[PS2] Final Fantasy XII

Frankly from the way the battle systems works, I doubt this is the next FFVII.... I'm sure the story is great, along with graphics, and music. Whethere not its engaging enough to get people to keep playing and actually have fun remains to be seen. The demo has me thinking that this game will be less engaging since with gambit your characters can simply do things themselves and you can just sit and watch, hell attacking no longer requires you pressing the buttons.

Then again there are those that regard story and graphics higher than gameplay, so maybe this game will suit them.

Theres barely any hype of promotion going in Japan though, its a rather quiet release compared to KH2. As much as I'm curious about whether or not it has live up to expectations (mind you this was a frigging long wait), this is probably the first FF I will not import, especially since the price has gone up. Defintly more expensive than FFX was for me.

However, if anyone here is gonna import, do tell us what its like, as I may get the NA release if its good enough.

And on another note, considering that SE are now making games to be more cinematic, its shocking that they still have not have their games with widescreen, progressive scan options. Get with the program Square!

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I'm interested in the Ashe figure. Looks nice.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

For once a NA cover that looks awesome!

I'm tempted to get this, but I think I'll still pass. Awesome cover though!

How ya doing, buddy?

The game looks incredible in Widescreen, the dub is also great. However even though I have now played a version that I understand (I d/led the import before), it still hasn't changed my mind about the gameplay, as I find it dull and non much interactivity. If I am not having fun within the first half hour of gameplay, than I call it bad design. I played it for about 2 hours and I am not having fun, and I doubt I need more party members or the glorified AI system to actually know how Party battle works, playing the demo showed me how it works, and it wasn't very fun.

And now knowing how the Licence board works and how to start mob hunts makes me cringe.

So if I get an equipment I can't wear it? I need to aquire enough points to gain the LICENCE I need to wear a damn armour? And we thought the DMV is bad enough.

To start a mob hunt I frst have to check the billboard in the bar, and THEN have to go search for the guy who put it up there to even start it? I'm all for realism, but this is just way too cumbersome and annoying, especially since the city too damn big. Oh and of course we then have to SEARCH for that damn thing, kill it, and go all the way back to FIND the same guy to get a couple of gil that probably won't be worth of my time.

And the fact this plays just FFXI only offline irks me even more. No gil for you unless you sell items and do mob hunts! Oh! And you can't learn magic! You have to BUY them! Even though you can't earn money cept through mob hunts!

VP2's skill learning system is bit annoying too, but at least my mages already know their magic to begin with, and most of the equipment can be found in dungeons too, and if I need to buy stuff, I can get money from monsters! How about that? And I was having fun with that game within 20 mins of its gameplay time! (Not counting scenes when I say that)

Some changes made in FF12 are good, like no more random battles and such, and its production values are excellant, graphics, Voices, music, art design etc, but in a gameplay standpoint, I'm afraid its just isn't for me.

So glad I didn't buy the overpriced import like I always do with FF...

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Colonel Skills

Lemme get this straight.

You are not enjoying it after two hours, and you said if it doesn't grab you by the 30 minute mark you think it's a bad design...so why are you still playing it?

This isn't my first time playing FF12, I played the import, it didnt grab me at first, but maybe it would have picked up after a while. It didn't. And since I also played the demo I didn't need to keepplaying to know how battles would go with party members.

I gave the English version a second shot, maybe knowing what the hell is going on along with knowing the tutorials may make things more fun, instead I found even more cumbersom systems.

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I think the name alone is the reason why this game will sell at all. Square should be making solid games to make money, this one, aside from production values, they didn't seem to have tried. There are problems in both story and gameplay. It seems that they are really just milking the label, while Enix is making more solid games, and people who don't know better give credit to Square.

I know that's 50 bucks I won't be spending either. And is God Hand English version out already?

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Wow, you just let the game play by ITSELF at the LAST BOSS?

Am I the only one who sees severe game design problems in this game?

They say KH2 was easy even in Proud mode, but I still need to do something to actually play it. This game just plays by itself.

I mean aside from production values, what other postive values are there for this game?

Also, I have heard rumours that the NA version had additional scenes that were not in the Japan version, is this true? And if it was, are the scenes added in more Penelo scenes, since alot of her stuff was cut out in the JP copy, including the FMV of her dancing?

How ya doing, buddy?

Originally Posted by Lipid

The battle system is fine, people just cant stand change.

How can a battle system be fine when it allows a player to just sit back and watch his characters play and beat the last boss on their own? I mean, my god, the LAST BOSS?! Gambits are just another way of saying AI system! And AI only works in action oriented games. In RPGS that are bit more turn base or strategic, its someone else doing the thinking for you.

A game where none of the characters have any unique attributes or ablities other than their looks?

Along with cumbersome Licenece board system that makes you aquire licence to wear a damn equipment? And make you buy magic when its tough to get gil? And Mob hunts making you go around a city to find the person who wants a monster killed to iniate the hunt?

Its not the change that bugs me, is the fact that the battle system ISNT fun that bugs me. I'm happy that there are no more random battles, but the battle system isn't fun cause you can let the system play by itself. Change isn't always a good thing, nor is it always a bad thing, and I gave this game TWO chances by downloading both the import and the NA version. Neither impressed me, nor was it fun. In this case, the changes they made were bad. I dont like how you insinuate that whoever hates this game's battle system hates change.

If you want an RPG that mixes realtime and turn base elements better, try VP2. Level grinding is FUN in that game, while in FF12 its dull and half the time you're not even pressing any buttons. If you like less interactivity, fine, but to me, games are ALL about interactivity, not AI's doing the work for you.

And turning off the gambits make it even less fun than it is already, alot more tedious, so telling someone to turn it off isnt gonna magically make this game better or fun.

And judging from Memnoch's post, I guess Penelo's dance FMV was still cut, way to go Square, create a character and then cut out her significant role in the story, along with most of her scenes.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Punishment

Well for those who are compaining that the game is too easy then you have yourself a challenge. Go solo with no gambits. As simple as that.

With or without gambits, this game was not FUN at all for me. If its not even fun, why would I play for the challenge to begin with? Its adding a layer to the torture. I don't like the battle system regardless of whether or not the gambit is turned on for any character, either its tedious and annoying, or its watching the game play itself. It doesn't work either way.

And if I dont use gambit on the lead but have it on the other 2, than it really becomes FF11 OFFLINE, also a game I found dull after 3 hours, and I only played it longer cause I was talking to people.

And FF12 isn't real time, since characters need to take turns to actually do a move, you just happen to get to walk around the area while you're waiting, making you believe its real time when its really not. KH2 is real time, Zelda is real time. VP2 is half real half turn based, just like 12 cept they mixed both elements far better.

Pressing the same button to do an attack move can be fun if the battle system is done right, say the Grandia series, I love Grandia 3's battle system, as well as VP2.

And yes, the FMV of Penelo dancing was only in the trailers, in fact alot of her scenes from the trailers were cut, like the parts where shes being held prisoner by some of those bangaa (did I get that right?) people. That is just one problem I had with the story, among many others.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I was simply responding to previous comments from other users. If it bugs you that much than don't read them, however I wasn't just repeating, I was responding to what others said as well.

By the way it took me a while to understand what you posted. And I know you mean no offense, but I think I am allowed to respond to people's comments, especially if they imply that people who didn't like this game are simpletons who hate change. I repeated ny points to renforce the fact that I have legitmate reasons to hate the game and find it not fun for my taste. Its called criticism, not just mindless bashing. There's a difference.

And I dont know if the Penelo FMV scene ended up in the NA version, hence why I asked it in the previous posts.

There's nowhere I can't reach.

Originally Posted by Memnoch

Nope, i haven't seen it...anyone know where to get it? I tried searching it on youtube and no luck

The Penelo FMV was only seen in one of the trailers from E3, try finding the 2005 E3 trailer, when Penelo pops up the words "A girl who wants peace" is right next to her dancing with a cloth thats like a veil.

This thing is sticky, and I don't like it. I don't appreciate it.

Originally Posted by Ashton

4:

Spoiler:

Penelo does infact get kidnapped by the seeq, cutscenes and all. I don't know what specific FMV you're talking about. It's a major part of the story, rescuing Penelo.

So those scenes with Penelo were added back in? What the hell? Why did they leave them out in the JP version in the first place? The trailers told us that they were all rendered and voice acted.

And damn shame that the Penelo FMV is still cut. Here's a screenshot of it from the E3 2005 trailer.



I am a dolphin, do you want me on your body?

Originally Posted by Casaubon

I didn't know they called the Seeq's orcs, but whatever. It's not even bad, and I'm like 99% sure it anything in the US version regarding this was in the JAP version because the story would not work at all without that part of the plot.

In the Japanese version, they only mentioned

Spoiler:

Penelo getting kidnapped

in voiceless text by one of Vaan's pals, the actual scenes with Penelo and the Orcs voice acting and animation were cut.

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Thats the trouble with a Matsuno story in a FF game that is NOT tactics, tactics is able to have such a story where characters take a backseat cause your characters are like soldies, expendable, especially in terms of character development.

It doesn't work on a normal FF game cause characters as just as important as the plot. You are stuck with those 6 or 7 of them for the entire time, they HAVE to interact somewhat.

Dunno how Vagrant story worked, but probably cause he didn't have that many characters to juggle with.

And thanks for informing me on the ratings issue with Penelo... Still think they overeacted though.

I still like to see the Penelo FMV, just for the sake of I dunno, fleshing out her character more? I mean if it werent for that promo poster and the new FF12 DS game trailer, who would know she's a dancer?

What kind of toxic man-thing is happening now?

Originally Posted by Ashton

Why? This is the best FF12 i've played, even storywise. FFX was a great game, so was FFX-2. But those were mainly about the characters, not the world, which were much more interesting. Now we have a FF with a world more interesting and a story more about it.

It's not like the characters are ignored.

Spoiler:

Ashe, who is from FF13(i will never stop saying that) has quite a bit to deal with later in the game. Some of the characters themselves are just badtacular awesome. Balthier comes to mind, all the judges, Dr. Cid. They're just presented so well that i end up liking them as a character. And unlike tidus, it's not at the end of the game that i start to care for them.

I just dont like the idea that some characters were created as party member add ons, and not as characters that will get development. All of them should have equal development, not just half of the party. And Vayne is the main villian, and he didnt get much either.

They are not ALL ignored, but some were, and thats' not a good balanced story IMO. Why bother creating Vaan or Penelo if nothing much happens with them? Penelo barely has many lines, and her uniqueness was her dancing, and that was cut out with no replacement.

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Originally Posted by SOLDIER

He has, and hasn't stopped complaining about it since. I was almost certain this would be the one FF where everyone would unite in aggreement to its awesomeness, but I guess that isn't the case.

Why wouldn't he? The only reason this is getting high scores cause its FF12,all of them seem to be bend on either getting all fanbiy like excited and praising it like its perfect cause it took this long to get out that they take anything. And some reviews even try to defend it really badly.

Quote:

Granted, Final Fantasy XII may not seem like a game deserving of that level of prestige in its beginning -- it starts slow (slower than your typical RPG) and can take upwards of three to six hours to get going. In this day and age of videogames hitting the ground running the moment you press start, asking users for an extra layer of patience can certainly prove trying. Nevertheless, like most great things worth experiencing, big effort means big rewards.

They're defending a game play system that takes hours to actually start getting fun? That is a huge game design flaw and they defend it cause, well its FF12 it has to be good right?

I mean maybe it is a each to their own thing, but I still find it hard to believe that the one FF the reviews all hail as perfection has flaws in battles (gambits plays by itself), Licence board (Need gil and LP to get cure along with the right to use equipment?),mob hunts (as if running around to find it and kill wasn't bad enough, I have to run and find the guy who wants it dead to start the hunt?) and story? ( Poor character developmend along with uninteresting plot, and don't get me started on Basch's "betrayal" twist, its a soap opera cliche)

Basch spoiler:

Spoiler:

"My evil twin did it! Not me! I was framed!

FF12 may be a great game to some, and mediocre for others, or even bad, but is it perfection and does it deserve such high scores? Not really, more like reviews either jumping the bandwagon, waited so long that they take whatever they can get, bribed, or just plain fanboys.

If people love this game then great, I just think that it doesn't derserve the praise as being the game of the year or perfection or some other review over glorification.

What, you don't want my bikini-clad body?

Originally Posted by Taisai

I disagree (no offense). The gameplay surely resembled FFXI to some extent, but it lacked some significant things that make FFXI still alive today: Communication, virtual society, virtual relationship and virtual value that make us spend an awful lot of time lvling many jobs, getting über weapons and gears or just chatting. Though I'm sure more than half of FFXI players actually got bored with the game, they must take forever to quit just because they hesitate to delete thier own character and say goodbye to thier friends.

I don't intend to rubbish the game that many people are going to purchase, but I agree FFXII can't deserve perfect score and it's far cry from the perfection. My rating is, while I adore Yasumi Matsuno and ex-4th development team, 85/100 at best.

Took the words right out of my mouth, I didn't get into FF11 cause of the battle system, but I know that people who play it long and got tired will hesitate to delete all their hard work and friends they made. FF11 has other values other than its gameplay that people might get jaded with. FF12 lacks those values, and its story isnt so hot either. People call it intelligent cause it deals with with the nation than characters, but how can you care for a foreign world if you don't give a damn of the characters who live there? And why would you care about the characters if they all as interesting as cardboard and don't change or develop?

FF12 is good or bad or great for different people, but its far from being the perfect game of the year magazines keep hyping it as, you know which game truly has a shot of deserving that honour? Okami. Story, originality, art and graphics, and most importantly gamplay are much better and more solid than FF12 ever will be.

There are far worst games out there than FF12, but that doesn't mean FF12 is perfect.

Jam it back in, in the dark.

I dunno, I found VP2 to be an RPG that is much more fun and addicting than FF12. But then again, FF12 overshadows alot of them so it might just get the award of RPG of the year by default.... Cause its FF.

There's nowhere I can't reach.