Virginia Tech Shooting: At least 33 Fatalities

Originally Posted by Bradylama

So Barack Obama's outed himself as a complete shitheel
*stuff*
Obama 2008!

What, exactly, would you like to have seen from him?

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At least the dude doesn't play PC games. If he did you can bet that the media would associate playing PC games with his shooting rampage.

Ignorant baboons.

Edit: Guess not judging by the noob in the video on the previous page

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Sassafrass

What, exactly, would you like to have seen from him?

I guess I would've liked to have not seen him use the largest mass-shooting in US history as an awkward metaphor for outsourcing and Don Imus.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Bradylama

I guess I would've liked to have not seen him use the largest mass-shooting in US history as an awkward metaphor for outsourcing and Don Imus.

He's a politician. He'll use any opportunity he can get.

Why is that so shocking? Business as usual, man. (Not that it's RIGHT, but hey.)

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Opportunity? It's the most tasteless statement that anybody could make at this point. Brushing it off as "business as usual" doesn't even begin to consider how mind-bogglingly stupid it is. He analogized losing jobs to overseas manufacturing, to being shot in the back of the head.

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Originally Posted by Klaus

I just think "we are completely fucking incompetent" is a stretch. Unless they supplied the weapon and told him to massacre a bunch of people, it's not all their fault.

I'd go as high as 50/50 though.

If 50/50 involvement in the murders of 32 people doesn't say "fucking incompetent" to you, you've got some pretty low standards.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by AcerBandit

Guh, someone in China has decided to recreate this tragedy in glorious 3d.

Spoiler:

unnecessary. I mean the article and not you lol.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Kyndig

The guy apparently had some sort of thing against his father, judging by the content of some of his writing.

I wouldn't say that. Did you read that class assignment of his over on the smoking gun? I'd say it's the obvious point of the story, but it may not reflect his relationship with his dad. There are some anti corporatism overtones in there as well as direct jabs at the influence of media on impressionable minds.

That may be reading way too into it though. When I read the play, I coudln't take it seriously. In my head it sounded like a hardcore dark humor version of Problem Child.

I was speaking idiomatically.

My hearts and prayers go out to all those who have suffered, this is a terrible tragedy.

I really believe that these events are preventable. These psychos just need a place to vent out their rage against the world. Unless something is done, we're just waiting for the next one to go "copycat" and snap.

My suggestion is to somehow get the message out that these guys can put their anger to a noble cause by joining the army.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

I think Cho Seung-hui's writing was a big cry for help. But his parents and teachers ignored. I blame them for giving him no counseling.

FELIPE NO

His teachers didn't ignore it, he was referred to campus counseling and refused to take part.

That writing is not a cry for help. That is way past the cry for help stage.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

I've been looking for links to the writings, but I can't seem to find any. Maybe I am looking in all the wrong places or maybe they're not public? Reading these posts, seems like there are at least excerpts.

Can someone provide a link? Or at least tell me I am a moron, and that there are no press releases with the writings?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive...071vtech1.html

That's the play. Along with the imagery, he's not a very good writer. Probably shouldn't have been a creative writing major in the first place. :P

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Richard McBeef
Mr. Brownstone

Some thoughts:

• I wonder if Cho knew that the police would apprehend a patsy, allowing him to continue on with his killing spree?
• If Cho took both weapons with him to the second shooting scene, how did the police come to the conclusion that the first incident was the result domestic dispute?
• At 10:52, almost a full hour after the shootings ended, campus buildings were locked down. Unless I'm missing some bit of info (like, say, whether or not the first building locked down after the police first arrived on the scene), this seems to be a huge failure by campus and local police.
• It took VT's "leadership team" a full hour to send out an e-mail concerning the first shooting, and the second shooting happened 4 minutes afterwards. How long would it take you to to batch-send an e-mail telling all your friends your dog just died? In fact, this "leadership team" was pretty bad at communication in general.

I understand the argument that you can't predict or stop these things from happening, but, seriously. If he was that creepy a guy (which they should've figured from the outset if he didn't talk in class, stalked women, etc.) they should've pegged him a whole lot sooner. Even then, how hard is it to lock a building down when a shooting occurs AT ALL? What, are shootings at colleges really that common that you can just act like if you don't have a suspect arrested and charged with the crime but you've detained someone you consider a "person of interest", you've properly protected everyone from further danger? I like how no one instantly thought of Cho when they asked themselves in their minds, "Who do we know that's CRAZY enough to do this?" Noooo, first they think about the people who have obvious access to guns. Like possessing a gun immediately places everyone on the top of the list of suspects in every gun-related crime ever. The director of security at VT should be forced to resign.

In my mind, if there's a shooting at a school...be it a high-prestige, Division 1-A college or a urban high school, you do the same thing: put a halt to classes, lock down the crime scene, and let everyone know ASAP what happened.

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Originally Posted by BlueMikey

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive...071vtech1.html

That's the play. Along with the imagery, he's not a very good writer. Probably shouldn't have been a creative writing major in the first place. :P

Thanks, Mikey.

An outside observation: is this standard for university-level English classes? I wonder how he scored on that play. It was awful. You're right about the English major bit.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Just watching this press conference, I still don't see (actually i'm stunned at)how someone who has been committed to a mental institution and stalked 2 women could have legal access to firearms. Jesus Christ

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Unas

Just watching this press conference, I still don't see (actually i'm stunned at)how someone who has been committed to a mental institution and stalked 2 women could have legal access to firearms. Jesus Christ

I've had CNN on in the background nearly since this started and I have heard nothing about him actually being institutionalized. I know he was told he should seek help from his counselor, but nothing about being committed. Have I been misinformed?

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by CloudNine

I've had CNN on in the background nearly since this started and I have heard nothing about him actually being institutionalized. I know he was told he should seek help from his counselor, but nothing about being committed. Have I been misinformed?

Yup, late 2005 he was admitted to a mental health unit:


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6568781.stm

FELIPE NO

I, like others, find it disturbing when politicians and various other loons use tragic events like this as a hobbyhorse. Pushing an agenda is downright disturbing during what should be a time of grievance. GTFO if you haven't anything to offer but your latest campaign slogan.




...School officials said Cho posted a deadly warning on a school online forum: "im going to kill people at vtech."...

The list grows of the WARNING signs present. Though, I find it difficult to place blame on anybody, it seems that the signals here were more than obvious.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Well, I feared this would happen but I knew it was kind of inevitable, given the situation.

Quote:

"We hope that this incident won't create discrimination and prejudice against people of South Korean or Asian origin," the Hankyoreh newspaper said in an editorial.

A sense of despair prevailed among the South Korean public.

"I'm too shameful that I'm a South Korean," an Internet user with the ID "iknijmik" wrote on the country's top Web portal site, Naver among hundreds of messages on the issue. "As a South Korean, I feel apologetic to the Virginia Tech victims."

Kim Min-kyung, a South Korean student at Virginia Tech reached by telephone from Seoul, said there were about 500 Koreans at the school, including Korean-Americans. She said she had never met Cho. She said South Korean students feared retaliation and were gathering in groups.

Source article.

I was watching CNN during breakfast this morning and there was a small segment about this 19 year old student Kim Min-Kyung (a native of South Korea) who was actually packing up and leaving the campus for fear of retaliation from other students. That's the partial story.

Now... I don't know what any of these students are going through right now and I can understand a raging need to look for something or someone to pin some blame on, but this is just not the order of operations, people. It's just really disheartening to see that at a time when these students are supposed to be either mourning or in each other's moral and emotional support, some are already blindly stirring animosity.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by The Dopefish

If Cho took both weapons with him to the second shooting scene, how did the police come to the conclusion that the first incident was the result domestic dispute?

They had already reached her current boyfriend, he was the "person of interest".

Originally Posted by The Dopefish

At 10:52, almost a full hour after the shootings ended, campus buildings were locked down. Unless I'm missing some bit of info (like, say, whether or not the first building locked down after the police first arrived on the scene), this seems to be a huge failure by campus and local police.

Why is that a huge failure? If there was more than one shooter, and he just killed dozens of people, wouldn't you want to protect as many people as you can?

Quote:

If he was that creepy a guy (which they should've figured from the outset if he didn't talk in class, stalked women, etc.) they should've pegged him a whole lot sooner.

They did peg him. He was referred to counseling. If he didn't break any laws, there's not much more you can do.

Quote:

In my mind, if there's a shooting at a school...be it a high-prestige, Division 1-A college or a urban high school, you do the same thing: put a halt to classes, lock down the crime scene, and let everyone know ASAP what happened.

If the first shooting was a crime of passion, and 99.99% of the time, two people dead in a dorm room with no other killing at all would indicate that, then why do all that? There is no immediate danger to anyone else in a rime like that.

There isn't a single legitimate reason to think that from the first crime scene, the second would emerge 2 hours later.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Personally I wouldn't assume that the situation is safe until you've got a suspect you're certain is the culprit in custody, but that's just me. Maybe that's just hindsight talking, but that ("oh, we've got someone we believe is a 'person of interest' in this shooting, there's no way there's possibly someone else out there who is the actual suspect") sounds like an excuse and is the result of poor investigation.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Quote:

http://blogs.washingtontimes.com/insiderpolitics/?p=750

“We seem in this country to have a copyright on this kind of violence.” That’s CNN commentator Jack Cafferty on yesterday’s “Situation Room” discussing the Virginia Tech shooting tragedy.

Not to be too morbid, but that’s just wrong. In fact, no American citizens even make the top-four rankings of individual massacres in world history:

- South Korea, 1982. Woo Bum-Kon killed 57 and then himself, using grenades and a high powered rifle
- Australia, 1996, Port Arthur massacre. Martin Bryant, using two semi-automatic weapons, a CAR-15 and an L1A1 SLR, killed 35
- United States, 2007. Virginia Tech student Cho Seung-hui, a South Korean, killed at least 33, including himself
- Japan 1938, Tsuyama massacre. Mutsuo Toi, using an old Japanese rifle and swords, killed 29 and then himself.

Just more factual evidence that it’s far too early to be making blanket assumptions about a national tragedy of this magnitude.

Responding to this article on Reason.com, David Weigel notes:

Quote:

http://www.reason.com/blog/show/119714.html
I'm waiting for Dr. Phil's researchers to reveal what video games Mutsuo Toi used to play.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Notice how everyone only finds warning signs of these types of psychos AFTER they've gone and killed people? I mean, people more violent in thought than that sometimes remain as harmless as a fly throughout their lives. But then people investigate the killers and then find enormous evidence of psychosis or whatnot. Could such warning signs lead to prevention or are we walking on privacy or paranoia here?

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Sin Ansem

Notice how everyone only finds warning signs of these types of psychos AFTER they've gone and killed people? I mean, people more violent in thought than that sometimes remain as harmless as a fly throughout their lives. But then people investigate the killers and then find enormous evidence of psychosis or whatnot. Could such warning signs lead to prevention or are we walking on privacy or paranoia here?

Looks like there was a court order proclaiming Cho was a "danger to himself and others." An "imminent danger." (source)That he was "mentally ill" and required treatment - which he refused. This wasn't just "counselling" I guess.

And he sent a package with video, images, and writings to NBC. This should be good.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?