[Wii] SONIC HAS A FUCKING SWORD

Eh. I'm hearing from a lot of people who have the game that this wasn't deserving of a 3.9.

6, or 7 maybe (7 is probably stretching it tremendously) - but definately not 3.9.

HOWEVER

Most people I know are teetering between saying that its something of a cross between Unleashed's day stages and Secret Rings in terms of fun factor (not in terms of gameplay, "meat", and consistency). The general consensus that I am hearing seems to be that Secret Rings was probably the better game as this one was definately meant and designed moreso with the kiddies in mind (hence the somewhat blatant "easy streak" the game sees to be exuding upon first play).


The general problem seems to be that Secret Rings seems to have had more meat to it at the cost of wild and borked controls while Black Knight is easier to control/get the grasp of at the sake of sacrificing some of the intricate and complex aspects gameplay that Secret Rings seemed to bring (boss fights that are incredibly simple to beat with no real strategy for instance).

Most I've talked to or gleaned across the net seem to find it somewhat enjoyable (keep in mind these are sonic fans that aren't so jaded that they can't see the forest for the trees so I never said these opinions weren't biased to some extent) and tend to agree that it's certainly not the awful and terrible miasma some Sonic games are expected to be nowadays (Sonic 06 comes to mind), but it does feel like it sacrificed a lot of itself in terms of trying one-up the previous one and wound up going in a not-necessarily-wrong but certainly odd-and-slightly-off-kilter direction in order to do so. If you're in the camp that liked Unleashed's day-stages, this will probably be just a notch below. If you didn't find anythng about Unleashed fun or if you were fair-to-midly on Secret Rings, then this is probably not the game for you. If you liked both to some degree, then it's probably worth a passing play just to see how it feels.

I can see this game being very divided in terms of likes and dislikes as there's a lot of points to be made for both. I'd argue moreso than Unleashed. It's not a step in the right direction - it's "a step". If you translate that low Famitsu score to probably a low-to-midway-6, then I'd garner that they are probably a lot more "right" than IGN certainly would be. Take that for how you will.

Personally, I will be waiting out for Sonic Rush 3 since (IMO) the handhelds have consistently held a much better record than the core games and spinoffs.

SIDENOTE: The music in Black Knight is simply amazing, but that is par for the course of ANY Sonic game it seems.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by GB

Got a 3.9 from IGN. Not a good source of reviews, but I'm curious to see how your opinion differs on the controls, SuperSonic. They seem to have very, very different opinion on them.

First of all, it's a hell of a lot easier to get Sonic to do what you want him to do in this game. In Secret Rings, to make him go you had to tilt the WiiMote forward, and depending how far it was tilted was how fast he would run, while to get him to step back you had to tilt the WiiMote back towards you. Half of the time, the backstep didn't want to work for me.

In Black Knight, you just tilt the joystick. Old fashioned, but it works much better.

To get Sonic to jump in Secret Rings, you had to hit the 2 button on the WiiMote and then thrust it forward to do a homing attack. This worked better than the back step, but sometimes it still had its problems. Thankfully, there was the option to hit the A button to cancel the jump and just drop straight down. Also, you had to hold the 2 button for a length of time to determine how high you wanted to jump. I remember this one part in the second level of Secret Rings where I kept dying over and over again. It was near the end, I was running around to the top and I kept encountering this cactus that you had to jump over. Now since the backstep was a problem and Sonic kept running forward and the jump had to be timed just right, it was a continuous pain in the ass. Eventually I gave up on the game, tried again the next day and ended up getting past it, ran for a few minutes, and reached the goal.

Black Knight, just hit the A button to jump, A again to do a homing attack, and then A once more before you hit an enemy to cancel the attack and drop straight down. More responsive and I didn't once have a problem with it.

Also in Secret Rings, you had to tilt the Wiimote left or right to shift Sonic in that direction while he's running. That sometimes didn't work fast enough when I needed it to. Black Knight, again the use of the joystick is easier and I didn't have a problem shifting Sonic.

After 2 hours, then a break playing my dad in Wii Golf, then after another hour...I beat the game. It's a short single player game, however there are more levels this time around and I enjoyed it a lot more than some of the previous titles that have been put out. Unlike Unleashed, I actually want to go back and unlock stuff like the fan artwork and this one missing music track.

I will say though, I hope there isn't a sequel for this type of game. While I feel giving Sonic a sword worked this time around, it's safe to say that it shouldn't become a repeated occurrence.

I was speaking idiomatically.

From IGN: "Possibly designed by monkeys. Everything you've ever liked about Sonic games -- speed, great level designs -- is gone. Instead, you will crawl through stages and fight enemy after enemy, with waggle."

But I wonder what they would have said if Sonic was replaced by Link? They'd probably say he was moving too fast and there wasn't enough slowing down. I think Matt C. is a little too dependant on the main character's past, because the game looks fun and gorgeous (for a Wii game). Lots of games where you fight enemy after enemy with a Waggle got better scores on IGN (and rightfully so, for some of them).

Most amazing jew boots

Yeah. Because we shouldn't at all take into account the history of a character.

Ever.

FELIPE NO

Well, obviously that's an overstatement, and I accept that. Continuity is good, that's true. But the game should still be rated on how it is as a game, and not as a Sonic game.

I mean, its just not fair that Mario can make 15 games a year, but IGN rates them all 7.0 and up because of the Super Nintendo days.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

So you're saying that it's pretty good when compared to similarly simplistic, treacle-paced games with repetitive waggle-filled combat?

Damning with faint praise indeed.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Deni's right, though. I can't really get behind the idea that it shouldn't have to be rated as a sonic game because it is a sonic game. Sonic isn't a hack n' slash title. It's a game about speed - that's why he's called Sonic.

What gets me is that while Sonic Team has been fucking around with gameplay styles (Heroes), control gimmicks (Seven Rings), ripping off God of War, trying to get us to accept Shadow into the canon, and generally ignoring the fans who started out with the franchise like twenty years ago while catering to the younger crowd who doesn't care about Sonic the Hedgehog, other development teams have gone and put actual innovation into their game design and turned out products like Mirror's Edge. Arguably not the best game ever, but still closer to what a Sonic title should be than anything Sonic Team's put out in a decade.

I forgot where I was going with this. Ah! Yes, a return to a more classic, less gimmick-based control scheme is a step in the right direction, but a long shot from a cure for our dear old friend. A goddamn sword isn't going to help Sonic out anymore than an edgy black foil did. Sonic doesn't need more gimmicks, it needs to go back to its roots: Speed, creative level design, a camera that doesn't resent the player, and for the love of God if the characters are going to have to speak than kill off everyone who wasn't on a Genesis title.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Ness the Mess

I mean, its just not fair that Mario can make 15 games a year, but IGN rates them all 7.0 and up because of the Super Nintendo days.

No, the Mario games get 7s or higher because they're still good. The trite crap like Mario Party get mediocre reviews usually, so that argument is weak. No one treats Sonic unfairly, it's just a shit series now.

Mario still ranks highly because it's still fantastic, and even most of its spin-offs are consistently good. Nostalgia is hardly boosting scores.

How ya doing, buddy?

Mario games are also competeing in a quite different market. Sonic on the 360 is up against hundreds of different games and IPs, many of which are a bit shit but some of which are really, really good. Your average Mario spin-off however, being on the Wii or DS is up against, well, a load of other Mario games, those terrible Imagine things a couple of lacklustre ports and Wii Fit/Sports/Play. This makes the Mario games look even better than they might already be as there's less stellar competition around.

If they only released Sonic games on a platform that had mainly Sonic games and a few other things that were for the most part a bit shit, I'm sure they'd score higher in reviwes.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

That doesn't explain why this Sonic game on the Wii sucks, though. The Wii library still has a terrible selection in a lot of genres-- with platformers, you have something like Super Mario Galaxy and de Blob and not much else. But here's another Sonic game, on the Wii (where there's the poor competition you're describing and saying would be influencing Mario reviews), and the Sonic game still gets slammed.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Maybe it's just not that fun, and Sonic gets bad press thanks to his recent games and unpleased hardcore fans. Too bad, that sucks. Better luck next time, though. :\ I'd still give SEGA the benefit of the doubt on this one for three reasons:

1) I never really followed the Sega/Sonic bandwagon back in the Genesis days, the Dreamcast days, or even the sucky recent-and-current gen jazz. I only really got into this world recently, so I refuse to give in to the popularly jaded opinion and believe it's already over.

2) I love Sonic. He's a likeable character, and I can't get enough of him.

3) Sonic Unleashed was not that bad; There were enough good things about it for me to think, "This isn't over." Also, I haven't played his recent 3D outings or even all of his handheld ventures, although I've already seen plenty of them to have formed some kind of perspective on them and the overall Sonic status at large.

Overall, I'm not fatalistic about Sonic's status in the industry. Whether or not he succeeds or peters out is still yet to be decided, as SEGA still seems to be going strong. If I get too caught up in this deal of "Is Sonic dead yet," or "Should he be killed off already," I'll never hear the end of it.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?