Why are people offended by the term "Islamic fascists"?

Here is the article from MSN:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14319984/

I usually despise Bush, but I have to defend him this time. "Islamic fascists" is a very accurate term to describe these terrorists. They are Islamic, and they are trying to spread a form of dictatorship that is based on religion and nationalism and racism. So why are the innocent people, the Muslims that do not fit into the group, offended by such terminology?

I say "If the shoe fits" . . . In this case, it does, by definition!

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I think the current administration remarking on anyone else's fascist values is the pot calling the kettle black.

Also, how exactly are they trying to spread a dictatorship based on racism? Religion, sure, Nationalism, okay, but race doesn't really come into it. Islam accepts converts from all backgrounds.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Because every brown person that looks at us crook-eyed is an islamic facist. Gitmo is stuffed with islamofacists, for instance.

It's a slur, Patty. By definition bad black people are niggers but you don't get to be shocked when folks take ill to its use.

dumbest ni--ah, nevermind

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by knkwzrd

I think the current administration remarking on anyone else's fascist values is the pot calling the kettle black.

Also, how exactly are they trying to spread a dictatorship based on racism? Religion, sure, Nationalism, okay, but race doesn't really come into it. Islam accepts converts from all backgrounds.

Race comes into it because, for whatever reason, the Jewish people are considered a race. I don't know why, that's just how it is, and the biggest nemesis of the terrorists is Israel, the literal "country of Jews".

Oh, and yes, I realize this country has plenty of fascist values, but that doesn't really make the term any less true, does it? Not all of us support our government, remember.

Originally Posted by a lurker

Because every brown person that looks at us crook-eyed is an islamic facist. Gitmo is stuffed with islamofacists, for instance.

Huh? Did you forget how to read, or do you just like antagonizing me? The term refers specifically to a select group of people, the group that others call a fanatic section of the Islamic faith. Now while that is just as accurate a description, how is "Islamic fascist" not accurate? They fit the term by definition. It has nothing to do with skin color, it has to do with the fact that the terrorists are a fanatic section of the Islamic faith trying to push their religion on the entirety of the world using violence as their primary weapon. By all definitions, they are fascists, hence "Islamic fascists".

Originally Posted by a lurker

It's a slur, Patty. By definition bad black people are niggers but you don't get to be shocked when folks take ill to its use.

How is it a slur? There is no relationship between the term "Islamic fascist" and the term "nigger", none. "Islamic fascist" is a term being used to describe the terrorists running rampant across the globe, it's not being used to describe all Muslims in general.

Why would a normal law-abiding and good Muslim be bothered by terrorists being called "Islamic fascists"? I'm not offended when white serial killers are called murdering psychopaths, as I'm not part of that group. The same should go for Muslims who are not part of the terrorist group, as neither they nor other good-natured Muslims being called by this term.

How about you read the article I posted and do a little homework, so that you're more informed the next time you decide to speak, hmmm?

Originally Posted by a lurker

dumbest ni--ah, nevermind

Right back at you, retarded piece of sh--ah, nevermind

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by PattyNBK

Here is the article from MSN:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14319984/

I usually despise Bush, but I have to defend him this time. "Islamic fascists" is a very accurate term to describe these terrorists. They are Islamic, and they are trying to spread a form of dictatorship that is based on religion and nationalism and racism. So why are the innocent people, the Muslims that do not fit into the group, offended by such terminology?

I say "If the shoe fits" . . . In this case, it does, by definition!

'muslim fascists' is a more appropriate term. 'islamic fascists' is NOT an accurate term to describe terrorists, if anything it's an oxymoron because what they are doing (or trying to do) is not islamic. it would be better (although i still find it distasteful) to call them muslim fascists because then you are not tainting the religion and everyone that follows it (the vast majority of peaceful muslims included). you need to learn to differentiate between a religion and what followers of a religion choose to do. the media never refers to israelis who oppress and murder innocent palestinians as 'jewish fascists/terrorists', so why do it to muslims? and before you try to argue that what the israelis are doing has nothing to do with religion, allow me to point out the fact that they chose to occupy palestine because they see it as their holy land, so it has everything to do with religion. and before you try to argue that what they are doing is islamic, please go and read the Qura'an from cover to cover as i have the feeling that you are very ignorant about this religion.

Double Post:

Originally Posted by PattyNBK

Why would a normal law-abiding and good Muslim be bothered by terrorists being called "Islamic fascists"? I'm not offended when white serial killers are called murdering psychopaths, as I'm not part of that group.

oh dear. based on your reasoning and arguments, you don't come across as being very intelligent. if white serial killers were referred to as 'white psychopaths' or 'american psychopaths' in the media i guarantee you would be offended.

Quote:

The same should go for Muslims who are not part of the terrorist group, as neither they nor other good-natured Muslims being called by this term.

decent muslims are, however, part of something called islam, and by using the term 'islamic fascist' you are associating them with fascism.

I was speaking idiomatically.

So, what you're saying is that your problem with "Islamic fascists" is that it uses the wrong adjective for describing someong or something of the Muslim faith?

This would create a problem for English speakers, since in English "Muslim" and "Islamic" can be used interchangeably.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by PattyNBK

Huh? Did you forget how to read, or do you just like antagonizing me? The term refers specifically to a select group of people, the group that others call a fanatic section of the Islamic faith. Now while that is just as accurate a description, how is "Islamic fascist" not accurate? They fit the term by definition. It has nothing to do with skin color, it has to do with the fact that the terrorists are a fanatic section of the Islamic faith trying to push their religion on the entirety of the world using violence as their primary weapon. By all definitions, they are fascists, hence "Islamic fascists".

And niggers refer to bad black people, who are niggers by the very definition of the word. I know that linear thought is beyond you but

Quote:

How is it a slur?

if a word is offensive to a lot of people and part of its definition is a subjective, negative quality (go ahead and define islamofacists who have not committed terrorism. Do they not exist?) then yes it is a slur by definition.

Quote:

"Islamic fascist" is a term being used to describe the terrorists running rampant across the globe, it's not being used to describe all Muslims in general.

Are you telling me that islamofacist has never been used indiscriminately? Really.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Lord Styphon

So, what you're saying is that your problem with "Islamic fascists" is that it uses the wrong adjective for describing someong or something of the Muslim faith?

This would create a problem for English speakers, since in English "Muslim" and "Islamic" can be used interchangeably.

they cannot be used interchangeably. for example, let's say that you have a muslim who believes in his faith but who is a bad muslim because he likes a bit of bacon and a bud every now and again. to say to this person that he is islamic would be completely wrong, because according to the code of conduct in islam all muslims are prohibited from eating pigs and drinking alcohol. he doesn't cease being a muslim because he is violating islamic rules, he's just a bad muslim. to call him islamic would mean that all those muslims who do abide by the rules are no better than him because they're being labeled with the same tag.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Theory: they cannot be used interchangeably.
Disproof: All News Articles of the last five years, esp. Fox.

How ya doing, buddy?

It's more accurate to describe them as Islamo-Revolutionaries, since their immediate goal is to reverse "modernizing" influences in Islam, and enforce a base fundamentalism. The establishment of a Caliphate would also be pretty keen to these dudes.

Ahmadinejad and the Iranian Mullahs are more Islamo-Fascists since they're more interested in using Islam to create a totalitarian political elite.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by George Doublebush

"This nation is at war with Islamic fascists who will use any means to destroy those of us who love freedom to hurt our nation."

Generalized statements like this which instill nebulous fear without specific information are exactly in line with the goals of terrorism.

http://www.zefrank.com/theshow/archi...08/081006.html

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by Lord Styphon

So, what you're saying is that your problem with "Islamic fascists" is that it uses the wrong adjective for describing someong or something of the Muslim faith?

This would create a problem for English speakers, since in English "Muslim" and "Islamic" can be used interchangeably.

QFT!

Last I checked, "Islam" is the religion, and "Muslim" is a practitioner of said religion.

Islam is to Christianity as Muslim is to Christian

To expand on Styphon's point, how can one be a Muslim and not be Islamic, or vice versa? Being part of one makes you part of the other, as they directly relate to each other just as with my Christian example above.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

I sort of understand why they would be offended, but there will always be people who are offended no matter how politically correct someone tries to be.

Spoiler:

Some people like be called "black" but hate being called "African American" b/c of the whole "Do I look like I'm from Africa to you? I was not born in Africa! My parents were not born in Africa!" And vice versa when you run into people who think that being called black is offensive "Excuse me? Does my skin look BLACK to you?"

There's also the whole "Native American" and "American Indian" argument. People who believe in calling them "Native Americans" b/c the term "indian" is insulting get a bunch of gruff from non-indian people saying, "Hey, I was born in America, that means I am a Native American." And then you have people with India origins who were born in America that occasionally like to cause a little confusion, but these scenarios are more rare around my region than the "black" vs. "African American" argument over political correctness.

It sounds like a political correctness problem to me--people of the Islamic faith are worried that this statement may look bad on them as a whole--but maybe there's more to it.

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Just a couple of things to comment on. Muslims will never get along with Jews, and vice versa. They never have. Never will. Anyone who believes in the Old Testament can see this after the "Ishmael" incident, where the "Angel of the Lord" said they would always be at each other's throats until the end of time.

I am just glad I dont live the hellhole called the Middle East!

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

The Muslims are offended because the term accuratley describes the fact that its people of the Islamic faith who have been behind the vast majority of the terrorist incidents in the world in recent times. Instead of being offended victims, good Muslims should rise up in outrage that their religion has been hijacked by a bunch of 7th centurt radicals, and should work to make the necessary changes from within.

FELIPE NO

To be fair, Christianity didn't rise up in outrage over the IRA, Christian terrorist groups in Northeast India, the Oklahoma City bombing or Eric Robert Rudolph, either.

There are extremists and fanatics to be found in every religion, so why do you think it should be up to all the members of the religion to rise up against people who use their personal beliefs as a false pretense to terrorism? More importantly, what makes you think that many Muslims aren't actually disgusted at these terrorist acts?

You know, how about you stop over-generalizing just for once, here?

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

I must've missed the part where the Oklahoma City Bomber was more Christian Psycho than Anti-Government Individualist Looney.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Rock

To be fair, Christianity didn't rise up in outrage over the IRA, Christian terrorist groups in Northeast India, the Oklahoma City bombing or Eric Robert Rudolph, either.

There are extremists and fanatics to be found in every religion, so why do you think it should be up to all the members of the religion to rise up against people who use their personal beliefs as a false pretense to terrorism? More importantly, what makes you think that many Muslims aren't actually disgusted at these terrorist acts?

You know, how about you stop over-generalizing just for once, here?

Actually, wasn't the OKC bombing more of a "White Power! Turner Diaries Rules!" kind of event rather than a Christian one? And yes, I do agree that there are Muslims that are disgusted over their behavior and even believe that what terrorists are doing is against the Qu'ran.

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A more accurate example are abortion clinic bombers. Most christians and pro-lifers find the bombings reprehensible, just like how most muslims aren't down with terrorism.

I don't know guys, why not call them 'terrorists' like before?

Originally Posted by Wesker

The Muslims are offended because the term accuratley describes the fact that its people of the Islamic faith who have been behind the vast majority of the terrorist incidents in the world in recent times. Instead of being offended victims, good Muslims should rise up in outrage that their religion has been hijacked by a bunch of 7th centurt radicals, and should work to make the necessary changes from within.

Oh, right, because it's important for the world to know that you don't like this religion.

How ya doing, buddy?

One entry found for fascism.


Main Entry: fas·cism
Pronunciation: 'fa-"shi-z&m also 'fa-"si-
Function: noun
Etymology: Italian fascismo, from fascio bundle, fasces, group, from Latin fascis bundle & fasces fasces
1 often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

Islamic Fascists seems a VERY appropriate name for Radical Muslim Terrorists, in fact I daresay calling them "Muslim fascists" would be more call for offense since that's actually giving them creedence as being Muslims. These people certainly adhere to the religion of Islam though [or atleast believe they do], and the goals of terrorist organization and mindset is closely geared to that of Fascism.

To answer the question, why are people offended?

I honestly don't know.

Where do they even get off being offended, they should be repulsed by the actions of these people who call themselves Muslims, not Bush for calling them out on it. Talk about picking the wrong battle.

I come from a family of moderate muslims, and my mother whenever she sees the news gets so angry because these people give Islam a bad name, and make life hellish for Muslims who don't share their views.

I say call them whatever the FUCK you'd like! They are the lowest of the low. Anybody who is offended by THAT needs to have a reality check, it doesn't make you a good/conscientious person, it makes you delusional.

Double Post:

Originally Posted by Wesker

The Muslims are offended because the term accuratley describes the fact that its people of the Islamic faith who have been behind the vast majority of the terrorist incidents in the world in recent times. Instead of being offended victims, good Muslims should rise up in outrage that their religion has been hijacked by a bunch of 7th centurt radicals, and should work to make the necessary changes from within.

Wesker, i completely, and utterly agree with you.

Islam is ripe for reform - instead of blaming internal problems on the west and Israel they should take a close look at their own corrupt governments, and what they're teaching their children [to hate] because that surely would improve the quality of life much moreso than waging a perpetual war on western ideology.

Nothing you said is offensive, or indicates a dislike for Islam. It tells it like it is.

a lurker? what the hell...what you just said is or atleast should be far more offensive to practicing muslims than what wesker said.
It implies you think what is being portrayed by terrorists is the real Islam. Which I don't think anybody with half a brain [openly] believes to be good.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Quote:

a lurker? what the hell...what you just said is or atleast should be far more offensive to practicing muslims than what wesker said.
It implies you think what is being portrayed by terrorists is the real Islam. Which I don't think anybody with half a brain [openly] believes to be good.

If it's agreed that terrorists don't embody the ideals and drives of mainstream religions, then why even bring their religion into it? that is what I said. I'm sorry if this is offensive to your tell-it-like-it-is sensibilities.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Well they obviously do practice a perverted version Islam, and their actions are under the banner of Islam - I think it's a stupid bone to pick. But I guess we can agree to disagree.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Do you think that us vs. them language can translate very easily into us vs. them mentalities, and that when dealing with something that is dangerously nuanced as trans-continental terrorism we shouldn't revert to patriotism and jingoism as explanations for their behavior?

What I'm trying to say is, is their religion their defining characteristic, and if not, why are you prominently displaying it in their new label?

How ya doing, buddy?

Calling them Islamic fascists is neither jingoistic nor patriotic, it's descriptive. They aren't all from one country, so you can't call them Iranian fascists, or whatever, the unifying factor among them is their religion. The desire of both Osama Bin Laden and Iran is the reestablishment of the caliphate from the middle east to Spain. This is religious movement at its core. Radical Islam seeks to establish Sharia law whenever it gains power, this law is a civil code for the people and is at its heart both a religious and political movement. The Caliphate and its establishment is Islamic Fascism.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Quote:

Calling them Islamic fascists is neither jingoistic nor patriotic, it's descriptive. They aren't all from one country, so you can't call them Iranian fascists, or whatever, the unifying factor among them is their religion.

Nationalism can be applied to religions since when?

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