Nobody could ever love the real me

I have kind of a similar "problem". People can love the real me, and have done in the past. However, I know for an absolute and certain fact that I'd drive them insane within a year. Reasons 1, 3 and 4 from your list apply to me as well. There are other things too.

In short, after the last excruciating disaster that I laughingly called "a loving relationship", I just decided that I'd stay single. I'm not saying that is the fate that you will have to accept, but it certainly doesn't bother me anymore. Being in relationships was starting to eat away at me from the inside.

The sad thing is that I know I probably could change, but I'd rather not. This is me, and I'll be damned if I'll change myself to please someone else. I decided to give up on romance, and love. The upside is that I get to remain who I am.

Whoever I've been with in the past has always either deluded themselves about my faults, which only works for so long, or taken me on with the unspoken assumption that I would change. In fact, it's always been a little of both. For a while, I tried going along with that. It didn't work, because I really didn't want to change, and so I gradually reverted to type. I feel so much less conflicted these days. Back when I was in a relationship, I felt like I was being pulled in two directions simultaneously.

Don't get me wrong, it's not as though I feel that I'm a reprehensible and evil person who is a blot on society. It's just that my qualities are not those which most people seem to look for in a life partner. I definitely understand where you're coming from on this. I don't suggest that the solution I chose is the one that you would be happy with, but I've not regretted or reconsidered my decision yet. Admittedly it's not been that long yet, but so far, it's the best decision I ever made.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

Originally Posted by Alice

If you decide to just give up on trying to improve yourself, you're definitely going to have a sucky life, because a lot of the things on your list are just not conducive to having a happy one.

Yeah, people keep telling me that about my life too. Like Eleo, I'm a lazy, computer-addicted, cynical pessimist. That attitude seems to make people who don't know me well imagine that I need to change. I don't know about happiness, it's something that I've never known how to measure, or even define. Now if you want to talk about contentment, which I define as the feeling of having all that you need, and at least some of what you want, then I just don't see a problem with my life. I'm obviously including the intangible "things" that a person wants in that definition. I also don't see why any of the things on Eleo's list stand in between him and contentment. I mean, if you think he should conform to some kind of societally-imposed template, then say so. I won't think the less of you for that (like you'd care :P) and it's not an uncommon view. I will, however, beg to differ.

For me, the big breakthrough was when I realised that what I want does not include a romantic relationship. Society had conditioned me to believe that I wanted one, but when I examined that, I found that I couldn't actually see the positive side to it. There's nothing other than sex that a romantic relationship can provide, which friends can not. I'm not in the least interested in that, of course, and in the event Eleo is, he doesn't have to sell his soul by the pound to get it.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by AliceNWondrland

I think it goes without saying that this is a bad thing. Do I really have to explain why?

Really, unless the person in question is lazy to the point where they can't keep a job, I fail to see the issue.

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OK, let's just get this straight. I love my computer, too. BUT IT'S NOT REAL LIFE. There's so much out there that you're going to miss if you don't get out of your house and do things. People, places, interesting things. You get the point.

Not really. I don't imagine that it's a 24/7 kind of a deal. It certainly isn't for me. I just don't prefer to be away from my home, and access to the computer for too long at a stretch.

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I will concede that it's a societal rule of sorts that people be nice. Of course, no one HAS to be nice to other people, but how far does being a cruel, heartless bastard get you in life?

Based on personal observations, substantially further than being nice to people. I admit that I tend to choose to be, if not nice, then at least neutral with most people, but I don't think it's winning me any prizes. Of course, I would have to admit that while my intention is usually to be neutral or better, that's not always the way I'm perceived.

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Obviously this one character flaw is causing Eleo a lot of pain and grief (see his numerous threads and chocojournal entries about love, the lack of it, and not fully believing in it). Being cynical leads to being unhappy. Period.

Character flaw? I consider it one of my strengths. I don't believe that cynicism is responsible for any of Eleo's problems. I believe that he and you may believe that, but I do not. I really do think that cynicism is the most sane response to the world that we live in. We both know that Eleo isn't sure he entirely believes in love, and I think that this is the real source of his unhappiness. It's my view that he really doesn't believe in love anymore, but hasn't fully internalised that belief yet. Transitional periods are hard. I'm willing to accept that view may be coloured by my own experiences though.

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Family members can be the most annoying, hard to deal with, unsympathetic people you'll ever encounter. Almost everyone has gone through a stage in their lives where they couldn't care less if they ever saw their family again. But they're there when you need them and they love you (in most cases). People don't always see eye-to-eye with their family, but especially after a person has children of his own, it gets easier to understand them. I think it's very sad when people alienate themselves from their families.

That would be judging him by your value system. Explain in objective terms how it is a problem for Eleo that he feels this way. I'm just not seeing it. I don't feel the same way myself, but nor am I especially close with my family.

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Psst...I don't give a damn if you think less of me or not.

Yes, I know this. It was a figure of speech, and I made note of the fact that you would not care. I was simply trying to say that if you think he should simply buckle down and conform, I'd rather you say it right out, rather than hint at it. It's a view I disagree with, of course.

I'm not trying to be hostile here, Alice, whether you care about that or not. I'm simply taking the opposing view. That was supposed to be a little tongue-in-cheek, to lighten the mood. I apologise if it didn't come off right, which it clearly did not. I'm trying to be in Eleo's corner here, because I feel that I've been to the place where he is now.

I'm not always good at not offending people, though, and since our views in most things seem to be diametrically opposed, that makes it much more likely that my occasional bad choice of words will misfire in your direction.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by jsphweid

This is why I don't understand athiests. If you believe that nothing in this world makes a bit of difference, then of course you're going to be lazy, mean, and hateful towards even your own family. I would be too!

Being an athiest doesn't mean that you don't think anything in the world makes a difference. It means you don't believe in God. If you claim not to see a difference, then I suggest that you're deliberately not seeing it.

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I think we do have a purpose. I think we have something to find in this life. It bothers me when people say, "I don't want to change anything about me because I don't give a shit about anyone else." These people usually live a life that has no purpose, it seems.

How about "I don't want to have to change anything about me, because this is how I want to be?". Personally, I give a crap about several people. None of them expect or want me to change who I am.

I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?