The Dark Spire- Thought Etrian Odyssey was for pussies? Then this is probably for you
Please release your grip on my balls, game.
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...e_us_cover.jpg The Dark Spire was released this past week, and it makes me want to cry. Similar to Etrian Odyssey, you take the role of a blank-slate protagonist and his fellow guildmates as you try to explore a massive labyrinth located just beyond a hub-town. Unlike Etrian Odyssey though, the game follows more traditional Dungeons & Dragons rule sets rather than the usual JRPG norms. Lawful/Neutral/Chaotic natures are determined by the spells you use and what church you pray at (as well as govern various abilities), Armor Class influences your defensive/evasive reliability, etcetera. You pick a race and class initially, but you can level other classes even after you pick your initial one. Another really neat feature is the ability to shift between Classic and Modern visuals: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...engel/vd-c.jpg http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...engel/vd-m.jpg http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...n_565_10-1.jpg http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y273/Lebenengel/1.jpg So far I'm still in the first floor of the tower, trying to grind but failing miserably. Every chest is trapped after battle, and my thief usually gets the trap order and disarming right, but sometimes fails and gets poisoned/dies. In this case, it's often better to simply make a new character than spend the 200 gold to revive them. So, anyone else playing? Great game, just hard. I'll expand on this thread and post when I better understand the mechanics. |
I mentioned this game in an old journal entry and didn't get many responses so hopefully this will garner more attention.
I wish I could play this game, but for some bizarro reason it has not yet been released in Canada. It keeps getting pushed back, and now it's stated it will not come out until May. It's really frustrating. I cancelled my pre-order at EB today and ordered it through Amazon instead. Apparently they have it in stock and it was shipped out today. I should be getting it by tomorrow or early next week. Can't wait to play it. I've been anxiously waiting for this since March, the original release date >_> I reallly dig the art style in modern mode. It's very similiar to Shadowgate, and I love the gothic-y (if that's the right word to describe it) touch. While EO is good, it's refreshing to play something that isn't anime-y. P.S. Would a warrior, warrior, thief, and priest work? What is the difference between a priest and a mage? Can priests cast black magic? |
Mage is attack and support, Priests are mostly healing. They can cast Holy magic, but it can't really replace a Mage for dealing magic damage. You could level both Mage and Priest classes on a single character, but I doubt it's very efficient.
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Oh, I'll go with the standard Warrior, Mage, Thief, Priest then. I presume Mages would be awesome once they're at higher levels. You can save at any time, right? So I guess you should save every so often in case you get raped so you don't need to pay for reviving.
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Yeah, you can save anywhere (and I do so often), which is really convenient. I wish Etrian Odyssey let you do that.
For now, I'm just trying to unlock Dark Elves and High Elves to see how good they are before I really start leveling my guys. |
This actually looks pretty good. I'm not going to lie, I prefer the "anime-y" feel of EO over this, but anything along the lines of EO, I'm sold for.
I might pick this up whenever it drops a bit in price because I have too many games to play right now anyway. Definitely looks interesting. |
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Odd...when I checked my tracking number just now, it says 'Out for Delivery' but the timestamp is in the evening...I've never ever known them to deliver anything in the evening. I'm guessing it's a typo, but anyway I didn't get the game today. I'll definitely get it Monday though.
I find it kinda funny that Dark Spire looks really westernized yet it's a Japanese game. Update: OMG my sister had the postal slip right in her bedroom. I can pick it up tomorrow! Whoo! |
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Yeah, I remember people said Etrian Odyssey was a Wizardry clone with more JRPG influence, but that was at a time when there was Wizardry, Etrian Odyssey, and nothing else.
But now that there is more or less an established sub-genre, it's better to compare it to the original rather than a fellow off-shoot. If you get to playing the Dark Spire, you'll see there's few strong similarities between it and EO. Better to compare the latter to 7th Dragon, which takes Etrian Odyssey and easternizes it further (makes sense since it's the same guys). |
Oh oh, this game is awesome. I've played it for over four hours now. Here's my party:
Warrior dwarf level 9 ST 16 IN 12 VT 16 DX 9 CH 13 Shoten, Metal Shield, Steel Helm, Fine Platemail, Parrot Doll Priest lvl 1 Priest human level 9 ST 14 IN 14 VT 14 DX 14 CH 11 Quarterstaff, Wooden Shield, Chainmail Mage dark elf level 8 ST 13 IN 16 VT 12 DX 14 CH 12 Quarterstaff, Robe Thief human level 8 ST 14 IN 14 VT 13 DX 13 CH 9 Longbow, Fine Leather. Golden Bracelet Is it possible to reset spell points while inside the dungeon with some sort of spell? P.S. It looks like GFF really isn't into this game. Update: Need help with my secondary class setup? I'm planning on having a Samurai, Wizard and Druid later, but I can't decide whether to get a Ninja or a Ranger. As far as I can make out, a Ranger is like Survivalist in EO (able to run away better, lower encounter rate) while the Ninja is more of a damage dealer. Any suggestions? Can you have Ninjas in the back row or are they strictly front-line fighters? Not that it's anything important, but I decided to make a Chaotic party with a neutral thief. |
Ninjas I believe are front-row fighters only, but are a bit better at absorbing damage than Thieves. And personally, I wouldn't put in anyone who lowers the encounter rate further. It's pretty forgivable already.
I got some time in today, was able to deck out my Warrior pretty completely (AC of 1). Still exploring the first floor. Hard stuff. |
My warrior and priest are level 6 now and my thief and mage are now level 4. I've pretty much mapped out the entire first floor and a fair amount of the second floor. 1st floor is pretty easy now for my party to breeze through, although sometimes those human enemies can give me a hard time. I haven't even found the stairs to the third floor yet, and I'm already clocking 19 hours with the game.
I am having trouble finishing the Spoiler:
My warrior is awesome, having an AC of -3, so he rarely gets hit. Thanks for your suggestion, GB. I'll turn my thief into a Ninja. I wish more people are playing this game. Looks like it's just you and me. |
I'd love to play this game, but as of right now, I've got WAY too many DS games active right now. Since one of those is Disgaea DS and the queue for DS games is ridiculously long, it'll be a long time before I get started (not to mention I haven't even played EO2 yet. I did finish EO1 though.)
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So how are you doing with your adventures, GB? I mapped more of floor 2 today, and a bit of the basement (the copper coins there are killing me), and I finally finished that Spoiler:
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The game actually got me back into Etrian Odyssey II, which I never finished, haha.
I finished up the first floor, moved on to the basement. Still debating whether or not I want to keep my Thief in the front row or just switch to the Heroic formation and let the enemies suffer the whiff-fest that is my Warrior. I believe the entrance to the third floor is in the northeast. Can't recall exactly though, so don't hold me to it. |
I started off with Tatical formation (warrior and priest in front, mage and thief in back) but am now using Heroic formation. Wow you found the stairs to the third floor already? It must be somewhere I keep constantly missing. I'll stick with the basement for now. I haven't fully explored it yet. I still have to do that quest with the ghosts and that one where I have to find a moonlight jewel.
Y'know, I never finished EOII as wel. I can't get past a boss, and I understand it's easier if I have a hexer (I think that's what they're called), but I never bothered levelling one up >_> My DS is most likely gonna run out of juice today so I'll be able to get some work done with SOII. Whoo hehe... Additional Spam: This new post will probably be merged with my last one, but IGN gave Dark Spire "Game of the Month" for April. This is awesome news, so WHY ISN'T ANYONE PLAYING IT! I have a nice update today. I explored more of the basement. I found a secret door but didn't explore further yet. I went back to town to save as the light was red. My entire party is set to level up soon. I finally found the way to the third floor, and it was nowhere near the NE, haha. |
Haha, my bad. Like I said, I couldn't remember. I was dicking around on the second floor and almost got wiped out, so I was a little too panicked to make note of the staircase to the third when I stumbled upon it.
Surprised IGN gave it an 8 and game of the month. Didn't some good stuff come out in April? Maybe it was March. |
Oooh actually you were right. Last night I was on a forum and came across a post telling how to get to the third floor, and it wasn't in the NE. So I went to that place and I was 'led' to the NE where the stairs were. Haha, sorry sorry. I didn't check it out til today and didn't have access to a PC to correct my post.
I dunno about good DS games in April as this is the only I got in April XD I too am surprised about IGN's score and award. 25 hours now and I'm mapped quite a bit of the third floor. There's loads of doors there. I'm fiddling around with the generator now, and rechecking all the areas with blank spaces to see if there's secret doors I missed on. Turns out I found lots of them. I can't figure out where to complete Garland's second quest. : / I'm looking everywhere and didn't find anything yet. Since you're obviously farther than me, mind if I ask some questions? Okay, in the generator room... Spoiler:
Also, my mage is now at level 8 and my priest is now at level 9 but none of them have any 'exit tower' spell yet. I know there is one, and I thought I'd get one at level 6...is it a Lawful only spell? My party except the thief is Chaotic. Update: I accidently stumbled onto Garland's quest location and I won. Whooo! Now I must find some gold coins. Bet they're in the Basement... |
I have it too. And yeah, it's hard. I enter the dungeon. Get ambushed. Watch half my party die before my first turn. At the lower levels you pretty much have to save after every fight. Goblins are easy. So are mushrooms. Humans on the other hand? Nasty. Very nasty. They seem to ambush me more often than not, score multiple hits, and are quite capable of one shotting any of my characters.
Party right now is: Lawful Dwarf Warrior Level 2. Has high Str and Vit Neutral Halfling Thief Level 2. Has high Dex and Cha with decent Int Lawful Human Priest Level 2. Has high Int plus decent other stats. Neutral Elf Wizard Level 2. Has high Int and Dex. I'm wondering if it might be worth giving the elf a priest level as time goes on. I mean since he can't equip heavy armor for his wizard spells anyways, having some extra healing on hand for when needed might be useful. |
If you're having trouble, Celisasu, spam that sleep spell that mages get. It's a definite lifesaver in the early part of the game. Undead and mushrooms cannot be put to sleep though.
Also use heroic formation, maaning your warrior should be up front with everyone else in the rear. Give your warrior the best weapons, armour and accessories to lower his AC. Early enemies cannot hit anyone in the rear and it will help a lot. If you still want to give your mage a priest level though, go right ahead. I didn't, but I did give one priest level on my warrior. Another option is to have your Warrior and Priest up front while the thief and mage are in the rear. Unlike mages, priests do good up front. Give him/her armour and a flail. Glad to see someone else playing. |
Well since nobody's updating their gaming session, I guess I can bump this. I'm currently on floor 4 and explored lots of it. One of the attractions there is funny.
Is there anything important I'm supposed to get in the Spoiler:
I accidently ran right into the Spoiler:
Everyone's now at level 10 and I'm currently preparing them for the advanced classes. Still haven't fixed the elevator yet. I need to get one more item and I have no idea where it is. Haven't found the stairs to floor 5 yet... |
Depends on what the item is. What're you missing? My hint is that everything is on the fourth floor and below.
Currently 12-13 with everyone, fiddling around on Floor 4. Elevator fixed, so I went and got the Druid class unlocked and turned my Mage into one. Still have all the others to get, ha! |
All I'm missing is the
Spoiler:
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I was also told to Spoiler:
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I just found this game yesterday and all I could think of is EO2. I don't know if I'll actually bother to play it though, cause the style seems a little to dark for me. XD
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As for the squirrel, try a room really close by to where you freed him. And make sure to look around with X, of course. |
Ah I found the critter on my way home from work before I read your reply.
Well I found the Shrine Maiden on the 4th floor, and the people on the third floor is begging me to save her but I don't know how to. I'm mucking around in the basement now. Rotating floors are tedious. |
Really? I'm usually amused with rotating tiles. I guess I like spatial memorization, though.
Haven't dealt with the Shrine Maiden on the fourth floor. Huh. Just got to the fifth in order to slay the Killer Bunnies for Sir Garland. The "Slay ___" quests seem to unlock the secondary class missions, so it appears I have to press on through the Tower sooner than I'd like. |
Well I finally made it to floor 5 and loving the music in it. I have completed several Secondary Training quests so I now have a Samurai and a Druid. My mage still needs 3 more Mage levels to be a Wizard and I haven't finished the quest yet to get a Ninja.
I dunno if its just me, but my party's AC isn't that good. Only my Samurai has a - before spell boosts. I learned that magic is basically essential to complete the game when I noticed all the dozens upon dozens of enemies attacking you at once and a warrior can only hit one at a time whereas magic can strike multiple foes in one shot. Update: Haha I finally unlocked Ninja. It took me a while to solve the quest :D |
Okay, so, apparently this game didn't really sell, because it's now a very reasonable $9.99 at Gamestop.
It's a good and damn hard classic dungeon crawler, so it's hardly going to hurt if it turns out to not be your thing. Plus, if you buy it new (used is only a dollar less), you'll get the nifty soundtrack along with it. |
Yeah, I bought it back when it was still $19.99 at Gamestop, which is reasonable for me, because I'm a big fan of dungeon crawling.
Though, playing this game, it seems like I took the create-your-own-map aspect of Etrian Odyssey for granted because I have no idea how I'm supposed to keep track of warps when there's like 4 adjacent ones leading to a room of 4 more adjacent ones. It gets confusing fast. (I'm looking at you, Floor 2) |
I never really had any trouble keeping track of where I was. Even if I did, there are spells and items that can tell your exactly where you are and what direction you're facing.
If you keep at it, you get good at navigation very quickly-- especially in the basement, where movement tiles are all over the place to break your concentration. |
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That floor 4's labyrinth is a pain in the ass. Thank god there's a faq map for it. Motherfucking teleport tiles mixed in with rotating tiles in TWO separate girds. SERIOUSLY.
I went through 5 floors without realizing I had Visum Situs available. I always allocated points towards damaging spells instead, and besides I had several compasses and Fine Compasses. By the way, how is it this game is HARD compared to Etrian Odyssey? Forgive me for asking, my sweetie has the game right now and only has one save slot so I couldn't really check it out til he finishes it. |
Well, in some ways, Etrian Odyssey is harder because of its ample use of bosses that are impossible to beat when you first stumble upon them. This game, at least, always gives you winnable battles.
But in most other aspects, the Dark Spire is the more difficult of the two. Mapping and navigation are far more vague, regular battles are deadlier, leveling is slower, skills are more difficult to learn and have far more subtle uses than Etrian Odyssey's, etcetera. Etrian Odyssey II and the Dark Spire are both great games though, and I'd recommend the former if you're enjoying the latter. I just think the Dark Spire has a much greater atmosphere. Quote:
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Which leads me to my next ponit: I'm well aware of the strategy of checking the map for differences because that's how I initially figured out where I was about 3 or 4 weeks ago. Now that I haven't touched the game in 3 weeks, and all of the tiles are already marked, that strategy is no longer valid and I have to start guessing exactly where I am with the warps. (or use a Compass or whatever the spell equivalent is called.) If it sounds like I'm hating this game, I'm not. I'm just frustrated that I have to resort to using tons of compasses just because I stopped playing for a bit and forgot how everything goes in something I've already explored. It's only an issue for me because I'm prone to going on-off on most games I play. :eagletear: I think EO has a stronger emphasis on character customization since, as you've already mentioned, you level up faster. And every time you level up, you get a new skill, which means that even though you might have several characters of the same class, they can all have different disciplines of their class, and could play entirely differently. DS has a stronger emphasis on straight dungeon crawling and exploration, which I suppose is what's expected in such a genre. So if anything, EO is more of a regular JRPG in the guise of a dungeon crawler whereas DS is just straight up dungeon crawling with random bits of RPG elements. Both are fun, but for different reasons. |
In that case, you need to start remembering where warp points take you. I never have too much trouble remembering since there aren't terribly many on each floor.
If that fails, I've found it's really easy to deduce where you are by looking around at the layout of the dungeon and comparing it to the map. Takes me about 30 seconds if I'm completely stumped, since most rooms won't have the exact same amount of doors in the exact same places. I think I've used a compass maybe twice, and the first time was because I didn't know exactly what it did. The second time I was impatient. As for customization, it's debatable. Classes are permanent in Etrian Odyssey, while it's all very fluid in the Dark Spire. Characters can ultimately fulfill several roles on the fly, while party members in EO must be carefully crafted from the beginning to fit in to one or maybe two specific roles through their entire career. |
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I do wish they would mark pitfalls though because falling through them really sucks when you're trying to match up warps with their destinations, though I suppose the only warps worth memorizing are the ones that take you forward. Also, where is the Flame Jewel? I was wandering around the Basement and found the Blizzard Jewel (or something) by accident. I've also found Ectoplasm and other stuff, which I assume are quest items in the future, but I have yet to find this Flame Jewel, which is my current objective. |
I use the save/load trick to find out where I am while avoiding having to use my spells in the process (I never use compasses).
I much prefer DS's style over EO's style. I'm not saying EO's style is bad though. I just think the atmosphere in DS feels more like a true dungeon crawler game than EO's anime style does. Also, I agree with what GB said in how DS is harder than EO. It's harder to level, get spells, map, etc. and the puzzles are harder too. Right now I'm stuck on floor 7. |
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