Age Barriers in Romance

The biggest gap I've had has been 10 years difference: I was 22, he was 32. Needless to say, that was an insanely short-lived relationship.

Like so many people, I wondered if it could work between us, despite the age difference. The answer was conclusively and resoundingly "no." He wanted to get super-serious. I was not ready to have anything serious at all. That was the major issue, really - everything else was just personality differences. (I'm an aggression, liberal person. He was a relatively passive, "emotional" guy - which I can't deal too well with)

In retrospect, I don't think I'd date someone so much older or younger anymore. I'm 26 - that gives me a range of 16-36.

I think 5 years is good enough gap. I probably wouldn't cross that boundary again.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

One thing I don't get it the whole sensitivity thing towards age in women over 30.

Why be sensitive about age?

I look forward to the day that I can have wrinkles, gray hair, and scars from my youth. It signifies a certain wisdom in life and experience, and it's something I think a lot of women overlook.

Trying to maintain a certain youthfulness beyond your years indicates - to me, anyways - that you're more interested in being attractive than going with the flow of life.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by crimsonsabre

To be honest though, 17 and 22's really only a 5 year age gap. That's really not that massive a difference, so I guess the taboo is much rather that people are 'afraid' because the girl is 'young', and possibly 'innocent' and dangerous situations might arise.

A five year gap between 31 and 36 or even, like, 24 and 29 aren't that noticeable.

But between 17 and 22? Two totally different points in life. It's not because a girl/guy is considered "young" or "innocent" - it's because a seventeen year old is at a completely different maturity level than a twenty-two year old. Unless, of course, you're dealing with a particularly stunted 22 year old, which I have certainly seen.

I don't believe in this "mature for 16" shit. It sounds like a huge excuse to me. I can't imagine too many sixteen year olds in high school being as mature as a twenty-two year old, and I don't give a good goddamn what anyone else says.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by crimsonsabre

Hmm .. fair enough. I'll have to /nod to this one on the vast majority of the populace. But, from what I understand to be truth is that maturity is something arises out of life experiences, and while 90% of teenagers at that age are bloody drama queens, there were and are still quite a massive number left that are more 'mature' (I put that loosely) simply because of what life has thrown at them. This can be either/or broken families, poverty, lower social settings, illnesses, racial prejudice, etc. The world isn't a happy place really; I know.

This is just food for thought, so I'm deviating massively from topic at hand just 'cause I can. Thoughts?

So how old are you, exactly?

"Bad life experiences" doesn't really ever mean to me that a person is mature. I had some of those very early on. Doesn't mean I was mature at 18. It can help in the speediness of maturing, but it doesn't mean that some nasty shit in the past can make you "mature" at 18.

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by crimsonsabre

I won't answer that just yet, since I'm sort of curious as to what age you think I might be.

Your perspective sounds like a young one.

It sounds to me like some have called you "mature," despite your young age, and you're defending the idea that youthfulness doesn't go hand in hand with immaturity.

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Of course, I won't deny that I'm young, and there is far more in life that I have yet to see and understand. And of course, I agree to what you say about the speediness of maturity, but from my own life I have numerous examples to counter that.

A friend suffered from cancer, which kind of gave her a spin on life that was far more 'mature' then others. She took it in stride, and achieved well in both her social as well as academic life. Did things that would be considered 'mature', and approached her relationship and actions with others with a fair level of tenderness.

Another was from a family that wasn't so well off. Even with donations and charity from church, they struggled. She opted to leave school and work hours that would've killed most of us to get her siblings through school. Did all the things that was required to get her family through life and never grunted a single complaint.

I know countless stories of people around me that have suffered, lost, and gone through periods of their lives where they had nothing to rely on, and survived and came out the other side a 'mature' person, if the phrase is apt. I'm not doubting the vast majority of teenagers are immature and crazy, but having worked with and heard stories of so many kids I can't help but say something when generalizations are thrown around.

Who's to say I'm not one of these people?

Everyone can bring up shitty stuff that's happened to them in the past. It's a sane person who takes those bad experiences and heals after time. Not a mature one.

"Maturity" is not something you get through bad experiences at a young age. While you can cite good examples of people growing up more quickly through bad experience, I can cite examples of people who took their pain and never grew up because of their experiences. Bad things happen to a lot of people, fair or unfair, justified or not. That doesn't mean that every person who had a shitty childhood is mature.

Bad experience does not equate to automatic maturity. Bad experiences can develop character, instill a sense of morality, and teach a person.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by crimsonsabre

But, with that said, I do also have to point out we may have different ideas of what maturity is. From what I can read out, you're from a western society, while mine is Asian. There are different culture influences working at a deeper level, so we may have perceptions based on separate ideologies concerned, especially when various religious and theological doctrines are ingrained within. Of course, there's also the fact that I'm Christian, which in itself might say something.

O, christ on a stick. Dragging in the religion to explain the definition of "maturity?" Sigh.

Where's Denicalis.

We're talking about modern society, civilized people, and dating within a certain age gap. Not about the philosophy of child-fucking 'cause the church needed more followers in the old days. Be real.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

Stop being a cunt, sass.

I'm pretty sure I have a valid point, RR.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

Agreed his Christian point is pretty stupid, but I don't see the problem with the rest of his post. Also, I imagine he isn't Catholic, as your child-fucking comment would seem to suggest.

We're talking about dating within a certain age range. Not about philosophy of civilizations and customs.

And I wasn't making a Catholic-exclusive statement. Religion generally has a pro-reproduction stance on their followers, in order to up the number of people following the path of that particular religion.

Some religions allow for the marriage of underage children to an adult. That is, in my book, "child-fucking." Not that I was accusing the guy of doing this at all - or even being a part of a religion that condones this behavior - but that religion really shouldn't be a part of this thought process at all, not to mention the topic at hand.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

So you're saying that people from eastern, latino, black, native american, and any other group you can think of have the same exact pressures and interpretations of what "mature" mean as WASPy New England?

Are you saying that my ideas of "maturity" are centered from "WASPy" New England?

I'm pretty sure I used the dictionary for my definition. Maybe it's me?

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I also imagine "child-fucking" was more acceptable in the old days because people didn't live as long. I don't imagine many women would have been able to bear kids into their mid/late 30s, so if they were going to pump out enough babies to help work on the farm they needed to get started pretty darned young (of course, the irony is how now girls are starting puberty younger than back then).

No, you're right. But it's still endorsed by many religions. Hell, out here in "WASPy" New England, I had a friend who was Hindu who got married off at the ripe age of 15. She had to drop out of high school for that marriage.

My point, however, remains that religion has no place in a conversation about "maturity." While some cultures may not all be on the same page as to what "maturity" means, there is a general standard.

And I can't think of a better place for the standard than in a conversation regarding dating and what each person considers a good "age gap" therein.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by RacinReaver

Where did you use the definition out of the dictionary?

I didn't....? I define "maturity" in a general sense much like the dictionary (which doesn't particularly take into account cultural diversities and all that shit), especially in the context of this thread. C'mon. Now you're just arguing for arguments sake.

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You know, come to think of it, has anyone actually defined what "maturity" actually is? I mean, I understand how one can become "more mature," but how do you actually decide when someone is "mature enough?" If you ask someone that's 70 years old how mature someone should be before X do you really think it'll be the same answer as someone that's 30?

Chances are that 18 year olds are less mature than 25 year olds. Chances are. I mean, I am sure we can agree there, can't we?

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But, see, if someone's religion gives them strength and helps them do whatever a 'mature' person does, then shouldn't their religion be pertinent to their level of maturity?

Maybe maturity is like how only those that understand how wise they aren't are truly wise.

Religion has no place in this thread at all. Why do you insist on talking about it, RR. Is it just because you know I am atheist? Or maybe you're doing it just because I'm me. Who knows.

It seems silly of you, though.

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I'm a white college guy from the North East that grew up in a town where him being half-jew made him one of the most diverse students in his graduating class of 750. I think I have experience living with a bunch of WASPs.

But what do you know about New Englanders. (Red Sox fans alone can explain a lot about us. ^_^)

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Shively

You can shape, train and mold that perfect mate.

Maybe you're joking. I hope so.

Because that is the most ignorant thing I've ever fucking heard.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

I'm so disappointed by the diffusion LeHah offered for this stupid argument. SADFACE.

I was going to jump all over that Fireman guy until I read what Deni said, and I got upset because he beat me to the punch. AS USUAL.

But yea, "her dad was upset with it" is a hilarious argument. I wonder WHY he'd be upset! And damn that girl for not standing up to her father!

Can I also comment on how great it is that he's "moved on" now that's he's graduated high school? Like once you exit high school and turn 18, you're suddenly a LOT MORE MATURE. God, fuck those 15 year old babies. They're so yesterday once you graduate.

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Originally Posted by Fireman Joe

I should set a few things straight here...
As much as I'd like to be, I'm not sleeping with this girl. She's not ready and I'm cool with that.

That's curious. Is it her ((fifteen year old)) personality you're interested in then?

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She hasn't actually told her parents that we're dating, for fear of her father's wrath. (He hits her and shit sometimes)
Her parents are "conservative Christians". =/

One one hand I wish she'd be honest about the nature of things and just tell them, on the other, I'm concerned for her safety (and perhaps my own) if they really do get pissy.

Ever consider that they may have valid reasons for their concern?

If I had been 15 dating an 18 year old, my family probably would have been a bit concerned as well. And my family isn't "conservative Christian" nor did they hit me.

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Either way, we've kept it from them this long (13 months) so at this point I guess it could go on indefinitely.

So you started dating her when she was 14. Just out of the gates.

Wow. I wonder how much you can enjoy a 14 year old when you're 17-18 and have no sexual intentions.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Fireman Joe

Looks like you're trying to attack my character there and impose your own morals on me, Sass.

Of course I'm attacking your character. It's not a very good one.

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We share a lot of interests and enjoy each others' company.

Interests like hanging out at the mall, lip gloss, and Nickelodeon?

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Fireman Joe

You're not a very good judge of character if you've come to such a conclusion after only a few forum posts.

and no. I hardly need to justify myself to people on the internet I don't know, but to put your cynical mind to rest, we like to play music together (she plays viola, I play cello), we both like sci-fi and anime, etc
Some of her other interests include archery, history and geology. Quite obviously a far cry from most 15 year old girls. I can always have an interesting conversation with her. The only doubts I'm having regarding her maturity are about her fear of her parents, other than that, things are just fine.

"I hardly need to justify myself to you! BUT LET ME DO IT ANYWAYS."

I don't particularly care about the interests you share. I am sure she is "very mature for her age" and you will be together for "a long time."

That is, of course, until her parents find out!

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I entered into this thread with the intention of contributing to the discussion and possibly receiving some advice regarding dealing with her parents, not the intention of being attacked. It's served as a reminder to why I don't post often.
If you're all quite done, I'll be taking my leave from the thread.

O you poor, poor thing. You wanted advice for your relationship with a fifteen year old and you didn't get it.

Here's the schtick: Her Pops isn't going to be cool with it. She's going to avoid telling him. And you're going to continue to pressure her to "stand up" to her father, despite her being essentially a child (in the eyes of the law and family).

You're all kinds of hilarious.

FELIPE NO

Originally Posted by Janus X

Age is just a number. Although I would hardly settle with a man proportionally as old as my father (22 years or more in difference), I think older men are usually more mature.

My boyfriend is 19 years older than me. He quickly got over this issue; we love each other and that'S all that matters. However, my mom still feels uneasy that her son-in-law-to-be is 8 years younger that she is...

HOW old are you?

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Janus X

25. It was 2 years ago...

25 year old was/is dating a 44 year old.

He's old enough to be your father.

So. How much "allowance" does he give you weekly?

I'm not interested in your retarded "age is not a factor" argument, here. You clearly have some issues if you're dating someone old enough to be your father.

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Originally Posted by Shively

However if she was in her mid 20s + I don't know that I would consider him a pedo at that point.

Janus is a male.

And yes, it's legal.

The question is: what does it say about the person?

Originally Posted by Janus

Using your logic, dating anyone 10-12 years older could theoritically be one's father

That's not exactly my logic, but thanks anyhow. And it's "theoretically," for future reference.

19 years is a big difference. I can't possibly imagine what a 44 year old would share in common with a 25 year old, but it's the same old argument. There's something psychologically askew if you ask me.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Janus X

thanks for your worries Freud, but I don't think i've live a trauma strong enough to intentionally look for much older men. As I said, I thought he was 35, which was a ''reasonnable'' difference

I don't worry about you. I don't give a shit about you.

I just kind of laugh at you. You're too dumb to recognize what's going on, and you're old enough to give it thought.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by LeHah

One of these statements is wrong.

Can you, the viewers at home, see which one it is?

Well, I mean, age is a "technicality." Obviously it shouldn't actually mean anything, but it's pretty clear that stupidity can touch anyone of any age!

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Janus X

I know that; I'M playing with you

O, I am sure it was all a part of your big plan.

I was speaking idiomatically.

Originally Posted by Shively

I gave up getting pissy over any forum back in 02ish when I was banned the first time. Thanks

Banned from this forum the first time?

O golly, that would be marvelous.

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?