spiders or wishy-washy morality between episodes can be intelligent.

See - Trek is entertaining, yes. But it can't be smart. You want it to be smart, so you are seen as smart. You are neither. A sign of intelligence is the ability to argue one's points with conviction and evidence - you do neither as you argue like a child kicking and screaming in a toy store.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Star Trek is more intellectual.

No it's not. And you've still have yet to prove that beyond a doubt.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Many people just prefer Star Wars.

You've not quantified that either.

Originally Posted by Borg1982

Huge demographic.

If you're going to use the word, demographic - you need to back it up with a list or a poll or something. Don't just assume you're right - because I assume you suck dick on the weekends. Doesn't make me right, but it sure as shit seems a more likely candidate than anything you've said so far.

Originally Posted by dope

Certainly both can stand as an intellectual read in paperback

If you're reading Star Trek novels or Star Wars hardbound for it's "intellectual" reasons, you're going to end up one big dumbass.

Quote:

Both utilize the conception of thought, the imagination to fuel the human mind and that's is what I believe really matters in the end.

As opposed to reading a book on art history or the ideas of Plato? Get the fuck out. Not even Borg1982 is trying to sell me that shit.

Originally Posted by umma

After a bunch of posts I kind of see Borg's point now... In Star Wars they *could* talk about stuff like... how does a lightsaber work, details on the Death Star beyond "a missile here and it blows up"... But they don't, as it wouldn't appeal to a younger audience that's more interested in the lightsaber fights and space battles.

And because... who gives a shit?

How ya doing, buddy?