[Amusing] Tiers, jeers, and queers. Fuck it. I'm off to have some beers.

Originally Posted by YOU MAD

Carl will be looked over until people work at him and realize how big of a threat he really is.

No matter how many infinites people discover with him, he will never be anything above D (MAYBE C) tier. There's many reasons for this, but the only one that really needs to be mentioned is that nearly all of his moves leave him at a disadvantage on block except for 6C. And that doesn't even give him any advantage on block. It leaves him even. To make things worse, it's incredibly slow at i29.

Simplified version for those that don't understand the terminology:

Turtling > Carl

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Dark Nation

Jesus you Tourneyfags move fast, already setting up tiers n' shit.

Well, before I can even attempt fighting online, I still need to get a hang of the combos. See, I wish the command list corresponded to the letters on the controller's buttons. Would make it a lot easier to do a move, but now I have to add an extra step in converting the command list's ABCD to ABXY, and I don't even know which corresponds to which half the time.

/rant

Game is still fun otherwise though.

Tourneyfag? So, I'm that because I play the game with all the options the devs make available to me? How cute.

Two things:

1. The game has been out in arcades for damn near a year.

2. The tier list I go by is the one Arcadia Magazine gives out in Japan. The game has been out in Japan arcades for longer than it was over here.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Kurado

Newsflash: Tiers don't really mean shit in this game.

Carl is a beast so long as you, you know, don't try to solo your opponent. You need to work with Nirvana, setting up combos and mix-ups in order to utilize the character's full potential and wtfpwn your opposition.

But by all means pigeon-hole a character into being sub-par when he's clearly not.

Tiers don't have to mean a character is useless. It just means the bottom tier has to work much harder than the higher tiers to win the majority of their matchups. Carl fits this scenario ten fold. This is the only reason people SHOULD care about tiers at all. It certainly is the only reason I care about them so don't pigeon-hole me with the pretentious jerkoffs of a community like the Super Smash Brothers tournament players.

Most amazing jew boots

Originally Posted by Terminus

Tiers don't mean shit if you got the lowdown on your character and your playstyle against other opponents, just sayin'.

Okay, I understand you guys get all foamy in the mouth when the word "tier" gets brought up in any discussion on a fighting game, but the argument that "They don't matter when you learn your character blah blah blah" does not hold water. That's like saying the pawn in chess kicks ass when used correctly. That's all about the player and almost nothing the character. I will say this again: Tiers in fighting games exist to show you which characters have the least amount of trouble winning based on their matchups with the whole cast. "Tiers" exist in everything that is competitive. From rankings in MMA/Boxing, to characters in fighting games. I can only hope you guys can learn to not get all whiny when the word comes up again in the future.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by YOU MAD

How about in the future you just don't mention tiers and talk about the strengths and weaknesses of given characters. "Tiers" don't really get us anywhere discussion wise, they're just some circle jerk nonsense to cop-out a loss by many jerks. I'd rather we not go down that road. I'm not invalidating tiers by the way, just not a fan of the way they never end up in anything constructive.

Having a constructive discussion about them is purely dependent on the community that is discussing them. I agree on dropping it there though.

Here's some good info for you Carl players:

Carl Clover Move Data

And here's how you decipher what exactly most of that means:

BlazBlue - General Information

If anyone that's interested still has trouble figuring out what this stuff exactly means, I'd be happy to help explain it.

I highly recommend starting with the basics. Don't waste all your time practicing whatever infinite combo if you don't know how to apply it in a match. A lot of the basics apply almost universally to fighting games, so if you enjoy playing them online, I highly recommend putting a little bit of time into learning to understand exactly what's happening on screen. It even makes losing a lot more bearable because you'll be able to pinpoint exactly why you lost and be ready for it the next time.

I'm currently going through the process of learning how to escape Noel's drive shenanigans. I don't look forward to players who actually whore out her jab that gives +3 on block either...

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Miles

Who the hell calculates and adds shit in a fighting game. What ever happened to just running up to someone and punching them using the buttons on your controller?

Who the hell works on their cardio and speed for a sport?

Who the hell learns how the pieces move in Chess?

Who the hell memorizes how disassemble and reassemble a vehicle to work at a garage?

The devs make this information available in these games for a reason. Sure, you can just run up to someone and throw out random attacks in the game if that floats your boat. You can also get into a fight with a boxer and just run up to him with your arms flailing around. Chances are, neither situation will lead to a desired result.

Originally Posted by Dark Nation

Dude, Chill out. I fully expected people to tier the characters, I was just surprised it had happened so fast on the consoles. Tourneyfag is a generic moniker anyway.

Guess ive been lurking on imageboards too much.

I apologize for getting all anal about it. It's just annoying to being labeled as something like that, because the majority of people that do play fighting games give everyone such a bad stigma.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Miles

Yeah. Why become a car mechanic when you could spend your career memorizing random character charts to win in some fighting game.

You totally convinced me. Sign me up!

YouTube Video

Why spend an hour or two to learn how to play a fighting game when I can be like that dude in the blue shorts!

You totally convined me. Sign me up!

On a serious note, are you really gonna keep this nonsense up? Someone asked to post some constructive information on the game. I do that, and I get people whining about having to read constructive information about the game?

So, guys. Why do the video gaming boards suck again? Skills couldn't have been more right.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Mo0

People who are very into those subjects, that's who.

People, however, who just want to play football with their buddies, or play Chess as a quick mental exercise, or drive a car to work and back, don't want to be looked down upon or told "you're doing it wrong" when they choose not to learn the inner workings of it.

You're right, the devs do make the information available, the same way a car manufacturer makes the internal diagrams of the car available. That doesn't mean the car maker is saying that's the only way to use the car.

Sure, your knowledge of how the engine works will allow you to choose the right pieces and operate the car with more precision. But the rest of us who just want to maybe drive a donut in an empty parking lot would rather not be told we're not allowed to do so. We're not ruining your fun!

Manny I <3 but you're playing with fire here

As for the post you made above while I was writing this one, the objection I think stems from just how indepth it was. I think the advice being asked for wasn't quite so detailed; something along the lines of "here's a few examples of how to use Carl", not "here is a spreadsheet of everything Carl does" is what was being looked for.

I know where you guys are coming from, but you all seem to be missing that fact that I threw the info out there for anyone who was interested in it. I even said so in the post. Anyone who wasn't could have simply moved on, but of course that would be asking too much for a few members of the jolly old gamingforce crew. Whatever. I'll leave it at that for the night.

If anyone is still interested in having some of this stuff explained, feel free to get at me on Xbox live at Manello Biggz. If not, then carry on.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?