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Parental rights denied by 9th Circuit Court
Although this decision was made in 11/05, I think it merits discussion. The 9the Circuit Court determined that parents have to exclusive constitutional right to determine what their children are taught regarding sexual matters. The court ruled that the parents rights end at the school door. The case revolves around a sex survey given to elementary school kids asking questions of a deeply personal and sexual manner. (How often do you touch yorself, etc.). The parents objected, saying they should determine what their kids are exposed to regarding sexuality.
Sound to me like an open door for any pro gay, pro abortion, etc. agenda that the schools feel are proper and politocally correct. It would seem to me like a violation of the parents first amendment right to practice the religion of their choice. The court held that parents still have to choice as to where to send their kids to school, but with the liberal fight against vouchers, how many parents really have this choice? http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:...s&ct=clnk&cd=7 Jam it back in, in the dark. |
Or a quota system unusable by Wesker.
There's nowhere I can't reach. |
This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it. |
If this is the case I'm thinking of, these were SECOND GRADERS, people - not high schoolers. The parents absolutely should have a say over *if* (I was going to say "what", but that is totally out of the realm of rational thinking) their seven-year-olds are exposed to with regard to sex, religion, peanut butter vs. peanut butter & jelly, whether or not the sky is blue, or any other subject imaginable.
Are you people crazy? I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body? |
Like I said, I thought this was referring to the case (in New Hampshire or Connecticut or one of those states) where second-graders were given a questionnaire regarding masturbation, homosexuality, etc. without parental consent.
I was speaking idiomatically. |
We literally had to get a permission slip signed to take a sex ed/health class. It was taught by the lesbian gym teacher. No joke. And I don't have a problem with this letter (in the article...thing)
I would sign that. I imagine they're not idiotic and they'll hold themselves in good taste with administering an evaluation. This is coming from a person who doesn't trust doctors. I am sure they're not going to ask first graders anything terribly graphic - its more than likely geared towards a first grader's mind. These are psychologists. Not pedophiles. They're doing your community a service. What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now? |
I don't really get the POINT of the survey to start with - what was it's purpose being there in the first place? Or someone along the school board just curious what those little children do these days during their boutifull 'free times'? If they're going to teach sexuality just teach it for goodness sake, the kids are there to learn and not to conclude a survey on how often they touch themselves. EDIT: OK. But still, throwing a survey like this at them is just strange to begin with. If they think they need to get covered over this sexuality thing a bit earlier or more in detail or on other topics as well, I think the media reveals this very well on violent acts on younger youth as well as all that's up on the news: couldn't they get the concenus off of that or they need some hard proof that they need to change the course or something? How ya doing, buddy?
Last edited by Luckee Cookie; Mar 22, 2006 at 10:20 PM.
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After carefully reading all of this document, theres really absolutely NOTHING these parents could get upset about.
What, you don't want my bikini-clad body? |
These are still 1st-5th grade kids we're talking about....I mean I can see maybe starting the questionare (with the sex-related questions) maybe 5th and up....but not 1st-4th graders. I mean I have nothing against sex-ed or anything....it's just that most 1st and 2nd (and maybe 3rd graders) don't know where babies come from let alone what 'sex' or 'masterbation/"touching myself"' mean. At least that's the way it was when I was in school (I became home schooled after 4th grade). But then again....kids are maturing sooner and sooner now adays....so who knows....the kids in those grades probaly DO know where babies come from and the meaning of 'sex' :/ .....
Jam it back in, in the dark. |
I'm not sure what the survey intends to accomplish when the subjects don't even have a base understanding of sex. I mean, when you get into 4th and 5th Grade you're gonna have some kids "in the know" who get boners looking at swimsuit calendars, but 1st Graders?
In either case, if parents don't like it, they can send their kids to private school. It's a free country. There's nowhere I can't reach. |
This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it. |
"What Is Sex' has garnered seventy percent of the results, professor."
"GOOD! GOOD! Feed it to the machine!" All I know is that I certainly wouldn't want my 7 year old asking me what sex was all of a sudden. Aren't I supposed to have time to prepare for these things? I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body? |
After reading the questions, I don't object. It's like how the doctor tells you that you shouldn't let anyone touch you in your bathing suit area. I was speaking idiomatically. |
When the hell did you guys first find out about babies and sex? Christ, did I drop into Lives-Under-A-Rock-land?
What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now? |
No, I don't believe I'll ever feel like doing a laid son, thank you very much madam.
Also, how far along is the pregnancy? Double Post:
I remember finding said kid's stash of girly mags, and that would be the first exposure to sexuality that spiralled me into an awkward perversion of pre-adolescent thought. Isn't childhood wonderful? How ya doing, buddy?
Last edited by Bradylama; Mar 23, 2006 at 12:02 AM.
Reason: Automerged double post.
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What, you don't want my bikini-clad body? |
The problem here, as I see it rests with the subject matter. Science, math, English, etc are valid subjects, usually without a moral bearing one way or the other. Inquiring as to a childs sexual thoughts, teaching certain sexual matters as normal when they perhaps are not for many people, well, this crosses the line.
I find it interesting the idea put forth by the court that parents have no "exclusive Constitutional right" to the education of their kids. Taken to its logical conclusion that though would end homeschooliong and private schools and mandate government approved brainwashing..i mean "education". And what sick pervert is studying how many times a frist grader considers matrubation...thats just sick. How ya doing, buddy? |
Sex was actually not even a big issue on the survey. It was sparsed in with questions about violence, interactions with others, and feelings that would raise an alarm in ANY parent's head.
If you can't accept that an institution is surveying your kids and the subject of your kid's peepee is going to come up, send them to a private religious school. I don't see why the state schol cater to pansy-ass parents who can't talk assess their own child's feelings or feel "uncomfortable" that their kid is going to be asked about psychological evaulation questions which MAY JUST INVOLVE their body.
These are not pedophiles. They are PSYCHOLOGISTS. Wow. There's nowhere I can't reach. |
Now Devo, a lot of fucked up things were done in the name of Psychology. Like electroshock therapy and Lobotomies.
This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it. |
I've heard electroshock was making a bit of a comeback now that people have gotten past Kesey's reactionary response to it.
I also feel sorry for the first grade teacher that has to answer the question, "What's masturbation?" (Also insert necessary child mispronunciation of the word.) I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body? |
I'm just sayin'. The suggestion that Psychologists know what they're doing is a little sketchy. They haven't established themselves very well just yet.
How ya doing, buddy? |
Nobody seems to have brought it up, but what I gathered from the statement was that the questionnaire was designed to bring to light any trauma (violent or sexual) which might be inhibiting a child's learning.
It's also been my impression that touching oneself as such a young age is indicative of sexual trauma. I think asking whether a kid touches himself out of a neurotic response to rape is more valid than wondering whether 6 year olds get horny. If you look at the wording of that letter, the parents have a point that it wasn't explicitly stated that there would be questions with sexual content. That may have been an ingenuous ommission by the district, but I can easily imagine a meeting where someone said "Oh don't say that; then they'll never go for it!" Oh, and lurker, by the third grade I had a rough understanding of procreation. eg. Babies came out between girls' legs, and boys peed up there to make it happen. What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now? |
And people wonder why Americans are behind other industrialized nations in the sciences.
Furthermore, home schooling materials still have to be mandated by the State. Private/public school teachers are typically certified by the State. So home schooling really won't be illegal.
FELIPE NO
Last edited by Watts; Mar 23, 2006 at 07:18 PM.
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You have a point Watts. The questionnaires would be useful if they indicated specific children who had been traumatized, allowing those children to be helped, or to find relations between specific learning problems and specific traumas, allowing the former to be solved by treating the latter.
However, if anonymity is guaranteed, then the only thing you get is a statistic analysis of children who have been traumatized. A comparison with one regarding children with learning problems might indicate a relation. However, I thought we already knew that there was a link between the two. What, you don't want my bikini-clad body? |
Jam it back in, in the dark. |
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