MS sued over idiots misusing their consoles
 

Microsoft faces new Xbox 360 reliability accusations - Video Game Feature - Yahoo! Video Games

That's nice.

And your point is what exactly?

Is this not the proper forum to post news items related to gaming, and is there not a [news] tag for posting of said news items?

It's Microsoft fucking over its customers for no obvious reason

It's not really news then is it

I don't necessarily think that is the point Shin was trying to make, speculative. I don't want to speak for Shin and sound out of line but usually when a person puts down something gaming news related it should be a lot more than just the news article in itself. It should be your personal opinion about it as well. How do you feel about Microsoft being sued over the 360 scratching DVD's.

I would like to think a great way of adding discussion to a particular gaming news article is to add how you feel about instead of counting on other people to create the discussion for you. That is just my constructive criticism.

In terms of my opinion concerning the subject, I don't own a 360 so I didn't see first hand the kind of damage the 360 would do to the games, but I have heard about it on the scatter occasion. It sounds like Microsoft got caught with their pants down and they might have some consumer problems to deal with, but I don't personally think its going to hurt the console. People are still going to buy it, but it would be interesting to see how this lawsuit ends up.

This problem no longer exists in new 360s as far as I know. My girlfriend and I both have recent models and we've not experienced any scratched discs. It's a moderately interesting piece of news, but... it relates to a dead issue.

That's giving speculative a bit too much credit, since speculative didn't even post the article, but a link to the article.

See, what I think Angel of Light is getting at, and rightly so, is quite simply: where's the content? Someone suing someone else in America is hardly news, not least of all when the someone getting sued is Microsoft (or any other big company really). Where's the start of any discussion? What is the point of posting the news? I'm willing to bet your only point in posting the news story was to go "Lol, M$ getting sued". Hilarious.

Guys, guys, guys, I think what speculative really wanted us to do was construe the true meaning behind his thread.

Microsoft totally would have made working 360s if the Centauri hadn't conquered the Narn.

Obviously this guy is dumb enough to do something like this so I think he deserves to lose.

Y'know, it would be nice if we could post news bits without getting chomped to shit, guys.

It'd also be nice if the actual fucking article was in in the quote box like a normal person would post, Speculative. Everyone's fucking right. This is a horrible, shitty thread.

But what the fuck is there to discuss really? Horray? Who cares? If anyone wants to post news of worth why doesn't anyone make a thread on why the American Club Nintendo is up and running but is insanely broken? That'd have some discussion going. Talk about a stupid fucking thing to pick. Omagnus is right, this reeks of posting just for the lulz considering what should and DOES NOT get posted.

Regardless, it's strange that this comes now, considering we've all known it can do this, and they've admitted to knowing it does this for a while. I understand there's a problem with knowningly selling a faulty product, but that's not really what this problem encompasses. You can ruin a lot of things by doing stuff to them while they're operating that the manufacturers probably know about, but won't get sued over. Don't fucking tilt over your washing machine kids, you might break it.

Well, duh?

At first I thought this was just saying that it scatches discs, period. However, adding the 'you have to tilt it' adds a whole new dimension both to this and even future lawsuits. The bad part is, part of me feels this may become another "hot coffee" incident.

The opening post was utterly pathetic. Posting news here is fine but just posting a single paragraph of a news story and a link is not the way to create a thread. Put some discussion in it, your own thoughts at the very least.

As far as this goes, the fucker is suing MS for $50,000. The whole thing is clearly some dude hoping to make a couple of grand out of an out of court settlement and a firm of lawyers looking to make a name for themselves by representing him. Inevitably MS will show that somewhere in the reams of fine-print that comes with the thing it says "Don't shake your console while it's running", this'll get laughed out of court and the guy will end up bankrupt when MS's lawyers bill drops on his doormat.

American litigation culture remains as ridiculous and hilarious to the rest of the world as it always has, a few Sony fantards jump up and down over how early models of the 360 would break your games if you shook them, something entirely common knowledge to everyone, ever and that's it. Fuck it, even if they pay him the $50,000 that's about 4 seconds profit for MS.

The only surprising thing about this is that the idiot lawyers didn't press him to pursue a class action case, involving a load of people who've suffered the same problem. The payout would have been higher and the case a shitload more high profile. They'd probably still have lost but would have got a load more publicity out of it and be more likely to actually get their fees paid. Fucking noobs.

The thing is, yeah Microsoft should have possibly made more to inform users that moving the console whilst a disc is spinning was likely to result in scratching, since they knew about it. However, you only need to apply a small amount of common sense to work out that perhaps re-orienting a powered on console with a disc spinning inside is probably not going to end well for any of the parts involved. I wonder how many people would happily stick a disc in a PC and then fuck about with standing it up and laying it down whilst all powered on? My money is on not many.

So yeah, this definitely smacks of someone thinking they can make themselves a quick buck, and some idiot lawyers along for the ride/publicity.

Would've cost Microsoft 50 cents more per console to add rubber padding so this wouldn't happen. And apparently increased load times. So at least they've got some reason I guess. But hey, that pretty much sums up the 360 console though.

Say what now? Care to explain what you mean by that.

I'd hardly call plumping for shorter loading times for the vast majority of the userbase who've had no disc scratching issues over protecting the stupid fucks who like to play catch with their consoles while they're switched on a dumb decision. Every time I watch the Little Big Planet loading screen I'm less tempted to buy a PS3, short loading times for everyone are definitely worth fucking up a few dickhead's games for.

And anyway, after the first disc got fucked, why did he stick two more in rather than take the thing back to the shop for a replacement?

Isn't the entire argument for console platforms over the PC about how simple and idiot-proof they are? Sure, your average PC gamer wouldn't pick up their machine and shake it like a maraca, but they wouldn't pay $10/month for the "privilege" of playing their games online either. Of course, even if I did decide to pick up my rig and throw it across the room, I'd be able to replace whatever parts I broke, whereas your only recourse with the Xbox is to send the whole thing back to MS and wait a goddamn month for them to send you a new one (if they even decide to do that).

Cue the tired argument about how a PC gaming rig is so expensive and also look at my 72 inch screen I bought to play Halo on

Addendum: Ha ha, loading screens

Issues that could've been corrected before the launch of the console but weren't. Not really complaining though. Maybe not the most reliable hardware but I still play it more than my wii or ps3.


And I agree with shin, it wasn't that bad of a decision on MS' part. Moving what's essentially a computer while it's running a disc is never a good idea. But then again MS should've known people were still going to do it.

Pretty sure people don't mean it in that context. Rather you don't have to take it apart, upgrade it or fiddle with settings and system requirements. Nothing is ever idiot-proof when it comes to electronics.

Spoken like a true PC-gamer fanboy.

Of course, all those World of Warcraft players, and City of Heros players, and Warhammer players, they sure don't pay $10 a month to play their online games do they.

Also, a year has twelve months in it. So it's more like 4 to 5 dollars a month. Which isn't a whole lot of money, you know.

I'm sorry, are you comparing a subscription fee for individual MMOs to a console-inherent fee that applies to every game on the platform? That's cute.

Besides, MMOs are increasingly a platform-independent plague. Don't pretend otherwise.

Exactly what am I a fanboy of, here? Intel?

(I might be off about the price of Live; I went to Xbox.com to research it but the site was, let's say, a little information-poor)

I'm comparing gamers choosing to pay a regular fee to play their games online to gamers choosing to pay a regular fee to play their games online. It's a big leap I grant you, I don't know what I was thinking.

You are a silly man and you are drawing a silly comparison. I will improve it for you, so that you may cease the silly attempt at indignation you are attempting.

Say you have a DVD player. Now, let's propose, in theory, that some DVDs require a fee to watch. Well, that's kind of dumb, who would play to watch their DVD? They already paid for it. But some people are willing to pay! Well, that's their business.

Say you have another DVD player, which insists that you pay whenever you put in ANY movie, even if they aren't tagged as pay-to-play! That's strange, isn't it? Why would you buy that player?

Oh, well, it has a black matte finish, I guess that's pretty kool

(PS: Rage more, it amuses me to be called a "fanboy" when I imply that subscribing to your own hardware is silly)

How about I update your little analogy there so it's actually accurate.

Your DVDs have different elements of content, there's the film and then there's the extra.

The first DVD player would accept two kinds of DVD. The first DVDs wouldn't require any extra payment to play, they would happily play the film and extras all the time. However, the second kind of DVD would require regular payment to watch either the film or the extras.

The second DVD player would accept online one kind of DVD and it would always play the film, regardless. You'd even have access to some of the extras. However, to get full access to the extras you'd need to pay a regular fee.


See the dumb assumption you're making here Pang is that I agree with MS charging for Xbox Live Gold. I don't, not really, I think it's kind of cheeky. However, I wasn't the one who made the claim that PC gamers wouldn't be so dumb as to pay regularly for the privilege of playing their games online. Try grasping the actual point before you get on your high horse.

What the fuck were you arguing with me for then, you silly man.

"It is silly to pay to play games."

"FUCK YOU! Actually I agree."

"Oh."

I don't see what the big deal is. It's really not that much money. It would be nice if it were free, but 50 bucks stretched over 13 months is a small fee comparative to nearly everything else in our lives. 10 bucks a month for an MMO isn't that much either actually if it's something you enjoy.

Microsoft's 2008 net income, according to Google Finance, was $17,681,000,000. Since there are 31,557,600 seconds in a year (assuming a year has 365.25 days), Microsoft actually needs 1 minute and 29.24 seconds to pay off the $50,000 :tpg:

Even if you use their gross profit of $48,822,000,000, you will need 32.32 seconds!

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On more serious matters, I don't think this fellow was tilting his consoles while playing, to render three of his game discs unplayable. The original article at the Madison County Record only mentioned that he played it conventionally for a few hours.

The only mention where the changeover from horizontal to vertical orientation is mentioned is in an application for a Class-Action lawsuit, representing everyone who's ever purchased an X-Box 360 before July 18, 2007. Yahoo Video Games may have accidentally conflated the two stories...

So I wouldn't be so quick to judge this Jason Johnson fella for stupidity.

(Also, Skills is the sane and well-reasoned voice here. What is the world coming to...)

"A PC gamer wouldn't be stupid enough to pay to play games"

"Of course not, not like those WoW, CoH, WAR players heh"

"*some shit about DVD players and missing the point*"

The point: you continue to miss it.

So you see no meaningful distinction between a platform that SUPPORTS a subscription model and a platform that REQUIRES it?

Really?

Really?

I mean honestly if it's only $5/month it's hardly worth arguing over but you've evidently got a bug up your ass over the whole thing.

Your argument would work if the Xbox 360 required an Xbox Live Gold subscription. Except it doesn't. Even so, that's not where my argument lies. See how I summarised it above. You made a stupid claim, I called you on it, and then you are the one that went off on this retarded tangent about how the Xbox requires money. Except it doesn't.

Keep going though, I'm impressed with how well you've managed to keep missing the point.

Why didn't someone just say this in the first place!

Well then, how silly. What the fuck does this "Gold" nonsense do, if it's not meant to let you play your games. Does it have something to do with the retarded little Mii ripoffs I've been seeing. What are you getting for your $5 if it's not some kind of functionality?

This is all extraordinarily curious! Please, tell me more of your magical world.

You need a Gold subscription to play games online on the 360, you can play them offline for free. (?) It's a bit of a ripoff (especially considering that online play is free on the PS3 and Wii), but it's not required. Though I'm not sure if that's what you were actually talking about, what with the DVD analogies.

That's not the entire argument, though I'm pretty sure you're aware of that and are just saying it to be patronising. I have an IQ of over 350 (so I don't need things to be idiot-proof), I just prefer consoles because it's more comfortable to play on my couch, with a controller, on a big TV screen, without worrying about system requirements, and nowadays the game library is pretty much the same on PC and consoles (so the old argument that consoles are for babies and the PC offers more complex games is not really valid anymore). Though I still love playing old point-and-click adventures on the PC...

Isn't there a free Silver membership that allows you to play online on the weekends or something?

Right now you can play certain arcade games online with a silver account. You were (still are?) able to play games like Shadow Run with silver. Nothing substantial like Halo or CoD though.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/...500_AA280_.jpg

You'd think someone so fucking smart would be able to understand the DVD analogy they were using but hey.

This is pretty much what you're paying for, yes.

Paying for online is silly, says the PC user!

Well yes, yes it is. On the PC, it would never work! See: Live for Windows! Wasn't that a fun experiment? MOST CERTAINLY NOT.

However, consoles are the home of retards! You are paying for the service to make it as easy as fucking possible for Joe Shitlicker to find you in Call of Duty.

There are free alternatives, yes! But by comparison they are crap to the nth degree. Well, shit.

Now we could argue that those alternatives are justifiably crap because they are free, but that wouldn't weaken the argument for paying for live, so.

Maybe if Live was free, the others would have to step up to plate to make their shit less ridiculously bad in order to compete on that feature set, though.

Actually, PS3's online is getting better and better. They're expanding their service and making it much more smooth. Eventually it'll be caught up to XBL, though until sales start really picking up I doubt MS is all that worried. But still, PSN is quality online. Long ago I would've said the lack of a headset being included with the console itself was a drawback, but fuck, 2/3 of the people in a random online game don't even have theirs plugged in over XBL.

Hey. What's up? I understood it fine, it just looks like there was a communications breakdown between Pang and Omagnus, since either Pang doesn't understand what functionality a Gold subscription actually provides, or Pang was talking solely about the online portion of games (and how all 360 games require a subscription for online multiplayer, unlike with PC) and Omagnus misunderstood that, and all in all I think some confusion could have been avoided by skipping analogies altogether.

Oh, okay. (?)

Care to explain how PSN, being free and all, is going to be picking up sales.

Wrong. It's acceptable online some of the time, but it's rarely quality online. Every time they release any sort of big update that a lot of people will be grabbing you can practically see the PSN grind to a halt. True, it is getting better, but it still lacks structure, reliability and the ability to deal with scaling.

Wrong again. I'd love to know what corner of Xbox Live you've found where 2/3rds of the people aren't using mics and talking shit or absolute nonsense.

Would having additional 13-year-olds screaming directly into your ears about what a faggot nigger bitch you are really improve your play experience?


(Jesus Christ OP, just calm the fuck down unless you're being paid for this breathless defense of whatever the fuck)

Wherever it is, please give me directions because I'd love that place.

Like everything else good in the world, it's in Fairmont, New Jersey ("Home of The Wumps")

The console itself. Good sales, but still in third and most big online games get bought on the 360.

That really isn't a big deal anymore from what I've noticed. Until Call of Duty 4 came out the online was generally shit, especially for multiplat games. But since it's above decent. Most games run just as well, in terms of multiplayer, on the PS3 as they do on the 360. Some exceptions, but the multiplat games I've played on both have been quite smooth.

Put in a lot of time into games like the CoD series, Rainbow series, GRAWs, etc etc. The majority of people in a room simply don't talk or don't have their mics plugged in. Either you only notice the loud people or play with your friends or simply don't notice, but that's just the way it is. Only big games that a lot of people talk in are Gears and Halo. Seriously, go into a random game of CoD4/5 with no buddies and in most games no one will talk or just one or two. It makes games like objective games in Rainbow unplayable if you don't have a group with you.

Ugh, Jersey? Forget it then. I'll just keep getting called a dyke and a cunt any time I play anything competitive.

Man, yeah. COD is such a silent experience, Omagnus. I mean, shit. We must never have played it or something because that's just how it is. How could we not have realized?

O u no, just laughing at how someone can honestly think they have an IQ that literally breaks the scale of the test and is untold factors above even the greatest geniuses of our time. You know, the usual stuff.

I don't know what games you guys get into, but for all the days I put into random pickup games in CoD4 most were silent. Maybe it depends on the hour of day or what, but hell, whenever anyone tries to ask a question they get complete silence unless I pipe in. Hardcore gets more talkative people, if I'm in a group people tend to talk more, but otherwise... not a whole lot. Beats hearing people yell and throw insults around though. But even then that's a couple or so out of the 12 people in a room.

Consider yourself fortunate, then.

Only way I could explain it is having a canadian isp or playing between 10am-3pm/2am-5am. Can't think of any other reason it would be different.

Yeah, must be the ISP. Shaw doesn't have the option to "block all traffic from certified asshats". Perhaps it's time to switch.

Of course that doesn't explain it. Neither do. You're just as likely to get an asshole at 1 AM than you are at any other time of the day and I'll still get matched up with people all over america no matter what. But hell, silent players seem to be the norm from what I've heard around other parts of the internet and my experience matches that.

I don't think it really matters what time you play, you will still likely get some twat shouting at you just because of "LOL UR A FAG LOL!" purposes.

Slightly on topic... not one of my DVDs have been scratched whilst being played via Xbox. Sure over time and a mass amount of playing a DVD will get surface scratches but that happens in any DVD player, not just an Xbox. Not really sure why anybody would sue over this to be honest. Surely it would cost more to sue than it would to buy a brand new DVD?

Right, which is what I said. If I play early in the morning I'll just get someone from the England, France or Germany.

Yes, the nature of the internet is that it can connect to anyone! Isn't that magical. And those anyones can be...well, anyone! Including assholes. Wowee.

These other parts of the internet must be quite the lucky bastards, I tell you. Nothing in my experience agrees with yours. I would just consider yourself lucky (or me unlucky) and that'd be it.

Maybe you guys just join game types that are more attractive to obnoxious faggots?

I mean my knowledge of the platform is limited but I'm sure there are options for all your basic CTF/DM/CP sort of thing and maybe Vampiro's just off playing Oddball or god knows what

Kinda like GFF, that is.

You said you get complete silence whenever you play but you also said that "whenever anyone tries to ask a question they get complete silence".

I'm not sure I'm following you, son.

Regular team death match here. Like I said, for the two last CoD games Hardcore tends to attract assholes. Regular, not as much. But Halo's a completely different story. Idiots seem to be unavoidable.

You quoted the post where I said time doesn't explain it. I'm as likely to run into an asshole any time of the day (and have!) but I typically don't.

See, Halo is full of people who still drool on themselves.

I've yet to run into one of these people while playing Quantum Of Solace or Left 4 Dead (though I suspect Ill run across them on L4D soon)

Who would have thought, amongst all the no people you'd find playing Quantum of Solace online there would also be no idiots. If you try playing games that more than handful of people might be playing online you'll quickly meet more than a few morons. And it's nothing to do with the genre of game it is, unless you consider 'popular' to be a genre.

And before you try to make the claim that L4D is popular, yes it is... on the PC. Given Valve's very obvious lack of caring for the 360 (hello TF2) I doubt there's that many L4D 360 players, and certainly not randoms.

I tend to play Halo in a party or private chat so you don't have to listen to anyone else. I also tend to mute anyone with a high pitched voice directly from the lobby, to save having to do it during the match when they start screaming.

You get virtually no screaming or sweary people in Rainbow vs battles and literally none in co-op which is probably what I play most of online. I think it is generally only whatever the game de jour that attracts the screaming kids, mainly because they don't have the spare cash to buy a lot of games so they only get the most popular ones and trade in for the next big thing when it comes along.

Even in games where you do get a bunch of Septics calling everyone a nigger, just mute em, leave negative feedback and move on to the next game.

Thats funny! I've never once had a problem finding people playing QoS!

Maybe its just you! :D

OP and Skills have special filters set that only allow people with more than 35,000 gamerpoints to join their matches, hence the preponderance of annoying people and the lack of anyone playing anything other than Call of Duty or Gears of War.

Of course, I happen to have played a lot of games on my Xbox, this must make me an idiot. Thanks for that sly dig Shin. And I'm not suggesting that there aren't plenty of sane people on Xbox Live, there are quite a few. In fact I've got playing with and chatting to some really nice people on there in various games. However, there's also a lot of idiots that scream, sing, talk nonsense, hurl random abuse, etc, etc. The fact you talk about having to mute a lot of people would seem to confirm that.

I will agree that straight co-op modes seem to produce a lot less random screaming/nonsense-talking than versus modes. But really, I don't see how you guys are claiming that there aren't a load of idiots on Xbox Live (or any element of the Internet really, I mean just look at the shit that has been happening in Sony's Home).

Oh no, I'm not disagreeing with you at all, the internet is chock full of wankers. I do find they gravitate to the more popular games of the time though and was making a slightly digging reference to the fact that it's likely that you and Skills will be playing whatever that happens to be at any given time (Because you play a lot of games and all).