[Movie] The Departed VS. Infernal Affairs

Infernal Affairs was one of the greatest Hong Kong film I have seen in years. Superb performances, great suspense, dark, gritty imagery and a well thought-out story made it a movie to remember. However, reading that Infernal Affairs was to be remade into a Hollywood film, I remember groaning and I was left in disbelief (seeing how Hollywood usually screws up international films in their remakes).

The film's out in most countries now, with the Australian one coming this week. Initially I was hesitant to watch it but upon reading many reviews I've decided to ask if anyone has seen it and thought it was as good/better than the Hong Kong version.

Any thoughts?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I preferred the original, I wasn't big on the final showdown (US V.) Plus the HK version had way more of an impact on emotional scenes, not sudden like the U.S. release. Not only that but did anyone feel that there was a bit too much profanity going on. :lolsign:

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This movie is one of the best (if not, THE best) remakes from Asian to NA. Although, the serious parts (The elevator scene) are now amusing. =/ The theatre was laughing/cheering at that scene. Ugh. And the "great fall" was well done - I loved the gasps from the audiences xD

Great movie but I prefer the original (mostly because I knew what happened/didn't have much impact). Definately check it out!

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

I want to see the original, but the version I downloaded doesn't have a working subtitle file.

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Isn't it Internal Affairs?

I'm looking for this on DVD. Is it readily available or will I have to do some searching?

I was speaking idiomatically.

Internal Affairs is an old cop movie made in America, not HK. But they made it Infernal due to name issues, obviously. Sounds cooler though >_>

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by sprouticus

Isn't it Internal Affairs?

I'm looking for this on DVD. Is it readily available or will I have to do some searching?

Yes, it is Internal Affairs. As for the comparison, the main actor from the HK version himself voted Departed an 8/10, just because there was only one woman as the love interest for the entire movie. Haven't watched it myself though.

For a moment there, I thought the thread said "The Departed VS. Infernal Monkey. I'd have voted Infernal.

[edit]Oh snap, I was mixed up with "Internal" myself! XD

FELIPE NO

Internal Affairs is an American film and has no connection, as far as I know, to Infernal Affairs.

And:
http://www.amazon.com/Infernal-Affai...?ie=UTF8&s=dvd

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The HK movie we're talking about is called infernal affairs because its a pun played on the word INFERNO. The Chinese title is a Buddism philosphy of an eternal hell, and Inferno is the western's closet equivalent. The character that Andy Lau plays gets promoted to INTERNAL affairs departement, they chaged it to Infernal for the pun.

I have yet to see the departed. Heard from people that said it was great, still wondering if the tensions, tones and grittyness was traslated well to the remake. Elevator scene now funny? Dammit, that was suppose to be a tense build up till the great fall. I hate it when they change a tone like that so drastically. But I guess thats what American audiences like...

Any other stuff you can compare about? Anything else you felt was lost from the original and the impact was less? Did the plot ended the same as the orignal HK version? I only saw Infernal Affairs.

Originally Posted by T1249NTSCJ

I preferred the original, I wasn't big on the final showdown (US V.) Plus the HK version had way more of an impact on emotional scenes, not sudden like the U.S. release. Not only that but did anyone feel that there was a bit too much profanity going on. :lolsign:

God, will it have killed American film makers to make scenes more emotional instead of making every scene sudden so people won't pause to reach for pop corn?

The Hong Kong version had quite a number of profanity in scenes involving the triads with cops and convos between SP Wong and the mole who infiltrates triads. Was it alot more like every 3 mins there's a F bomb or something?

Personally, I get pissed everytime they make an Asian remake, but a HK one? A country where this is the movie that was actually good for the first time in years? I personally felt they took whatever little dignity HK has, but maybe thats just me.

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Assuming cultural influence flows both ways, Infernal Affairs owes its breath to police procedurals by the likes of Mann, The Godfather Trilogy, Serpico, and Scorsese himself, which makes The Departed an odd twice-removed reinterpretation of Scorsese's own epic 'gangster films'.

Infernal Affairs is well-crafted but there's a tremendous lack of human drama. To the credit of the filmmakers, they know this - there's more focus on the creative employment of gismos and gadgets. The schizophrenic cinematography attempts to appeal to the MTV crowd - black and white flashblack sequences (Christopher Doyle had to serve as a 'visual consultant' - the film suffers from an identity crisis) and Tony-Scott-esque cuts - I don't see how The Departed is more 'rushed' or sudden, given its free-to-roam but undistracting camera movement, and longer first act setup.

"Scorsese's version" is an amalgam of themes (doppelgangers, obsession, fall-from-grace, unabashed commentary on Catholicism), most of which he's visited before (and has done better) - Infernal Affairs lacks depth in comparison. Jack Nicholson backlit in red as he engages in a racial threesome, or waving a dildo around in his porno theater - his character's not necessarily more developed than his HK counterpart, but serves more purpose than just filling the shoes of an obligatory kingpin - he's the antichrist to Leo's hero and Damon's anti-hero.

The Departed isn't a masterpiece (though it's imdb rating is shooting through the roof), nor is Infernal Affairs a bad piece of work. When strictly comparing the two, the 'remake' hits a greater note. I mean, when you consider everything that occured to the main players, in context of the film's title (and Nicholson's funeral card quotation), it just rings more true.

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Originally Posted by Room

The Departed isn't a masterpiece (though it's imdb rating is shooting through the roof), nor is Infernal Affairs a bad piece of work. When strictly comparing the two, the 'remake' hits a greater note.

Well... I was going to write a massive review but that pretty much put it far better than I could have.

I do have to say though, that it's quite a credit to Scorsese's take on it that the film was a richly detailed study of paranoia. I mean, I was actually nervous and worried about every character in the film the entire time and I know I owe that feeling to the ensemble cast. I grew attached to every character, but moreso to Billy for one reason: He didn't ask for this. He was just thrown into it. While Infernal Affairs had the same setup and was a dark and gritty film, it did lack a very human feel to it that Scorsese brought out in his actors without question.

I almost want to say that it's better than Goodfellas, but I don't know if I'll go that far. I will say this though... I literally came out in what I can only refer to as a state of shock from this film. I haven't been this shaken by a film since Munich and for the same reasons. The best way to get that claustrophobic paranoid feeling into your audience is to make sure your main character can FEEL it. Avner in Munich felt it, Billy felt it in this film and I still feel saturated by it long after I've left the theater.

Definitely one for the top shelf of my collection.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Infernal Affairs is a great film!!! I watched it a couple years ago, and it is VERY good. In fact, I've have been trying to purchase it, but haven't had the time to go look for it.

They did a very good job with the characters, interactions, etc. the actor are very good as well.

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I've never seen nor heard of Infernal Affairs before this. Regardless, I saw the Departed yesterday and I was very impressed with it. Everything was well done. Leonardo DiCaprio did a fine job acting, some of his best, if not the best work he has done thus far. There were several scenes that kept me on the edge of my seat because I was not sure how it was going to play out. This movie surprised me with its ending and direction, and I was very pleased and satisfied with it.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Watched The Departed over the weekend. Fucking awesome movie. I'd say I liked it over the HK movie just because I was able to follow it better. Plus the witty remarks/dialogue, Boston accents, "modern", and Nicholson as one crazy motherfucker just made it a thrill to watch. Best movie I've watched all year. For some reason I now want to watch Sudden Death. wtf? ._.

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Originally Posted by Encephalon

Well... I was going to write a massive review but that pretty much put it far better than I could have.

While Infernal Affairs had the same setup and was a dark and gritty film, it did lack a very human feel to it that Scorsese brought out in his actors without question.

Lack a human feel? What do you mean? Both Andy Lau and Tony Leung's characters were very humane. They are just two guys who want out of their eternal hell as moles. They even have a connection with each other despite the fact one has to be taken down cause they are on opposing sides, yet I can tell they can relate to each other. The scene in the beginning where Andy goes to get some hi fi speakers shows their humane side, just two men who appeciate good sound in music. We see them having friends in the venues they were placed as moles, despite the fact they both knew they will have to backstab them, I get the feeling they care about the people they had to work with. Andy Lau may be the bad guy it seems, but he genuinly cares about his fiance and in the end

Spoiler:

desires to turn over a new leaf just for her. And c'mon, when SP Wong died, Tony was horrified, crushed, and friggin sad, he just lost not only the man who can prove who he is, but also his only true friend all these years. Hell, even Andy really regrets for killing a good comrade and officer. How much more human can you get?

I don't quite understand how you say that this movie lack a human feeling, when its a character piece as oppose to the just plot and action. Hell its more tension than action in IA. I haven't seen the Departed, so I can't judge if the actors did a better job, but saying IA lacks human feel makes ME feel like you didn't get the movie.

Originally Posted by nazpyro

Watched The Departed over the weekend. Fucking awesome movie. I'd say I liked it over the HK movie just because I was able to follow it better. Plus the witty remarks/dialogue, Boston accents, "modern", and Nicholson as one crazy motherfucker just made it a thrill to watch. Best movie I've watched all year. For some reason I now want to watch Sudden Death. wtf? ._.

I wonder if he would have liked IA better if he was able to follow the language... This might be a cultural reason that he liked Departed better.

Man I heard The Departed is tanked in Hong Kong, anyone living there can cofirm this? I'm in LA for college.

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I'm backing you up Enceph.

If there even is a cultural reason for preferring one over the other, it is definitely not ethnocentric - anyone who tells you otherwise is a fool, plain and simple. IA is heavily influenced by American cinema, particularly by The Godfather Trilogy, Michael Mann, and Scorsese, fused with MTV-style cutting/action sequences (it's quite literally reverse-Tarantino). If there is any cultural difference in preference, it'd have to be concerning a population doused in pop culture television, versus one that's not.

IA certainly lacks human drama, and the attempts to remedy this are so saccharine I had to visit the dentist afterwards. The weakest on-screen chemistry occurs between Lau and Sam, the most effective being between Leung and Anthony Wong. The film sets itself up for serious character study/doppelganger parallels, but does not succeed. Then there's the scene where

Spoiler:

Wong dies.

Black and white flashbacks reeled to a love song? Maybe I cringe easily. Or say when Kelly Chen (whose appearance is solely promotion/fan-based) has an intimate chat with Leung. CU on the couples' profiles cut to CU of holding hands. It then attempts to tackle motifs, but how heavy-handed can you get when you have Lau's woman, a writer, not able to decide whether or not "her novel's hero" is good or evil? Paul Haggis style writing, no doubt.

To be fair, The Departed is one of the best dark comedies in some time, but doesn't touch Goodfellas. I'd go as far to say anyone who claims it is better does not understand Goodfellas. It (along with Raging Bull) epitomizes what Scorsese does best: combine pathos, sincerity, wisdom to arrive at something enlightening. IA just doesn't work on the same level - no bias here, as I love foreign films a great deal.

I await your comments, nit-picks, what-the-fucks.

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I saw Departed on the plane 2 weeks ago.

And while I enjoyed it, in the end I still preferred the original Hong Kong version. The atmosphere and tone was better, they handled the concept of the 2 main characters alot better, Leo and Matt did a great job, but because of their young faces I can't feel that much sympathy for them comparing to 2 guys in their 40's who have been in this hellhole they dug themselves in for o ver a decade.

I felt the ending was sloppy, and the ending for the original, while maybe a little over dramtic, was the right ending.

Spoiler:

The sad music playing, the revelation of an additional mole, and the way Andy Lau holds up his inspector ID out of the elevator, and he says "I'm a cop." The music tone changes to a "Uh oh" music, and its not just that he killed the other mole, but he just dug himself further into the "eternal hell". Of course IA was also meant to be
a trilogy, and we don't see his compuenace (sp?) till the third film.

Departed made all the above into a comical skit. I was baffled, I scanned my mind 10 times and couldn't find ANY reason to justify that.

The certain death scene in the middle wasn't that hot either for me.

Spoiler:

In IA, it was sudden, you KNOW he was gonna get beat up bad, but the fall was completly sudden. BAM! Right on the Taxi Tony Leung just left and no fancy slow mo. THIS is how it would happen if you were Tony's character. You have NO idea, you might worry he got caught and was gonna get the shit beat out of him, but no way was that fall predictable.

The tension before the fall was also very well done. You don't need major quick action fast pace shots to make the audience nervous, and IA did a better job at tensions througout the movie, IMO.

The Departed ruin all that by doing the cliche slow mo. Ick.

Its like the recent episode of Kanon, where they SHOW the actual accident instead of slow mo, or black out with sound effects. THIS is what happened, in real time, and if you were there.

Not to mention, why would they meet at an abandoned bulding, making it look suspicous? IA had them meet at a roof of a business building, which made alot more sense.

Also, what the HELL is up with the scene with the Chinese guys?! THEY DON'T EVEN SPEAK CANTONESE FLUENTLY! They sound like a bunch of Mandarin guys trying to speak Cantonese cause the casting director FUCKED up!

If THAT was meant to be a tribute to the HK film makers, then that was a sloppy one. If you're gonna say thank you, make it legit and right, not send some 1 dollar E card and with Chinese written by some language student who only learned it for 6 monthes.

Departed has its merits though, Leo and Matt's acting, Jackie was delicious to watch, and you can always count on some American screenplays to have great dialouge, and you can never count on the Hong Kong ones to have any. Maybe its the language, maybe we don't know how to write witty dialouge, who knows? Those merits are defintly in favour of Departed.

Though Andy and Tony's performance rivalled the other 2, when it comes to the bad guy however, Nicholson was more interesting to watch, where as the other guy did the job, but there wasn't too much flair to it.

Now that Departed won the Oscar, I have to wonder if they gave any regonition to Infernal Affairs at all...

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Infernal Affairs hands down for me. Yes, I may be biased because I watched the original first (and of Chinese descent).

Some main points that I didn't like in The Departed were: (a) the missing feeling of the whole epic scene on top of the building (and how that ended with the splatter, producing chuckles from the audience), (b) the love triangle, and (c) the ending. They ended it as if the story were over, as if justice was served. But one of the themes of Infernal Affairs was the living with guilt, and the endless cycle of being a cop and choosing which side you are really on.

EDIT:
Oh, I forgot to mention another point: WHERE WAS THE MORSE CODE AT? Heh, I was pretty disappointed when they pulled out their cell phones and texted each other some txt msgs.

Also, the overall mood of IA was of a truly epic story (with a fitting soundtrack as well).

Not to rain on The Departed, it had it's own feel and I actually enjoyed Hollywood's rendition of it.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Fundamentally, in the end, these 2 are two different films that share the same plot. Its the only way to watch the movies without bashing them if you aknowledged they are two different films.

I just wish for a little aknowlegdement from the makers of Departed, did they thank anyone from HK at the Oscars?

Though I am STILL miffed with hiring a bunch of Chinese guys who can't speak Cantonese fluently. Some tribute. Not to mention a little racial ignorance.

"They're Chinese so let's hire them! Cantonese and Mandarin are different? Ah who gives a damn! The audience can't tell the diff!"

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Did anyone beside myself notice them calling IA out as a "japanese movie" when calling forth the screenwriter...?

Personally I much prefer IA to Departed. Jack Nicholsons' clownish performance marrs the otherwise brilliant picture. Which kinda is a shame as he could have done it so much better.

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....You're kidding about the Japanese movie part right?

If not, god, someone is going to fucking PAY!

Anyone tape the Oscars can confirm?

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Tellurian

Jack Nicholsons' clownish performance marrs the otherwise brilliant picture. Which kinda is a shame as he could have done it so much better.

My thoughts exactly, I was surprised Scorsese wasn't able to reign him in more and stop him chewing the scenery with quite so much gusto.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Room

IA certainly lacks human drama, and the attempts to remedy this are so saccharine I had to visit the dentist afterwards. The weakest on-screen chemistry occurs between Lau and Sam, the most effective being between Leung and Anthony Wong. The film sets itself up for serious character study/doppelganger parallels, but does not succeed. Then there's the scene where

Spoiler:

Wong dies.

Black and white flashbacks reeled to a love song? Maybe I cringe easily. Or say when Kelly Chen (whose appearance is solely promotion/fan-based) has an intimate chat with Leung. CU on the couples' profiles cut to CU of holding hands. It then attempts to tackle motifs, but how heavy-handed can you get when you have Lau's woman, a writer, not able to decide whether or not "her novel's hero" is good or evil? Paul Haggis style writing, no doubt.
I await your comments, nit-picks, what-the-fucks.

I think Lau and Sam has the worst on screen chemistry is due to their relationship, they probably have minimal interaction with each other and kept their distance to avoid suspicion, that and Lau's gradual realiszation that he doesn't wanne be stuck as a mole and wants the sweet life he has now, great job and fiance, so between them is more about business than emotional connection.

Wong and Leung have better chemistry cause they have a better relationship, Wong is the only true friend (well other than Kelly but like you said, fan service >_<), so their chemisty is alot better cause they care about each other, where as the above pair don't.

I think it succeeded the character study, I didnt' feel much when I watch the Departed myself. The women in the film are mostly plot devices so I didn't expect much from them to be honest. The fiance writer pondering her main characters moral ambiguity is probably there for the irony for Lau's character. Ham handed yes, but HK people don't exactly have the best writing skills.

As for the so called love song, its not a love song, its meant to sound angelic for the dearly departed. The flashbacks are cliche, but it may me feel more for Leung and watching his expression change from shock horror to slowly crumbling devestation. The flashbacks showed how their friend ship begin, how it developed and how it ended up costing them. Cheesy, but it got the point across. I didn't feel ANYTHING for the equivalent characters in the Departed.

I don't think this lack human drama at all, I see two guys who are sick of the hell hole they dug themselves in, and I see two people wanting to do the right thing, one can't escape from the guilt in the end, one loses a friend but in the end was free.

Its probably all different opinions, but I felt alot more for the characters in IA than Departed. If thats not human drama, than what is? Departed was a black comedy, something that IA defintly wasn't, and I didnt' like the change in genre.

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Originally Posted by Kairi Li

I didnt' like the change in genre.

Agreed.

And yeah, Oscars = lacking props' for the original, IA screenwriters.

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My opinion may be bias as this is a Chinese film and I'm Chinese but I really preferred the original over the departed. I felt that the "great fall" scene in Infernal Affairs was much better done, the whole slow motion and soundtrack at that point made the moment so much better. Like Kairi Li said, the Canto actors they hired were garbage, when I first heard them I was like wth!? I could hardly understand them myself. The American version in general I felt didn't portray enough emotion, they tried putting comedy into a serious story.

I was also pretty ticked that they didn't give proper credit to the original. Maybe it was just the version I got, but I only saw "In association with Asian Media Film" and nothing else.

And yeah, I noticed that they called it a Japanese film, which, no offense to Japanese people, ticked me off. But yeah, getting Best Picture for a movie you basically copied scene for scene was suprising.

Jam it back in, in the dark.