[General Discussion] Are developers afraid to make 2D games on Consoles now?

It seems this way. I know there wasn't always the power to make 3D games but now that there is, you don't see any 2D games on consoles.

Only really on the GBA. Do developers think it's a waste of power to make a 2D game on a big console or something.

Or do they think it won't get as many sales as a 3D game would.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I'd play a 2D game, but only if it were hi res. You see how people lately are going apeshit for a copy of Ikaruga.

You certainly can't slap a $50 pricetag on a 2D game, however.

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Most game developers like to have an unrestricted perspective. Even games froma 2D perspective still use 3D graphics. One of the reasons is >99% of all 2D graphics are sprite based, meaning if you look closer, the sprite will look blockier. If 2D games are to evolve, they'll need to use vector based graphics (as best seen when you zoom in on a flash movie). 2D gaming is a niche market and is made now from a primarily artistic a standpoint, much like black and white movies are.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Publishers are afraid to publish games mainly because they won't sell. And for the most part, they're right.

People can tolerate 2D games on the GBA because "The GBA is a 2D system"

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I think there's a bit too much emphasis on graphics these days for many 2D games to be developed any more. I also agree about the pricing; it wouldn't make good sense to stick current game prices on essentially completely linear games. I remember the first PSX platformers like Pandemonium! were £40-£50 at first launch, and that was a 2D game with pretty poor 3D backgrounds and not the best collission detection either.

Back when games were really cheap and graphics were not so important 2D games were perfect, but now they're not so influential. Of course, I'm sure if a really good innovative 2D game came along it'd be pretty popular; but developers must realise that a pretty large section of their target market is putting at least some emphasis on graphics and it seems increasingly on games with some level of freedom, 2D games aren't really so fitting any more.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Another reason 2D games were made so often back in the early 90's is the fact that most gaming systems couldn't handle good looking 3D. Now that games such as Unreal Tournament 2007 and MGS4 are coming out, it's easy to see why people don't make 2D games anymore, they have great looking 3D games.

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Sony refuses to release 2d games outside of japan, only in compilations (think of Metal Slug 4 & 5). And theres hardly any profit gained by releasing non-mainstream games on other Xbox/GC. So 2d games are limited to japanese PS2 goodness.

FELIPE NO

Sprite-based games can also be much more work.

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A 2D game has a much more "classic" feel to it, so personally, I'd leave that genre to classic gaming and its enthusiasts. I'm not saying that there shold be no more 2D games ever, but if a company is willing to develop a new epic 2D console game, knowing the risks, well...

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Megalith

Sprite-based games can also be much more work.

Not really, with most recent RTS games, all they did was convert the 3D images to sprites, then do the same for various angles and frames. Now a hand drawn style 2D games, that would be a lot of work.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I still demand a 2D Castlevania on the PS2. The level of sprite animation, glowy effects and bells 'n whistles I want to see on that game is astronomical.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

The short answer: Sony won't let anyone make 2D games on the PS2.

The long answer: Sony won't allow 2D games because they honestly don't sell, and Sony doesn't want to dilute their console library with "bad" games, which is how the Atari was undone. That attitude used to infuriate me, but now I can't really blame them for that. Bear in mind, we are no longer the mainstream of video gamers. The average consumer sees a game with 2D graphics, says "Those graphics look like shit, they're not in 3D" and bypass the game entirely.

It's a sad state of affairs, but that's reality. 2D games aren't made anymore because people won't buy them. (Most) game companies are interested in making good games, but more importantly they want to make money. So, they make games that make money. If that means frontloading a game with flashy FMVs and special effects for summoning monsters at the expense of coherent storytelling and gameplay, then that's what they'll do - because the consumer base eats it up.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

What about Viewtiful Joe? It was released because it looked 3D, right?

Viewtiful Joe sold. And it sold pretty well on the PS2. I don't know how much people warmed up to the sequel but personally I liked it.

I was speaking idiomatically.

It's thought that in approximately 6 years (I think) that console graphically technology will peak and there will be no more need for more console updates. When this happens, games will be able to have graphics that look so realistic, it will fool you into thinking it is real life. As soon as this happens, I reakon everyone is going to go 'wow! well we've got the graphics the best they can be! Err okay, lets start making games with good gameplay again', and then the 2d games will come back, because everyone will be soooo thirsty for them! Raarh!

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

I've always thought of that happening as well.

When graphics get as good as they are gonna get, then people are going to want to spend $100 (I'm guessing that will be the game price then) on a game with great gameplay and not buy a game solely because of graphics.

FELIPE NO

Wrong.

It will shift from graphics to whatever kind of gimmick technology may allow for the player to literally become a part of the game.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

People are just graphic whores, that's all. I buy my games base on gameplay and storyline.

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I thought of that option but then I thought, gamers have a limit to how much they will pay for a system.

Especially, the peer pressure issue. It's "geeky" to pay a lot for basically anything unrelated to clothes or cars.

I guess this is sort of going into another category but it has to do with why Virtual reality like stuff wouldn't fare so well. Unless it's cheap, which it most likely won't be.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

We'll just have to be content with 2D games being made by small developers and as freeware products. After all, has AM radio made a comback for playing music?

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Well, small developers are just going to stampeded into non-existence. Now, more than ever, you gotta have the big bucks to create something "qualified" to be on the newer consoles.

Which reminds me, who the hell is funding TREASURE, LoL. They consist of like, six people.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Megalith

Well, small developers are just going to stampeded into non-existence. Now, more than ever, you gotta have the big bucks to create something "qualified" to be on the newer consoles.

Which reminds me, who the hell is funding TREASURE, LoL. They consist of like, six people.

Sega, Nintendo, Konami =\

There's a reason they don't make any original titles anymore

I was speaking idiomatically.

Some games I find representative of 2D graphics (and gaming) at it's best:
Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island 1996?
StarCraft 1998
Age of Empires II 1999
Heroes of Might and Magic II 1997
Sonic The Hedgehog 3 & Knuckles 1993 & 1994
Sonic CD 1993
Super Metroid 1994
Chrono Trigger 1995 (and most other Square games made for the SNES during 1995 and 1996)
Gunstar Heroes 1993

Feel free to critique and add suggestions to the list.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by www.sega.co.jp

Some games I find representative of 2D graphics (and gaming) at it's best:
Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island 1996?
StarCraft 1998
Age of Empires II 1999
Heroes of Might and Magic II 1997
Sonic The Hedgehog 3 & Knuckles 1993 & 1994
Sonic CD 1993
Super Metroid 1994
Chrono Trigger 1995 (and most other Square games made for the SNES during 1995 and 1996)
Gunstar Heroes 1993

Feel free to critique and add suggestions to the list.

Good ol' Street Fighter II for the arcades and for the SNES.

FELIPE NO

I have a hard time considering anything that isn't flat and hand-drawn to be 2-D. StarCraft looks 3-Dish to me.



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Jam it back in, in the dark.