Who will replace Sugiyama?
 

Koichi Sugiyama has been the sole composer of Dragon Quest series since 1986, no other composer has composed the music other than him since the first time it was released in 1986. We might as well to say that Sugiyama is the main breath of Dragon Quest itself. Without his music, we wont find the same dragon quest music anymore.

Square Enix has cleverly started separating image of Nobuo Uematsu from Final Fantasy since FF X by the assistance of Junya Nakano and Masashi Hamauzu. And as we all know, it's a successful attempt. The final fantasy music we know now is not seen as Uematsu-ish anymore since it is done by different composers like Kumi Tanioka and her brilliant renaissance-like composition for FF CC, or Hamauzu's classical style in FFVII DoC and Sakimoto in FFXII.

But what about dragon quest? 8 games and several spin off, none any of them were done by other composer but Sugiyama. The image of Dragon Quest is just too identical to Sugiyama Music, yet he has been aged. He's 75 years old and to be honest, it's reasonable to think a replacement if the unexpected thing come (hopefully not!).

To be honest I couldn't find any name suitable to replace Sugiyama. Hamauzu is the one that crossed my mind, since he's classical trained, but again, his music has different characteristic compared to Sugiyama. Yoko Kanno might be suitable as well. She's brilliant classical composer. Just listen to any soundtracks done by her, especially the ones with orchestra. You could consider her skill in same level of Sugiyama.

What is your opinion about this? Share your thought here.

I think Sakimoto would be an interesting successor. :)

I was never that big of a fan of Sugiyama; he and his music always seemed a little stodgy to me.

Since Squeenix isn't particularly concerned with keeping their main franchises consistent in sound, they'll probably slot in whoever the flavor of the month happens to be, even if it's a totally inappropriate choice.

Then again, 75 isn't that terribly old. Elmer Bernstein was composing well into his 80's.

The Japanese life expectency age is 96
Hamauzu may go on to do more final fantasys (unless other Square Composers are assigned to later numbers as I think it is going)
Sakimoto...maybe...maybe not...would be interesting

The Dragon Quest games need live sound - definitaly after 7 and 8 - it's a shame they don't stream the symphonic music.

Maybe it needs new blood al together - need to see some new composers on the block :)

Sugiyama was born on 1931-04-11, making him 75 years old. I don't know what the life expectancy is in Japan, but I don't know how many DQ games he has left in him, though I like his music and hope its alot, but this question hay have to be asked soon. Personally, he's one of my favorite SQ-Enix composers, and looking at the list of SQ-Enix composers, one of only 2 that I know and really like their compositions, so I'd have to say that Yoko Shimomura should replace him by default.

Of course, take this with a grain of salt, the only others I'm familiar with are Hamauzu (Who I don't really like, I remember listening to the SGF2 ost in my car once and thinking "This piano piece has been going on for like 20 minutes, when will it be over," and it was really like 10 different songs. Needs variety,) and Sakimoto (Though my opinion of him is slowly getting higher.)

Edit: Beaten

I agree, and it is, but that's why I love him so much. You don't hear that stodgy stuff in games. :)

This is a good question, because he IS getting pretty old. Like RyuFan, I wouldn't mind seeing someone completely new enter the Square Enix scene. But Hamauzu would be an interesting choice. Shimomura wouldn't be so bad, either. In fact, I can actually see Shimomura composing for the series in the future.

But god, just not Sakimoto. I don't think his atmospheric style would suit the series at all. I don't think he could do it well, honestly.

Quoted for truth, and for finally agreeing with my viewpoint in the fact of militant Hamauzu fanboyism :)

I personally think that, on further consideration, that Shimomura or Sakimoto would make good replacements, though it would be nice to see an unknown get a shot or (wonder of wonders) perhaps Mitsuda.

No offense, but I think Sakimoto is a completely bad fit for Dragon Quest's history of music. He's not animated enough in his composing.

In the vgm sphere, I think noone could replace Sugiyama very classical style and I guess Mr. Horii would have to choose someone else, not related to the vgm sphere. But quite frankly I really dont know who could be the successor of Sugiyama. Shimomura? Certainly not. Sakimoto? No way and I'm not even sure he would accept the offer if he was proposed so (even though he has worked on DQVI)... Hamauzu? Hm I dont think so.

EDIT: Anyways, whoever's going after Sugiyama legacy is going to have a lot of pressure, that's for sure!

I think Shimomura music is not suitable for Dragon Quest nuisance, she's just too... techno-ish. No offense. Sakimoto or Mitsuda would be nice choice though.

Shimomura techno-ish? Hmm I guess ive missed something here. While I'm a big Sakimoto fanboy, he's not fitted at all for DQ and anyway I dont want him to be shoot down by DQ fans so yeah... :p
Mitsuda is dead dude, deal with it! :p

...

Just curious... why nobody mentioned Uematsu?

:lolsign:

I dont know, his style is certainly not fitting to DQ? lol

Uematsu's style is completely different. Furthermore, why would he jump ship from Final Fantasy to go into Dragon Quest? He wants to work on new franchises, like the Mistwalker games.

Hamauzu was the first person to jump to my mind, but after composing for his third Final Fantasy game now, I'd say he's pretty tied to that franchise.

My personal choice would be Hirokazu Ando, since he has an upbeat orchestral style. However, he's nowhere close to Sugiyama in musical experience (as far as I know), and he works for HAL.

Otherwise, Akira Miyagawa would be cool.

Hirokazu Ando? What games did he compose for? I just notice his name now.

To be honest, Yoko Kanno is the only name I think could match Sugiyama's classical-ness. She's very classical and capable to write epic in her music.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hirokazu_Ando

Mostly a bunch of Kirby games, as well as the the Smash Bros. series.

For the US version of DQ8, thats exactly what they did. Hopfefully we see more of that in the future!

On the thread topic, i dont think anyone could replace his style. His death could very well also be the death of the Dragon Quest series. This is only my opinion. I think it would be an honor to retire the series in his behalf, when that day comes. But as it was said before, he will most likely be around for a LONG while still, so i dont think we have much to worry about yet :oD

I agree with Eriol. Yoko Kanno is the most suitable with her classical styles. I can just imagine music like Dance of Curse in Dragon Quest. In fact, I think her talent would be just the thing that Square-Enix needs ;). I just hope that S-E wouldn't do the unthinkable and get Naoshi Mizuta to write DQ. That alone would make me scream in agony.

Err. josh, who is Naoshi Mizuta?

I also hope that SE wont assign Motoi Sakuraba for Dragon Quest, maybe it's just me, but none of his composition suit my taste.

How about Yuzo Koshiro or Hayato Matsuo?

Matsuo would be a logical choice (possibly) because of his orchestral style. But Yuzo Koshiro...? That would be pretty interesting. Maybe he could go back to his Actraiser days. That would fit perfectly.

Masamichi Amano should start making game music, just for this.

Don't forget to mention Kenji Kawaii. I havent heard any of his works other than the BGM of Fate/Stay Night. But i assume he must be a classical-trained composer. He could be a candidate as well.

He is the main composer for Final Fantasy 11. He alone did the music for all the FFXI expantions, and was accompinied by Kumi Tanoka and Nobou Uematsu for the main game. Im sure youve prolly heard some of his music and just dont know it yet.


I think he worked for Capcom before coming to S-E, someone feel free to confirm/correct me.

Hayato Matsuo would be the best choice. He has already worked with Sugiyama on Magical Knight Rayearth, Idataki Street Special, and all of the Dragon Quest CD Theater albums (where he was an arranger). Matsuo would do a lot with the series and is an incredible musician.

It would be a dream come true if Kentaro Haneda was the substitute. He is a classical-trained composer and his works for Falcom and for several anime soundtracks endorse him.

Yeah, and being realist, I think that Hayato Matsuo is the ideal candidate.

Blesed thy be. I rarely see a person mention the name of Kentaro Haneda. You're the second person I know in this forum after bishop who knows his name. ;) But the chance for Kentaro Haneda would be close to zero. He rarely composed video game music anymore.

I think Sugiyama works was just too unique and none of the composer so far that was mentioned in this thread can replace him, especially with most known composers. Guess DQ was never the same without Sugiyama... Sakimoto's too medieval, Shimomura tends to go techno, Mizuta was kinda boring (I've never forget his work on Parasite Eve 2 which was terrible, although his contribution at FFXI was much better compared the last time he did though still kinda boring), Uematsu's Celtic-alike. Hamauzu might be good since his works feel more fantasy-like but still pale in comparison with Sugiyama. Kanno could be good choice, but she's kinda different since her works more traditional & jazz mix.

I've actually never heard Hayato Matsuo before, but if what @Maul said was true, then Matsuo might be considered since he worked with Sugiyama before.

Matsuo's tracks in FFXII aren't all that great. I haven't heard any of his other works.

I don't think anyone could replace Sugiyama. His sound is simply too ingrained in the games. Let's hope he lives a long life...

Well, he did orchestrate and partly compose the Opening and Ending themes, though I agree that his original tracks weren't all that interesting upon first impressions.

EDIT: Just found out that Matsuo used to be a pupil of Sugiyama's.

There is a part in Matsuo's "Abyss" from FFXII that sounds EXACTLY like something Sugiyama would do. Im gonna lean toward Matsuo replacing him now.

Heh? Now that's interesting, wonder why this guy doesnt have more project. I really liked his contribution on FFXII.

He's had plenty of projects, but not all of them are well-known.

Like most Imagine composers, he dabbles in the field of anime too. His anime works are listed here. He's also a major contributor to the Troubadour series of non-game albums.

Here is a list of scores he has worked on:

Original Scores

Battle Garegga Perfect Soundtrack (arrangement)
Dragon Force II ~ When the Gods Abandoned Earth
Final Fantasy XII Original Soundtrack
Front Mission 3 Original Soundtrack
Front Mission 5 ~Scars of the War~ Original Soundtrack (reprise from FM3)
Front Mission Online Original Soundtrack (reprises from FM3 - announced soundtrack, but no details as yet)
Master of Monsters
Ogre Battle 64: Person of Lordly Caliber Original Soundtracks
Ogre Battle, All Sounds of
Panzer Dragoon Orta Original Soundtrack (arrangement)
Panzer Dragoon RPG, Azel (arrangement)

Arranged Albums

Ogre Battle Image Album ~ The Entrance
Ogre ~Grand Repeat~
Sakura Taisen III Music Collection ~ Paris Music Hall
Sakura Taisen V ~Farewell, Loved Ones~ Music Collection New York Music Hall
Sakura Taisen V ~Farewell, Loved Ones~ Vocal Collection New York Songs Collection
Shenmue Orchestra Version
Sword Maniac

Other Albums

Dragon Quest I CD Theater
Dragon Quest II CD Theater
Dragon Quest III CD Theater
Dragon Quest IV CD Theater Vol. 1
Dragon Quest IV CD Theater Vol. 2
Dragon Quest IV CD Theater Vol. 3
Dragon Quest V CD Theater Vol. 1
Dragon Quest V CD Theater Vol. 2
Dragon Quest V CD Theater Vol. 3
Dragon Quest VI CD Theater Vol. 1
Dragon Quest VI CD Theater Vol. 2
Game Music Concert ~The Best Selection~
Game Music Concert 2 ~The Best Selection~
Game Music Concert 4 ~The Best Selection~
Panzer Dragoon RPG Mini Album, Azel

I'm still not 100% sure about whether he composed all CD Theater albums, but the translator I work with from time-to-time seems to think so. There might be other Sakura Taisen and possibly Tengai Makyou albums as well, so if anyone can confirm them, tell me. ;)

Hmm... he arranged Ogre Battle Grand Repeat and... Ogre Battle Image Album Enterance? Interesting... he actually arranged both one jewel and one crappiest album in VGM history.

I should explain... For an album to be listed as featuring him, it simply means compositions or arrangements of his feature. The Panzer Dragoon albums are arranged by him, but feature no original compositions. Grand Repeat features compositions from him (one, if I remember correctly), but he doesn't take an active arranging role. Sorry if this is confusing!

The credits for Ogre Battle Image Album state that Hitoshi Sakimoto, Masaharu Iwata, and Hayato Matsuo were the arrangers. That baffles me, as none of them have ever produced another bad work. Masatsugu Shinozaki (a master violinist) was the arranger of Grand Repeat.

IMO, Shenmue Orchestra Version was the pinnacle of Hayato Matsuo's orchestral arrangements.

As far as the Dragon Quest CD theaters are concered, he actually didn't work on the first one (ECD-001), as Sugiyama is credited solely for both music and arranging. I can confirm that he did work as an arranger on the second one (ECD-002) though, together with Sugiyama. (there's really no mistaking this as the credits are all in English for these two cds) Hope that helps ;)

You guys automatically dismissed Nobuo Uematsu, but there's absolutely no reason why Uematsu couldn't handle the Dragon Quest series. Uematsu, short of Sugiyama himself, is the most melodic game composer out there. He's explicitly said that when composing he always develops the melody first and then builds the song around that. Uematsu is also the only composer I know of to not even really *have* a distinctive style of his own. He's completely versatile, having demonstrated mastery over orchestras and operas as well as synthesizers, and can compose in basically any style of music effectively. I have no doubt he could take over the Dragon Quest series.

That said, as a militant Hamauzu fanboy, I also think Hamauzu could handle it. But I would pick Uematsu first and foremost.

That was helpful, yet confusing! The only two DQ CD Theaters that I've seen solid English confirmation that Hayato Matsuo was the arranger were the first and second (that source was RPGFan). Thanks for revealing this anyhow; it makes everything much more complex for me, but at least I won't be publishing any inaccurate information now.

I'll do some searching of '松尾早人 ' and see what I come up with.

Difference is that Nobuo Uematsu really hasn't demonstrated mastery over orchestras. Practically all FF orchestrations (in-game or arranged album) were done by another arranger, most often Shiro Hamaguchi. Hamaguchi produced the orchestrations in the FFVII Reunion Tracks, FFVIII FITHOS LUSEC WECOS VINOSEC, Tour de Japon, Dear Friends, and 20020220, and was principally responsible for a wide number of in-game gems -- including "FFXI Opening Theme," "Liberi Fatali," "Suteki Da Ne" (orchestral and original), FFVIII's ending theme, "Eyes on Me," "Melodies of Life," and "One Winged Angel."

Nobuo Uematsu isn't trained in orchestration, whereas Koichi Sugiyama received extensive training and is one of the most technically proficient composers out there. Some things don't require training, but orchestration certainly does (I should know). There'd be an incredible regression in technical quality were Nobuo to take over.

Hamaguchi + Dragon Quest wouldn't be ideal, IMO. Hamaguchi is melodramatic, in my opinion, and would make DQ overstated. Hayato Matsuo would be far more appropriate, though both come from the same company (Imagine). Besides, Hamaguchi is away from Japan for some time, receiving education in Boston.

Not sure about Masashi Hamauzu's skills as an orchestrator... Coi Vanni Gialli was rather good, though Dirge of Cerberus required an external orchestrator.

Quoted for truth. This is also the main reason I dont mention his name in the first post. While he's melodious, his style is radically different with Sugiyama. Uematsu's music is more melodious and play in the simpleness, Sugiyama music is more complex and colored by classical ornament, even Baroque ones (blessed he be). I never heard Uematsu arranged his works himself.

But would be nice to see Uematsu + Hamauzu cope together, though Hamauzu is more brilliant as piano arranger.

That's strange. I guess whoever made the review of the first one must have made a mistake then. He is credited as music producer for it though, together with a few other people.

To be honest, from the review, it didn't seem like they had listened to the album at all, so I guess there was a misunderstanding down the line.

Music producer, eh? Very interesting. Thanks for the help, seanne.

He arranged Dear Friends, if I remeber correctly.

Yup and Final Fantasy III Eternal Legend of Wind.

That was definitely an education, and I respect what you mean when you say Sugiyama can't be at all traded in for Uematsu.

However, Uematsu was the composer for all the albums you mentioned above, and there's no reason he couldn't take over as composer for DQ. He could have Hamaguchi continue to help him with the arrangements for orchestra. I'm not convinced that there would be a "huge regression in technical quality" if Uematsu were to take over. Uematsu has learned how to compose and produce fantastic orchestral music, even if he had someone help him fill in the gaps in his training.

Is there any proof that he helped with composing those pieces? They sounded strictly Sakimoto to me (with Matsuo's orchestrations).

I concur that Uematsu would be a bad choice to take over the DQ legacy. He doesn't have nearly the training needed to pull it off. In addition, his recent music has felt very tired to me (basically anything FFIX and after).

That's part of the problem right there. Most composers understand that there's more to music than melody. That's part of the reason why Sakimoto's FFXII score worked so well and why Sugiyama's work is so textured. All Uematsu has working for him are pretty melodies and lately, he's seemed all melodied out. ;)

Sugiyama's work is far more simplistic and melody-focused than Uematsu's. Uematsu *begins* by making the melody, but Sugiyama basically stops after that. The orchestrations come out very well, but his original compositions for the Dragon Quest games, as beautiful as they are, are nothing in sophistication compared to the work Uematsu did for 7, 8, or 9.

Uematsu's greatest strength may not be his melodies, but that he builds songs of wildly different styles and takes a lot of risks in composing. The Final Fantasy VIII soundtrack alone shows probably about a million (a million!) very different sounding pieces. The FF8 boss theme was an amazing electronic organ piece, the battle theme was a wonderful 5/4 time orchestral song, and the Laguna battle music wouldn't have sounded out of place in a rave. And yet all three of these songs are best of breed for an RPG soundtrack.

You're selling Uematsu short here, and to call Sugiyama's work "textured" and to say that all Uematsu does is make good melodies is seriously mistaken. I'll freely admit Sugiyama's orchestrations are some of the most beautiful music in all RPGs, and I wish he did more than just DQ. But Sugiyama has really carved himself a very specific niche into my heart, while Uematsu continued to reinvent himself with every game he did. Uematsu is the man.

I think a perfect team (although odd) would be Yoko Kanno and Masashi Hamauzu. Both composers are capable arrangers, and are quite talented in coming up with outstanding works that are both creative and breathtaking.

He composed 3:50 to 4:25 of the "Opening," but didn't compose any specific section of the ending theme, though orchestration often involves some composition as well.

I would like to see Hamauzu go with the series, but he may be too out there with his compositions to follow in Sugiyama's wake. I doubt it would happen, but I wouldn't be suprised to see DQ stop altogether. I feel the same with the Silent Hill series and Yamaoka as well.

It would be harder to replace Sugiyama for DQ than it was to replace Uematsu for FF.

I don't know, it was pretty damn tough to replace Uematsu; they needed to use two entire Final Fantasy soundtracks as transition time alone with Uematsu working alongside other people, and he's still going to be working on the main themes for 12 and 13. If something as intensive as that was done with DQ it would probably work out.

Somehow I think that maybe Uematsu will work with some kind of different medium. He does have talent, but I think he has lost his touch with some aspects of VGM.