Hateful Protesting, freedom of speech?

Originally Posted by Wesker

So they think Jesus would approve of harrassing the families of fallen soldiers because the United states somehow approves of homosexuality?

You are asking whether the Westboro Baptist Church is seriously insane. The answer is yes. Yes they are.

Unfortunately half of them are also lawyers, and tenacious fucks at that. The measure is unconstitutional in the same way that murdering pedophiles when they're not kiddie-touching is unconstitutional. Making this law was a bad idea, and it will not end well.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Gumby

That may be true, but these people are doing something that makes flag burning look like a Sunday walk through the park. They can pull what ever legal crap they want, I do not think the American people will not tolerate it.

Unless the American people can disbar lawyers and also oust Supreme Court judges, I doubt their not liking it will have any effect on Westboro's actions. What, do you think these kooks actually care about their popularity? They revel in being hated!

Double Post:

Originally Posted by Generic Badass

No one can prove that they're doing this just for the publicity, and you have to take them at their word. Even if it is painfully obvious that that's exactly why they're doing it.

No, saying something like that is dumb. Becides, what proof do you have that they aren't seeking the publicity? Just saying, I don't really care.

Also, to Devo etc: this is just one crazy family and a few married-into people. It's not Baptists at all or even a crazy offshoot.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Generic Badass

Considering these people haven't broken any laws yet, I thiink we're meant to go on the honor system. I dunno, maybe I'm alone in that.

Yes, you are completely alone in that. You don't have to break a law in order to be a liar or not entirely truthful, you know. Becides, getting free publicity isn't against the law either. You're weird, and also mildly immature.

Devo: Yeah, that's the group.

Double Post:

Originally Posted by VitaPup

I just went to check out the godhatesfags.com site, and was rather disturbed. Not so much by what it was saying, but by the pictures of their protests. There are so many little children holding up those signs. I feel bad for anybody being raised in that type of enviornment.

You know the funniest part? they make the children hold up the most immflamatory signs, for maximum impact. It's sort of taboo, seeing children holding such atrocious opinions. Plus, you'd be a lot more willing to punch a guy holding a "GOD CAUSED 9/11" sign than a child.

What can I say, Phelps is an evil but smart bastard.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by Generic Badass

I know you can be a liar and not break the law. However, how is it right to call someone a liar and condemn them outright when they haven't been unlawful? You can call these people "morally questionable", yes

Because that's what most people are doing already, you silly boy. Why aren't you reading what you're writing? Everyone admits that they are morally repungant and that they are seeking attention, this is a seperate issue to the new law's constitutionality. I don't know why you even brought it up.

Quote:

What did I do, if you don't mind my asking?

You're arguing for the sake of being contrary, and selectively ignoring things people say (including yourself) in order to do so.

If you're trying to argue a point you don't believe in, you are doing a poor job of it.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Generic Badass

I brought it up because people seem to think it's okay to silence the Westboro Baptist Church because they strongly feel the protestors are lying and putting on a show for the public to notice. I'm trying to argue that you can't call that a valid reason for trying to shut them up.

No you're not. You're arguing - or at least, what you're saying - is that you can't judge a group as liars unless they're doing something illegal. This... this doesn't even make sense.

Why don't you do what you say you've been doing? Yeah, argue the constitutionality of this law. That'll be more relevant and less embarassing to yourself.

Quote:

What am I being selective about?

[...]

[A]nd I'm not objecting just for the sake of it.

Specifically, you said that you can be a liar and not break the law, but you can't be condemned as a liar unless you break the law. I don't know, buddy, I think you should stick to words you have a better grasp on. If you want to say, "Simply because these guys are showboating and also complete assholes, there should not be unconstitutional laws made to target them specifically" or something, then just say that. See how easy it is? But you keep digging this hole of "but you don't KNOW FOR CERTAIN that they're lying, you only ASSUME" which is bullshit and anyway Fred Phelps was quoted as admitting he does it for attention.*

* If you think that wasn't in the quote, you need to learn reading comprehension.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Generic Badass

I'm not saying that they're not liars until something illegal is done, I'm saying that since there hasn't been any sort of criminal activity, why not just let them have the benefit of the doubt? But I'm not saying you can't be judgmental, I'm saying you shouldn't be. I just think you should tolerate others in case, sometime down the line, the roles are reversed.

You can be morally wrong without doing a thing illegal. If you think it's judgemental to find the Westboro corps bad people, you really don't know anything about them. Here, read this. It's long, but it's a primer to the Phelps clan: Addicted To Hate

Quote:

Yes, I see how easy that is. It would have been better for getting that point across, but tolerance is what I'm emphasizing. The first amendment freedoms have some ugly sides like this and KKK rallies and all that stuff, but we should and do tolerate it because of the good sides it has.

Look, I'll come out and say that, safety issues aside, I agree that Westboro has the right to preach their message. That said, you're still arguing two different things. You're asking people to be taken as fools in the name of Tolerance, and you think this is an effective argument against the law as passed. It is not. You would do a lot better by dropping the whole lying argument altogether.

Quote:

I don't think that's what he was saying, though I can see how someone might believe that. It seems like he was expressing his cynicism in the general public, with it having no "real" faith in God. He knew people thought he and his church were crazy, so he made his opening comment in frustration, but then contradicted himself shortly later by hoping that "some will be saved" by his preaching and protests.

Your ignorance about the subject matter is unsightly. Please read the link, and do not reply to this thread until the entire thing is read. It didn't take me longer than an evening to do it.

Double Post:

Originally Posted by Generic Badass

Because pissing people off is just... pissing people off. It doesn't do anything. Why would they have absolutely no goal in doing this? Do they need to find some way to pass the time? Is this some sort of sick joke to them?

There obviously has to be some purpose,

If you don't think pissing people off is a purpose in and of itself, you haven't been on the internet. Christ, kid, you're hopelessly optimistic.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Generic Badass

The link doesn't even matter when Phelps has said that he hopes some will be saved.

Are you telling me that examples of behavior in a subject doesn't matter when the subject exhibits certain behaviors now? I.... what? Are you stupid?

Quote:

He is expressing a desire to change the opinions of those who do not think like himself and his family, which indicates that he has a goal to gather others. This contradicts your belief and interepretation of his comments that this is just for the attention.

1 that's the definition of lying, yes

2 actions speak louder than words

3 how many licks does it take to get to the center of my dick

4 you don't think his past behavior or the behavior of his church has anything to do with anything

5 he said specifically "We don't picket to win people over, idiot. It's to harden people's hearts. Make them hate.", I mean, i don't know what more evidence you want re: trolling and attention-grabbing

6 you can have a goal that you do not work towards, please see new years resolutions

7 keep licking boy, you ain't even close

Quote:

How is Phelps comparable to the average internet retard? You said it yourself, the man is shrewd. He has more of a purpose than to just piss people off, and you know that.

he's not the average internet retard, he's the dedicated troll. Whose purpose is also to piss people off.

You know, I find it very intolerant that you would suggest only retards want to make other people angry. Shouldn't you take them at face value, unless they do something wrong eg break the law? Don't they deserve the benefit of the doubt, something you're even willing to give the Westboro Baptist Church?

FELIPE NO