Abusive Relationships

It's not an issue of whether it's "normal", I don't think that's relevant. There is a distinction between "abusive relationship" and "relationship where two consenting adults choose to resolve conflict via physical violence". I just don't really buy into the idea that two capable people should just suppress all their frustrations because "hitting people is wrong". But no, let's just all sit in a circle and talk it out even when the issue is so fundamental as to be beyond compromise.

You shouldn't hit someone who cannot reasonably be expected to mount a capable counterattack. Beyond that, why not? If both parties are in roughly equivalent states of physical fitness, then both of them will be injured to roughly the same degree.

Bonding!

I like how Elmo just dictated how Sass and I have to decorate our kitchen.

Fuck you, Jellyfish. You're not my real father.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by Elmoogle

Umm, I actually remember a thread where it was explicitly stated that Pang-n-Sass smack each other around every now and then. This is completely normal and if you disagree Pang will be sarcastic at you until you see things their way or get tired of arguing with a brick wall that has been decorated with a beautiful spray paint frescoe of a man pointing defiantly at a jellyfish.

To expand further on this, we've never put each other in the hospital or anything. And it's not like we're beating the bloody fuck out of each other.

It really does help, you know. He hits me, I hit him or vice versa. Until we end up laughing at each other or insulting each other in reallu juvenile ways.

"ANDY, YOU HIT LIKE A GIRL."
"DANIELLE, YOU ARE A GIRL."
"WHAT DID YOU JUST SAY TO ME!?"
"YEA, THATS RIGHT BITCH."

Laughter ensues. Or possibly violence. Its great for relieving stress.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Manis Tricuspis

You shouldn't hit someone who cannot reasonably be expected to mount a capable counterattack. Beyond that, why not? If both parties are in roughly equivalent states of physical fitness, then both of them will be injured to roughly the same degree.

From what Sass is describing, you guys have spats, not full-on fist fights. I don't see a big deal in that, I guess. I can also see a common understanding within it, too.

Sometimes you can get your point across without such accessive sarcasm. Ask Sass.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Devo

What if your situation never changes. What then?

well since we're dragging sass' personal life into this, I assume once she doesn't need her work to pay for college anymore, she's good to go?

Originally Posted by Soluzar

Dead? I must lead a really sheltered existance. I can't say that I realised people were ending up dead as a result of domestic violence... I know some people get pretty badly hurt as a result of it, but that's often when the "wake-up call" hits them, isn't it? Of course, I was speaking primarily of emotional abuse, which is the only kind I have any real experience of.

are you kidding me? domestic violence is pretty much the most dangerous type of situation that the police have to deal with. I assume it's because of the extreme likelyhood that someone's going to end up dead if things aren't dealt with in the best way possible.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by eks

Sometimes you can get your point across without such accessive sarcasm.

It seems like everyone should like sarcasm that's easy to access, though.

FELIPE NO

If I had to like remember a password just to get to my sarcasm, well, I wouldn't like that much at all.

Also, why is Elmoogle even here, I thought he left the internet.

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Originally Posted by ava lilly

are you kidding me? domestic violence is pretty much the most dangerous type of situation that the police have to deal with. I assume it's because of the extreme likelyhood that someone's going to end up dead if things aren't dealt with in the best way possible.

Nope, I'm really not kidding. I kinda figured most people got out of an abusive relationship when bones started getting broken, for example. I've no direct experience of physical abuse within a relationship, and the only cases I have second-hand knowledge of haven't escalated to quite that point.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by ava lilly

well since we're dragging sass' personal life into this, I assume once she doesn't need her work to pay for college anymore, she's good to go?

Since we're going to talk about it ANYways (ugh)

I think Devo just doesn't get my personality.

Yea, I think women in an abusive relationship should shut up or get out.

Whereas with ME and my work situation, I enjoy a good bitch fight. We all know this. I have been in bitch fights for the entire time I've been on this planet. I enjoy them. Sure, I get frustrated. Sure, I get my fair share of being dealt shit at work - like everyone.

But its a challenge for me. And while it makes me VERY angry and it makes me VERY frustrated, I am always up for a challenge. If I couldn't take it, I would leave, sure. But believe me, at this point, I am in it just to say I did it - just to win in the end. And like I said, the end will be in my favor - it's already determined. She loses her job and goes with the other guys.

And it's not like I don't abuse her either. I set little traps. I dish it out. I am just (surprisingly) a lot more passive aggressive with her than you think.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Soluzar

Dead? I must lead a really sheltered existance. I can't say that I realised people were ending up dead as a result of domestic violence... I know some people get pretty badly hurt as a result of it, but that's often when the "wake-up call" hits them, isn't it? Of course, I was speaking primarily of emotional abuse, which is the only kind I have any real experience of.

Sheltered indeed.

An awful lot of the time something relatively minor like screaming at each other can quickly turn into severe violence. Happens all the time.

The 'wake-up call' doesn't always hit. Some people will just continue to go back regardless of how often things get out of hand.

Devo, I'll give you the point about just tearing into a victim's self esteem etc. But it's quite another thing to tell someone that they deserve better, and that they are quite capable of taking care of themselves. They should sort their shit out or they are dumb. This *should* be encouraging, as you get across the sentiment that they deserve better, and putting up with the abuse is selling themselves short.

But, what would you suggest? Just a pat on the back and 'everything is going to be alright'? Tough love (sans abuse) can get a point across well. Touchy feely reassurance might as well be telling the victim to buck up and march back into the bad situation for another round.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

In all honesty, I don't know why women (generally speaking. This can apply to men too) deal with this shit.

This topic hits pretty close to home, as there's someone in my house who's currently in a particularly shitty and abusive relationship. They know damn well what they need to do to fix this problem--break up with said spouse, cut off communication, move on with life--but for whatever inane, batshit reason... Even though the fucker has cheated on them multiple times, has evidently hit them (I've seen the bruises!), humiliated and discouraged said family member... Ugh. They still fucking "love" their shitty shit significant other.

And even though people outside looking in on the situation know that it's not love, that it's issues with self-esteem and all of this other shit, it's a hopeless and helpless cause to try and work with these people because they refuse to listen to reason. It's both a sad and frustrating effort, to try and pull these people out of their rut and get them going toward something better.

However, the descision to change must be made completely by themselves. They're pretty much the only ones who can do anything in (abusive) situations like these.

How ya doing, buddy?

Quote:

Posted by Sassafrass
Yea, I think women in an abusive relationship should shut up or get out.

Whereas with ME and my work situation

So what makes you different?

See, when Lehah suggests you smear dog shit under everything she owns and everyone else is nodding in agreement, it's because nobody else thinks you're different from any other abused person. You just think you are. Yes, abused people really do sound like that.

The real solution really would be to walk away from it, but you won't. And worse, you still don't seem to realize at all how little you're really doing to resolve the situation. You're letting ego get the better of you with this notion that you're strong enough to put up with it for extremely nebulous ends.

Honestly - why DO you put up with it all? And don't say "to win", because that's not a real goal. Not in real life.

Quote:

Posted by Seris
They still fucking "love" their shitty shit significant other.

It's rather depressing how few people can distinguish between actual love, and mere infatuation. That, plus the other common misconception that "love conquers all" when all accumulated knowledge on the subject says otherwise. People won't use their heads in relationships.

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Well, Seris, you do have to take into account that some people are dependent on boyfriend/girlfriend relationships.

Society puts so much pressure on you having a partner that I know the more weak people will certainly get someone and just accept it.

Also, the fact that many people don't think they can do better or that there's no better kind of people out there. (I wouldn't critize them for thinking there's not that much better people out there)

I'm sure there's people from messed up backgrounds who have men hit them all of the time and call it a 'love tap'.

There's many factors that could make them just accept it.

Double Post:

Originally Posted by Monkey King

People won't use their heads in relationships.

Until it almost gets chopped off by their so-called "lover".

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Sassafrass

How do you define an abusive relationship? Do you put physical abuse higher on the scale than mental abuse?

Have you ever been in an abusive relationship? What advice would you give to others?

Or maybe you hate the very notion and think 'dem bitches DESERVE what they get.

Let's tawk.

Mental and emotional abuse is worse than physical abuse. It least with physical abuse, the marks will go away. Emotional damage stays around a lot longer than an actual wound does.

Yes, I've been in an abusive relationship. My advice to others would probably be to pay attention to your surroundings and your boyfriend/girlfriend's behavior. People tend to behave one way when you're dating, just married, etc. Somewhere along the line, they have to screw up and the real person comes out. That's what you need to watch out for.

Sassumomo, why are you curious about something like this?

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Lady Miyomi

Sassumomo, why are you curious about something like this?

Alice had made a journal entry about something like it. I saw some potential in a thread there. So I made it.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Devo

I'd more than likely make sure they checked themselves in a battered women's shelter and had the women there talk to them. The best advice or knowledge they can acquire is from their peers and women who have been in the situation. They might not listen to me, but hopefully they'll listen to the woman who went through a similar situation. Sometimes we simply don't listen to advice (even if it's relevant or good) because we don't want to hear what someone (who has no idea what we're going through) has to say. However, it is much harder to ignore women who were in denial also and realized that they shouldn't stick around.

That's just the thing. How do you expect to 'make sure' they check in? All you can do is say things which you hope will convince them to go of their own volition. Most people just want a shoulder to cry on, but absolutely refuse to hear good advice when it comes their way. They desire sympathy, not help. In telling them things in a somewhat harsh way, you shatter their expectation of sympathy, and potentially get your point across. Their situation is beyond mere sympathy is what they *should* learn.

What's all this shit about physical abuse and emotional abuse being mutually exclusive? When a loved one hits you the marks may fade but the emotional effects of being hit by your boyfriend/girlfriend remain. It's not like when you get physically hit it doesn't also register with you emotionally.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Lady Miyomi

Mental and emotional abuse is worse than physical abuse. It least with physical abuse, the marks will go away. Emotional damage stays around a lot longer than an actual wound does.

Yes, I've been in an abusive relationship. My advice to others would probably be to pay attention to your surroundings and your boyfriend/girlfriend's behavior. People tend to behave one way when you're dating, just married, etc. Somewhere along the line, they have to screw up and the real person comes out. That's what you need to watch out for.

Sassumomo, why are you curious about something like this?

Well, my male friend had been abused by his uncle.

What i have gathered from asking people and rectifying reallife cases is that Physical abuse is not just Physical it comes with Mental disorders.
In other words Mentaltrauma is inherent in Physical abuse.

I agree with Miyomi, we are living in masquerade.People are not what they seem.
Now i understand why Miyomi was secretive with me on that day.
Hmmm.:eyebrow:

There's nowhere I can't reach.

I much rather go through physical abuse (not that I'm ever going to again!) because at least with that, you can fight back. However, with emotional abuse, you can't really fight back. There's way too many people in this world that have had stuff happen to them that take it out on their boyfriends/girlfriends.

I have no real reason to trust people in general, however, I do realize that there are people in this world that aren't like my ex and other people. I just don't feel like putting myself out there like that again because I might stab the next person that tries to put me through that again. I have various knives around me almost at all times, so I'm not playing.

Sexninja ~ The reason why I'm sorta secretive with certain things I say is because my ex had me stalked for awhile after I first left him. He had people watching me, coming up to me trying to be my friend and find out my business. I'm sure he's still up to his tricks because he tried it again recently.

Oh and another thing to watch out for, if you ever break up or threaten to break up with your boyfriend/girlfriend and they threaten to kill themselves...RUN IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION IMMEDIATELY.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

From a counselor/psychological standpoint, physical abuse is not just physical but always has a mental abuse component as well. Most of the time, people are just not aware of the mental component. As for it being hard to hurt someone with words...spend one day in as a counselor and you'll see how false this statement is. Words hurt longer and more deeply than physical abuse in most situations.

Abuse is abuse, regardless of its form. As a counselor, I have to help those who are hurt by abuse and those who are abusers. I strongly believe that everyone deserves a second chance, if they can prove they are truely worth it.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by washyu64

From a counselor/psychological standpoint, physical abuse is not just physical but always has a mental abuse component as well. Most of the time, people are just not aware of the mental component. As for it being hard to hurt someone with words...spend one day in as a counselor and you'll see how false this statement is. Words hurt longer and more deeply than physical abuse in most situations.

Abuse is abuse, regardless of its form. As a counselor, I have to help those who are hurt by abuse and those who are abusers. I strongly believe that everyone deserves a second chance, if they can prove they are truely worth it.

God, I wonder if you could ooze more sensitive feelings if you tried.

I don't see why you people put so much emphasis on this supposed "mental abuse." The only place I can see it being valid would be in the matter of children. I think there definitely IS mental abuse for them, only because their mind and thought processes aren't matured or solidified.

As for grown adults, I don't know what could be worse. A person who cries and whines about someone treating them in a manner which makes them feel worthless and does nothing about it, or those whole dole out the sympathy to these people like its the end of the fucking world.

PEOPLE ARE MEAN. The world isn't made of daisies and roses. People will try to take advantage of you at every corner - to think otherwise is only naive.

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People who claim to be mentally abused generally aren't doing anything about it - otherwise, they wouldn't be talking/complaining about it. They perpetuate the problem it's self by feeding it with their presence. I don't think you can get much stupider than that.

Mental abuse IS real - but unless you're locked in a box and stuffed under the bed you're at as much fault of the situation as the person who's calling you bad names. Get over it.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by LeHah

People who claim to be mentally abused generally aren't doing anything about it - otherwise, they wouldn't be talking/complaining about it. They perpetuate the problem it's self by feeding it with their presence. I don't think you can get much stupider than that.

Wow. Finally. Someone who agrees with me. Well, partially anyways.

I can't imagine "mental abuse" being upheld in a court for anything. It could mean pretty much anything from calling a girl a stupid whore to throwing her down a dry well and telling her to put lotion on her skin. Which actually borders on physical abuse, but whatever.

Quote:

Mental abuse IS real - but unless you're locked in a box and stuffed under the bed you're at as much fault of the situation as the person who's calling you bad names. Get over it.

Wait. Wouldn't the actual physical act of locking someone in a box and shoving them under the bed be PHYSICAL abuse?

Mental abuse is such a world of crap. Stop feeling bad for yourselves. Jesus.

FELIPE NO

Quote:

Posted by Lady Miyomi
Sexninja ~ The reason why I'm sorta secretive with certain things I say is because my ex had me stalked for awhile after I first left him. He had people watching me, coming up to me trying to be my friend and find out my business. I'm sure he's still up to his tricks because he tried it again recently.

Kill a small animal and nail it to his door with a threatening note. That should get the point across.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

I can't believe that your argument against mental abuse is that basic. Everytime a situation makes you *feel bad* due to something someone said or did in order to hurt you, that's mental abuse. That's all it is, nothing more, nothing less. You can't seriously be arguing that nothing anyone has ever said or done has hurt your feelings? This notion is so entirely alien that those who claim it are 'full of crap'?

I agree with you that you shouldn't just lamely feel bad for yourself, and that you should get over it. You may get over things quickly, or at least most of it quickly, but that doesn't mean that something didn't happen.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by PUG1911

I can't believe that your argument against mental abuse is that basic. Everytime a situation makes you *feel bad* due to something someone said or did in order to hurt you, that's mental abuse. That's all it is, nothing more, nothing less. You can't seriously be arguing that nothing anyone has ever said or done has hurt your feelings? This notion is so entirely alien that those who claim it are 'full of crap'?

You just proved my point.

EVERYONE has had to undergo "mental abuse" at one point or another. It's a bunch of bullshit to claim that you were "mentally abused" or something. Who gives a shit, right? Everyone gets shit on in their lives.

And I don't see why everyone should be walking around on tip-toes to avoid offending everyones' precious feelings. Give me a break.

Mental abuse is just a bunch of crap, you know? O someone mentally abused you? You poor, poor bloke! HERE. LET MOMMY MAKE IT BETTER. Give me a break, mate.

People have certainly HURT my feelings. But who cares, right? I'm not whining about it, and I don't claim to have been "ABUSED" because someone hurt my fucking feelings. Are you kidding me.

Its a part of life, fuckers. Get over it.

Quote:

I agree with you that you shouldn't just lamely feel bad for yourself, and that you should get over it. You may get over things quickly, or at least most of it quickly, but that doesn't mean that something didn't happen.

It's best for one to try and learn from these things instead of feel sorry for oneself.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Sass, your machismo in response to mental abuse would be admirable, except that as stated repeatedly, in the same situation you yourself don't do anything to rectify the situation. Vague statements that "things will be changing soon" are the words of a battered wife. You're banking on your dad changing his ways, which we all know is not going to happen. You're not being proactive enough to drive your arch-nemesis away, nor are you willing to swallow your pride and quit.

You're guilty of the very thing you're railing against and you don't even know it.

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