Religion: What it means to you

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Please tell me what Atheism means to you? I have covered many aspects of my beliefs but the atheists here have not. The atheistic views of my religion have been made quite clear. Can you take this discussion in a different direction?

Look, you lunatic.

We've said over and over again: atheism is a lack of belief. We don't believe in ANYTHING. We live without deities.

We don't need deities. We can survive as your classic "good people" without the guidance of a deity.

The atheists I know are good, good people. They respect other peoples' religious beliefs, and never try to impose theirs on others. They realize it's fucking annoying - to mention disrespectful. They lead their lives the same way any other person does.

There is no "beliefs," LordSword. Thats why it's called "ATHEISM." Literally "without belief."

We don't look to the sky, hoping that something higher than us will guide us, give us strength, and help us through life.

We feel that all the thigns we do in life are OUR decisions. We are the masters of our own ship - we control our decisions, and we make them as best we can.

While we do not believe in a deity, we still strive to be HONEST, GOOD PEOPLE. Because every human DESERVES that.

I suppose it takes a HELL of a lot more strength to go through life knowing that you are making decisions ALONE. No one up there is watching out for us - we're watching out for both ourselves and those around us.

To go forth in life knowing that there is no guidance or love from a deity is more difficult, I think, than thinking Daddy God is up there to hug and kiss your boo-boos when you're down. We chose this way because we feel it's better to be honest with ourselves. I can see why people would turn to religion in times of pain or doubt; it's a very comforting thought. But to me, it's a lie. It makes you soft and warm thinking "golly gee, someone out there LOVES ME." But it's best not to delude yourself: you're just feeling down and out, and you need that feeling. You CRAVE that feeling. You want to feel loved and accepted.

But it's just a comforting device. And once it becomes more than that, wars can be waged in the name of My God X, and men will die over something so silly.

If you want to believe in a deity, no one can tell you that it's right or wrong, in the same fashion that you can't tell US what's right and wrong.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Pangalin

Buddhists do it all the time.

Everyone loves a Buddhist, man.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by LordsSword

I eagerly look forward to what Jackyboy has to say. Atheism is full of deities but to make yourselves look "smart" by using different terms.

Yea, I look really smart by saying "I don't believe in a deity."

So. You wanna tell me what I/we worship? I'd love to know, since you know me/us better than I/we know ourselves!

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Origin of the universe & life according to atheists: Chance (or probability) Despite the lack of proof.
Who controls the destiny of an atheist: The individual. This view is shared by some cults too.

Yea, thats a huge generalization and kind of inaccurate, too.

I recommend you have a conversation with some atheists (WITHOUT preaching to them) to get a little more educated about what different atheists think.

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I admit it my religion means support to me as well. My support does not come only from my God. My book calls for believers to rally together help one another & help the rest of the world under specific guidelines. You call yourself "good" but what does this term mean when ultimately you the atheist live in a world defined by no accountability.

You're a dumbass. Really. The only reason you can keep yourself in check is because of your belief in god, yet you have the audacity to imply that atheists can't be "good people" because we hold no accountability with a deity.

Whatever keeps you from murdering and raping, thats fine. If your god is personal leash, that's FINE. I don't CARE what you believe in. It's when you start running at the mouth, pointing your fucking fingers, judging and preaching. You need to exercise a little more tolerance and a little more understanding. Jesus wouldn't be proud of you.

Myself? I like to consider how my actions affect others before I do them. I try not to harm anyone in this life, and I live to help those who need it.

I don't need a religion to be a "good" person. Do you?

(of course, we've gone down THIS road before with you, LordSword. You like to just spout religious rhetoric and not listen to a word anyone but yourself says.)

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Who says what is good when everyone is free to determine their own tastes under your system? Abuse of other people is condemned by the bible but how can you define abuse with the lack of a consistent authority?

Some people, believe it or not, DONT BELIEVE IN A CONSISTENT AUTHORITY.

Why do you need that authority? Can't you decide for yourself?

Wait. Religion is AGAINST thinking for yourself. Now I see why you're having a hard time understanding this all.

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My support by other people in my religion is much like the Power Rangers. We need each other for strength and we depend on a power beyond ourselves to overcome adversity which is proven again and again with successful social reforms throughout history in many different countries.

O man. All I had to do was read "Power Rangers" and I had a laughter fit.

Life isn't a sci-fi childrens' show, LordSword. Maybe when you grow up and you see how the world really works, you'll start to understand what people around you are telling you:

Harm none. Help as many as you can. Love your brother. We're not all that different, you and I - you and anyone in the world. Humans GENERALLY hold the same things precious, and aim to protect them.

I just don't believe in god. You do.

Good for you, applause applause, now carry on.

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Furthermore, its a proven scientific fact prayer has positive psychological benefits lending additional strength in times of hard work & persecution.

Yea, PSYCHOLOGICAL benefits. But god ain't answering your call, buddy. Your BRAIN is.

Did you know that you can also WILL yourself into being ill?

The mind is a powerful thing. I recommend you start using it to think instead of to preach.

Most amazing jew boots

Originally Posted by LordsSword

I knew you would like that! I'm glad I can bring some happiness to you. The Christian is given figurative examples in the bible to live up to despite the pressure of the REAL world. By changing our perception of our circumstances we can become greater than the reality that is presented to us by others. (1 Samuel 17 & Ephesians 6:10-19)

Yea, I know. They tell you to try and appeal the WORD OF GOD to others with using some metaphors that are more easily related to.

Though you kind of failed.

I wasn't happy so much as I pitied you.

I'm 25 years old. I don't watch Power Rangers.

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On many occasions I had the chance to team up with folks from different denominations for one cause or another. Even though we came from different traditions be they old young or disabled my breast burned with pride as we stood shoulder to shoulder in prayer and clashed with the issues at hand with a unified front.
Even now I suspect that prayers have been fueling my efforts thus far.

Thanks to my unseen team out there, thank you for your support.

Wow. Psychology is awesome, isn't it.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Casual_Otaku

YouTube - The Essence of Security in America and in Saudi Arabia

Did you uh, want to explain this at all??

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Sure we can. Don't we do it all the time with the dreams that fuel our goals.
Consider Stephen Hawking or any other diasbled person that does great things despite the "reality" that they live in. Religion isn't always the stregnth that heroic people draw from but it provides a guide for those who don't know where to start. Thats the intent of the Christian faith, its a guide for us when we realize our crippled condition.

What does Stephen Hawking have to do with your argument at all??

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Sassafrass told me that there is no real ultimate authority for direction, but your statements sound much like his.

That's MY belief, you jackass.

RainMan can think whatever he wants about his belief. He's obviously an atheist, but he has his own perception of reality.

You need to start using your head, LordSword. Seriously.

I am also FEMALE. Ugh.

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What is the source for this insight that provides direction? Have you checked the source? Why do you trust statements like the one you typed if you don't know the source?

Ahahhahaa o my sweet baby JESUS, you're fucking PRECIOUS.

"Hey guys what are your sources? MINE IS THE BIBLE."

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I ask this because I have intimate knowlege of my source which is the bible. I can see it, touch it, and check it with all the other materials and people that are attached to its texts. I know its history, the histories of its followers & the results of its knowlege in practice and misuse. Can you say the same about your source?

The Bible is not exactly a great reference unless you're in a religiously-inclined discussion. The Bible isn't a source of fact so much as it is a source of inspiration.

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Pride a sin? If you believe what the bible teaches in this area, why don't you be on my team? You would do great.

It's nice to think you regard your religion as a "team" - one side against another.

You are the reason wars are fought. I hope one day you will die in protecting your beliefs. We need more martyrs like you! (O, Darwinism)

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Whats wrong with zeal? My book is full of them. They had zeal because what they often fought for what is true. Consider for one minute the notion that I believe what I do because I have enough evidence and millions of other people in the world do too. ALL of us can't be wacked in the head. That the reason why scientists have gone so far as to make books on their findings in this area.

My religion means evidence!! Not just blind belief! The founders of my faith died because they would not stop telling people about their evidence.
I dont hope in some ritual, statue, or even myself. My hope is in the power that has changed my life and the lives of some of my friends and family.

You sound so much like Legion, it's not even funny. Kind of creepy. I wonder if you hate queers as much as he did.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by LordsSword

So you are saying that you have no source for direction but your own will. You can do whatever you want when you want ect.

Wrong.

Go back and read, fool. We've said it over and over again. You just don't read English, I guess.

Pray that you learn. I bet that will solve the problem!

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Sassafrass & Rainman, is this the reality that you use as your source of direction?

Is what the reality of our blah blah blah?

We've said what we use to guide us through life, dolt. If you're confused, learn to read more closely.

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I am confused I only want to understand. You insist that I am going the wrong way on the highway of life yet you give no map, you dont even point in some direction.

No, we didn't say you're going the wrong way. I have said AT LEAST A DOZEN TIMES that you are, by all means, entitled to believe whatever you want to believe, PROVIDED you don't IMPOSE ON OTHERS, AND THEIR BELIEFS.

I hope that was clear enough that time.

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You two are of no help at all yet you say you know whats right.

NO ONE IS PERFECT (for the FIFTH time). People did "good" before your Jesus and your god ever came around, LordSword. Jesus and Christianity didn't INVENT good people.

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By your words and lack of help you make me depend on my book even more. (John 6:67-69)

Cut the scripture shit out, would you? If you want to post preachy crap, go to a Bible forum.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by LordsSword

This is the parth that confuses me.
Its ok for you to impose on others what YOU believe but I cant?

At which point in time did *I* personally impose ANYTHING on you?

I recommended you use your head. I recommend that to ANYONE who isn't thinking clearly. When I have to repeat myself five times for you to hear me clearly, obviously you need that recommendation.

If someone ASKS me about what I believe, I'll be happy to share. But I won't EVER ask a Christian (or any religion) to BELIEVE IN WHAT I BELIEVE. That's wrong. It's not nice. It's not respectful.

You have been VERY disrespectful this entire time, LordSword.

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You've done it in bold capital letters again & again!

And where would that be? The part where I say "I'm not INTERESTED in your religion! Please stop telling me WHAT I SHOULD BELIEVE" ??

'Cause that's not IMPOSING on you at all. Would you like me to look up the definition for you?

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Do as I say but not as I do.

Sounds like your god.

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Sounds like my drunken, angry atheist father, you must have read the same book he did.

There is no book for atheism, ahahaha what the FUCK are you talking about?

I'm sorry you had a bad childhood. So did I! But that doesn't mean we're all going to turn to religion to save us.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Bold text, harsh statements & coarse language to start. Your repeated recommendations come across like some drill sergeant.

O, so to you, bold repetitive text is harsh. Well, maybe if you read the first time things were said, I wouldn't have to make points flash like neon bar signs.

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My religion means respect. I am called to refrain from yelling, cursing, or anything that makes me harm the message I am encouraged to send which is "believe in Jesus Christ for eternal life".

Then learn to read the first time around. You're not winning this one, buddy.

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You show me by the way you send your recommendations of what you mean by "a good person".

The only recommendation I make is "educate yourself."

Apart from that, I have no fucking clue what you're talking about. I don't advise anyone spiritually.

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The rules of respect I follow do work & I hope I have done a good job in modeling them thus far.

I assure you, you haven't.

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As for passing judgment on the practice of my beliefs and on a God you don't know, you show me your version of respect of other people and their beliefs.

I grew up Roman Catholic, kid. I was given the option to continue with my Bible studies or explore other options by my parents when I was entering my teens. I told them I didn't believe a word of it.

They respected that and let me believe what I wanted. Because that's what it's all about. Personal. choice. Just like your god says. You should understand this very easily.

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You have no respect because you have no foundation for defining such a concept. If you do you dont show it.

Because I curse, I have no respect.

Because I get FRUSTRATED when you repeatedly neither comprehend or READ anything any of us write, I am disrespectful.

You're are the most dense, ignorant person I have ever come across on the internet.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Suppose I did read your posts. Consider that I know how you would react.

You dont believe my testimony or that of the bible. Your recommendations have been taken into account. Ok.

I still have a book to follow and not your statements. Sorry. My religion means following the texts in my book the bible & not the words of people.

Good. Read your Bible, study up. Live your life.

But don't expect us to sit here and listen peacefully when you preach.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

Well, if so many people have been wrong in the past (though I suppose we can't even verify that) what are the odds people are right today when it's really just a shot in the dark?

From this perspective, why would it even matter??

I guess that's the atheist in me speaking. =/

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by kinkymagic

No, becase the scientific method has proven itself to work time and time again, while faith means having a belief in something despite lack of evidence.

When you get sick do you pray or go to a doctor?

That's an interesting notion, since doctors can't always cure you. You have faith that they will. You trust them.

It's an abstract faith, and I don't think it can be applied to religion as Pang implies. But faith no less.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by LordsSword

I'm critical of the atheist because of the denial of a God on the basis of faith without some kind of back up plan.

What, you mean some kind of life-after-death schtick? We generally think that when you die, you rot away and go back into the Earth. No pearl gates, no hand of god, just DEATH.

I know that's a scary idea to some people. But life is scary. Deal with it.

You can be as critical as you like of atheists. We're critical of you, too.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Capo

And in most countries, being a Christian is just the norm. Stop acting like this is some great burden you're undertaking. Jesus.

More like the 33% of the world is Christian:



The Jews have more reason to bitch than you do, LordSword.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Because the bible tells me so. (Deuteronomy 6:5, Jeremiah 7:23, Hosea 6:6, John 14:15) God loves me enough to give me the choice to love him. Without free will Heaven & Hell wouldnt need to exist.

I read this book once. It talked about the "Jewish peril" a lot, and how they were trying to take over the world. So the guy who wrote it threw millions of Jews in some ovens over in Germany.

I also read this book once that claimed politicians of the world take orders from 12 families in power. These families are from outer space and they are "reptilian." Shapeshifters.

Don't believe everything you read.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Token

Just becuase I dont agree with his point of view does not make him any less intelligent.

I don't know.

Like Deni said, the kid is pretty uneducated, closed-minded, and by your own claim, says "ridiculous" shit.

Tell me what's so intelligent about lacking critical thinking skills?

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by LordsSword

:words:

You really shame Christians. $20 says most Christians witness you and hang their head in shame.

You truly are a scab on humanity.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Please don't be frustrated because i'm not playing the game the way you want me to. We know each of us is entrenched in our own positions and really i'm not out undermine your education. You have already made up your mind before I came along.
This debate has gone on since antiquity, and you are not at a loss for the information that sustains your position.
My direction follows what my religion means to me which handles matters we have yet to tackle with sufficiency in this discussion. The matter in question is the notion of
a moral construct and how it weighs in your life. I think this is the weakest aspect of my opponents positions and thus the focal point of my direction.

Your information is strong to be sure but your practice of what you know is a different story.

You understand that neither side of the fence has one iota of proof for what they believe, right?

That's why it's "religion" and not "fact."

Let's play a game: how many times can LordSword repeat himself in one thread? I'll give $20 to the winner who guesses right.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by niki

... why does it matter that someone elevates his beliefs to the notion of sacred or not ?

I could be wrong, and I agree with what you're saying, but I think he was implying the whole "song of god" thing.

You know, that Mary never had sex with anyone but...well, God I guess? I don't even know. It's a kind of silly thing for me to conceive of, so forgive me if I'm not on-spot with those details.

What Jesus taught was pretty right on. I don't think anyone really disputes that.

It's how the Christians revere him as "magic" because he is alleged to be the "Son of God." Which is cool and all, but it is a defining point of Christianity.

"Do you accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your savior" and all that.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Christianity means evangelism to me. Going out & interacting with folks is what Jesus has always done.

A.) "Christianity" means evangelism to you? Wow. That's kind of fucked up. You'd think it would mean something more like "moral code," "personal guidance," or "a way of life."

Instead, you think it's about recruiting people to join your "club."

B.) Do you really think anyone in society doesn't know who Jesus was or what he taught. (I am, of course, excluding those folks who live primitively in the Amazon and shit like that. I hope you never get your dirty little hands on them)

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by LordsSword

Missionaries still swarm the globe in an effort to do what I have done and do alot of good in their efforts.

I would imply something about "Armageddon," but I think it would go over your head.

They swarm the globe and annoy the shit out of everyone who has an established faith.

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Despite the current view of the Christian faith we continue because of reactions like yours. Its not a club its a way of life that has changed the world for the better.

That's DEFINITELY arguable. "For the better" is what you say. "For the worse" is what I say.

Wars are fought over bullshit like this. People DIE over such trivial crap.

I hope you start critically thinking soon.

I was under the impression, by the way, that pride is a sin. You may want to consider that when preaching your tripe.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by LordsSword

As a practice of a biblical command to believers.
You ask me to abandon a practice of my faith to make you comfortable.

ABANDON YOUR FAITH?

Jesus fucking CHRIST, man. What did they brainwash you with?

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No. People die because they react in judgment of others without knowlege and mercy.

You don't even KNOW WHAT KNOWLEDGE IS. You intentionally remain ignorant!

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Show me a biblical verse to sustain your opinion.

Show me evidence that God exists and then we can talk.

LordSword, I don't know what your major mental malfunction is, but you're pretty much the prime example of what will be eradicated in future generations thanks to Darwinism.

"I hope and pray god will cure me! Only HE can save me! It's all up to him!"

*DROPS DEAD*

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by packrat

Yeah! You really showed him, especially with this:

Never mind he didn't say he had to "abandon [his] faith," he said "abandon a practice of [his] faith." Good job attacking him with a statement he didn't make! Trolls couldn't do better.

"Abandoning a practice of his faith" has nothing to do with "spreading it like the plague." Faith is not a sales pitch - it's a human emotion. If I say to you "BE HAPPY!" will it actually make you happy? NO.

Who gives anyone the right to preach to anyone else? Especially when it's completely speculative?

Faith is usually a personal thing. If only Christians would get that through their heads. You stay out of my head, I'll stay out of yours. That is, by no means, requiring anyone to "abandon the practice" of their faith.

He can talk about Christ, the book, the devil, the alien race from Planet Ogo until he turns BLUE IN THE FACE. Just don't preach it to people who have already asked to be spared the sales pitch.

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Of course, lets also disregard that terrible secret that no one ever talks about; that evangelism has been a major pillar of Christianity (including Roman Catholicism) since its inception. Truly, this is a work of fuck-upedness and brainwashing that would put Jim Jones to shame(if the poor bastard were still alive today). Yeah, you totally know who Jesus is and what he taught.

Yea, Catholics. Let's use them as an example of "spreading the good word." Great idea. Their conversion rate is insane, anyways. No one who actually wants to enjoy life is a Catholic.

Brainwashing does occur in religion - do you deny it? I shouldn't say brainwashing, per se - but the "fear of god" is put into a non-believer.

It's not evangelism that makes Christianity so infectious - it's the shit the Bible says that will happen if you don't believe. Oldest tactic ever: scare the shit out of them - they'll believe.

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Oh, never mind that bullshit. The last fucking thing Jesus said to his followers wasn't really of any importance to Christian practice. Yeah. Thats totally straining the bounds of reason right there. Those evil Christians.

I don't think Christians are evil at all. It's when they start fucking with other people that I get pissed.

I did the whole Bible school and shit when I was a kid. I don't know verses from the book because I chose not to. There's a reason I got the fuck out of that business early on (ie: I actually started to think and not blindly accept).

I have nothing against Jesus. I don't know why you'd think I do.

It's his followers that really aggravate me - and not even all of them! The majority of Christians are totally fucking rad with me. Like I said: stay out of my head, I'll stay out of yours. Most Christians I know are pretty much to themselves, and have no underlying desire to yap at me about their god. Just like I don't yap at them about my lack of a god.

You seem like you're a Christian, eh? You're cool in my book. You're not preaching. You're not telling me that you have some kind of crazy proof from space or anything. You just say "Hey. This is what I believe in." And I say "Hey. That's cool."

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They don't really think that there's an afterlife, and there are more important things beyond this world. Their philosophical approach to the world isn't different from your own. Its all just a cover for their evil purposes of destroying the world with NASCAR, Bibles, and Buddy Christ bumper stickers.

But of course I'm just repeating whats already obvious to you. You know who Jesus was and what he taught after all.

I don't have Jesus's shit memorized at all.

And why should I? No one actually FOLLOWS ANY OF IT. Christianity kinda makes shit up as they go along. Go ask the Vatican. Go ask the Protestants. Go ask any sect of Christianity ever.

NO one has it right. No one ever will. That's my point.

DarkLink: Sounds like your perfect god isn't so perfect if he has his son head to earth to change his fuck-ups for him. =/

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Devoxycontin

Sass I really fail to see how Lord Swords assumptions of non-believers are any worse than your assumptions of various religious sects.

Are you referring to the Catholic comment? 'Cause that was a joke. =/

(But seriously. Who wants to be Catholic these days. All self-loathing, but no way to off yourself.)

Otherwise, there were no generalizations that I can see. Maybe you misunderstood me.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Devoxycontin

No, it wasn't the Catholic joke. Right now I see a problem, Lord Sword insists on preaching and droning on about the word of God being the only true thing. Yet several of the people arguing against him aren't doing anyone a fucking favor by lumping all Christians together.

Lumping them together how? By saying "You believe in Jesus lololol?"

=/

I am pretty sure I was clear that I don't lump Christians together in that last, long post. I went out of my way to do that, 'cause I'm pretty down with the Jesus-lovers when they're not preaching.

Or are you just looking to argue with me again?

There's nowhere I can't reach.