Warner has gone Blu-Ray Exclusive, HD-DVD owners enjoy anal sex. More at 11.
 

So, yeah. Warner has completely screwed all the people who went HD and supported them (Let's face it: Warner gave us tons of exclusives, only to screw us over.)

As much as I hate to say it, this may have killed HD-DVD. I was really expecting them to go HD exclusive too, with all their exclusives and Blu-Ray packaging fuckups (HP and Blade Runner box set fuckups with HD discs instead of BD's) Just to give you an idea, my HD selection is comprised of 24 movies, 15 of which are Warner flicks (A good number of those are HD exclusives such as Batman, The Matrix movies, and V for Vendetta.)

As a STAUNCH HD supporter, I hate having to think about buying a Blu-Ray player in the future. I hate everything about Blu-Ray: The ugly-ass blue packaging, the dumb name, Sony, the fuckup that is the PS3, the inferior features (Until a month ago or so), region protection bullshit, and stupid minimum requirements for players (Cheap BD players may not be able to decode Dolby TrueHD OR Dolby Digital Plus. There's no requirement. Want internet support? Not required either.)

While this could be used by me as an excuse to finally buy a damn PS3, there's a problem: Not only are there only 4 games I want for the PS3 (5 if you include my minor interest in The Eye of Judgement. And no, this number does not include future "Whenever the fuck they come out" games like MGS4), but I'm still pissed about the nerf of backwards compatibility in the cheapest PS3. I would have fucking bought a $400 PS3 if it had backwards compatibility, but NOOOOO, Sony gotta cut that shit. Here's Spider-Man for your screwing!

Anyway, whatever. Here's hoping for a ton of awesome HD sales soon to beef up my collection. Even if the format is "dying", these flicks are still in HD, and I'm sure they'll either have cheap full-featured players later this year (My current player is the 360 addon, which is great for my current situation, but I want a better featured player later down the road.)

This is why I stick with DVDs. A lot less bullshit involved.

When they make up their mind about which format to use and actually have players that work properly, it would be a good idea to change to this new "hd" era.

Also when the movies aren't $100 per disc.

I'll just wait for the TeraDisc DVD before I jump into the retarded format war. Seriously this war is very retarded and probably in 10 years or so formats will be a moot point thanks to downloads. Another thing I hate is the idea of replacing my collection with higher resolution and 'better' quality versions.

*shrugs* I haven't replaced anything in my collection except Blade Runner (and I'd have gotten that collection even if it wasn't blu-ray). New movies, if they're available in blu ray I grab them. Because The Fountain in 1080p is fucking awesome. I don't see the point in getting retarded over it with semantics.

Meh, I just think it sucks that there was a format war in general. I'm glad I didn't pony up for any of it yet, mostly because I knew one of the formats would flounder, and also because I don't have an HDTV yet. The whole thing is useless in my eyes. DVDs are fine for me, plus, considering the enormous collection I've amassed, I'm not looking to stop collecting them anytime soon.

My prediction - DVD will still be popular in 5 years, and by then, digital distribution will become a major contender in home entertainment.

"Here comes high definition! It'll be amazing to see all the detail in great movies!"
"Haha, I have an idea!"
"TELL ME BOB"
"Lets make it even harder for HD to take off, we'll confuse consumers with two different HD formats!"
"... That's a great idea! Nobody will know what's going on! We could be like.. hey mr. average consumer, do you like MOVIES?! And they'd be all DO I! Then we could tell them about the wonders of high definition movies to get them hyped up"
"YES YES"
"And then blindfold them and ask them to pick a box, one will have a Blu-Ray player in it, the other, a HD-DVD player.. and when they choose we could go SURPRISE, NOW YOU'RE LIMITED TO WHICH MOVIES YOU CAN WATCH! HAUAUHUAHUAUHAHUWUHAUHUHA"
"Haha I'd spit all over their face while laughing! I'd make sure to have eaten a whole box of Oreos so that my saliva is chunky!"
"You two wankers are fucking fired"
"WHY?!"

Of course a way to circumvent this bullshit is to get a HD-DVD and Blu-Ray compatible player.

Those things are still pretty damn expensive. Like $800 expensive.

And I don't understand why everybody thinks digital distribution is the future. A lot of people, myself included, like having a physical product to purchase.

Perhaps when solid state HDD's get to the terabyte range and aren't anally-raping expensive things might get better, but until then, solid discs are the winner.

Of course, holographic discs might blow everything away in the future anyway. Entire TV seasons in HD on one disc, and later, entire SERIES. But that's like 10 years away.

So now that blu-ray's features are more competitive with those offered by hd-dvd, the other clear advantages that the blu-ray format has over hd-dvd, such as greater disc capacity {50 gig for blu-ray, 30 gig for hd-dvd} and greater bandwidth {48 mbit/s blu-ray, 30 mbit/s hd-dvd}, should bring you happily over to their side, right? You bring up a point about the audio standards on the players, but what point is it to have mandatory HD audio support on your player, when your flagship title doesn't feature HD audio. I mean correct me if I'm wrong, but Transformers didn't feature a lossless audio track due to space limitations, right?

It's just that hd-dvd was basically a half step forward from the standard dvd. The look and sound of pretty good, and whatnot.

WUT.

You obviously didn't hear about triple layer HD-DVDs, which do 51gb.

And Transformers is simply because they didn't want to. They had nearly all the special features in HD instead. The DD+ track is excellent.

And bandwidth? Both formats do full 1080p with lossless sound, and HD-DVD had been doing HDi features much earlier than Blu-Ray got their competition working.

So yeah, what improvements were that again?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._Albertson.png

That's a great SlayerX impression you do.

Last I heard, they were having some trouble getting that to actually work in the players that were already on the market.

Transformers is already two disc release. Why not just have the movie, and a lossless audio track on the first disc, while putting all special features on the second disc? Or wait, wasn't the only thing on the first disc, other than the movie, the behind the scenes picture in picture stuff? So they just randomly decided to not have a lossless audio track? The DD+ track might sound excellent, but it is not perfect. The look and sound of perfect, except sometimes when we chose not to, not because of inability to fit it on the smaller disc, but because we totally didn't want to man.

I've seen several of my blu-rays go above 40 mbit/s during movies, and many of them consistently pass the 30 mbit/s that hd-dvd maxes out at. The fact is that more data being passed to the screen and audio receiver means greater level of detail {sharper picture}. Are you cool with being able to pass less data to your screen and audio receiver?

And yes, hd-dvd did their HDi stuff before blu-ray did their bd-j stuff. There is no arguing with that. I don't see why it matters, now that both are in place, which one came first though. But hey, now that it is in place for blu-ray, expect to see Batman Begins in a blue case right around the time that The Dark Knight hits theatres. Since that was the only thing keeping them from releasing that on blu-ray to begin with. That would be happening regardless of the Warner announcement.

I love my collection of DVDs and vastly prefer physical copies over digital ones. However, if the future consists of companies making things harder for the consumer, I don't see why digital distribution wouldn't atleast gain foothold. Right now its in its infancy, but when we're all given access to higher bandwidth and more storage, it will come down to clicking a link, and having an HD-quality movie on your desktop in minutes. Couple that with the increasing number of ways to stream said videos to your TV, and you have a pretty easy, cost-effective alternative.

Some people (not folks like you and I) just like to have the movie and don't care about the special features or any of that stuff. If I were to estimate, I'd say those people are, if anything, more numerous than the people who like tons of special features. They will be the ones to hop on the digital distribution bandwagon over guys like us, and I'll wager to bet that within 10 years, playing movies on physical copies will be like playing music on records - Better quality, 1337, but not as practical.

That may be the case with Transformers, but Batman Begins is just as long and has an in-movie experience, Dolby TrueHD, and ALL of it's special features all on one disc, and Batman is one of the best looking HD-DVD's around. Granted, the special features aren't all in HD, but it's obvious the only reason Transformers doesn't have TrueHD is because Paramount didn't put it there.

And I haven't heard of a single reviewer actually say Blu-Ray releases look better than HD-DVD, bandwidth be damned.

And Blu-Ray massively outsells HD-DVD. And studios are already deciding which format they want to work with. So really, there are upsides and downsides to both formats, but it's going to be decided by who supports which format, and frankly, with groups like Tartan and Warner going Blu-Ray exclusive, it's looking like the industry is leaning in a certain direction.

Also, you missed the biggest reason why HD should win, you putz. Michael Bay says Blu Ray suits his films better. God knows it makes me consider HD-DVD a little more if it would piss off Michael Bay.

Seriously, though. Fanboyism. Knock it the fuck off.

Well, actually...

Format War: Blu-ray Outsells HD DVD Nearly 2-to-1 in US

Well, actually...

Alright, you missed my point.

Haha. No matter where I go to read about this, there's so much bitter tears involved with Warners move. It's a good move. And hopefully everyone else follows so that the whole split between the two formats can come to a rest and not confuse the consumer any longer. Sorry HD-DVD people. The gauntlet has been dropped. This is why it's best to wait for a clear answer in the end. And we all know now that Blu Ray will be leading the hd format war of movies. As for digitial distribution...

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c1...eed_gra416.gif

The US is in no way or shape ready for it. Have fun waiting for another 10 years for it to become a mainstream reality.

Um, all the facts pointed to an HD-DVD win. The only reason Sony is "winning" is because they like to hand out lots of moneyhats.

Ooookay buddy. Blu Ray has been outselling HD DVD 2:1 for quite some time. And what facts are you talking about? You're just mad because you're a Sony hater. It's way to obvious you want to see the company fail. As do many others. But suck it up and take a rest. Blu Ray's here to stay. After May, we'll be seeing the rest of the studios fully support Blu Ray and DVD.

Hah, this dude is talking about moneyhats after the hd-dvd group ponied up $150 million for Paramount's exclusivity.

And what so called facts are you speaking of? The fact that there was not one single week during 2007 during which hd-dvd outsold blu-ray? Looks like a win for hd-dvd there. Hd-dvd didn't outsell blu-ray during Transformers week, or during Bourne week.

Can we please not turn this into a Sony vs Microsoft battle? LESS fanboyism, not more.

When did Microsoft enter this argument? You're the first guy who mentioned that company. CONGRATULATIONS YOU JUST RUINED THE THREAD

Keep in mind that CES is going on today and Sony and Microsoft have their keynotes. Curious to see if either of them talk about the Warner merger and the HD formats.

HD-DVD reached 750,000 players sold. The State Of HD DVD: The State of HD DVD

HD-DVD standalone players outsold Blu. HD DVD players lead in HD sales - DVDTOWN.com

And there was a LOT of rumormongering that at CES, Warner was gonna go HD exclusive and Fox was gonna go neutral. Thank goodness Sony swooped in with their moneyhats and put a stop to all that nonsense.

And I certainly don't hate Sony. I have over 100 PS2 titles, more than I own for any other system. I just feel kinda kicked in the balls when they seem to claim that all those titles I bought earlier aren't worth playing in their precious PS3, as evidenced by the slow removal of backwards compatibility from their consoles.

(BTW, the word is that Warner costed over $600 million to grab for Blu. So yeah, that's one hell of a moneyhat.)

Fuck! I knew I was falling for a trick. Extrapolating from an argument makes an extra out of you, and lating out of me. Or something.

It think it started at the very beginning. Read again carefully what he wrote. If he's into movies, he doesn't have to buy a PS3. And yet he had to mention it. So who's really to blame here?

Blu-ray standalones cost just as much as a damn PS3. It simply would be STUPID to not buy one.

And I just found this tidbit (Spider-Man 3 swings strong sales - 11/2/2007 - Video Business)

Transformers BROKE SALES RECORDS FOR HD (HDDVD.com - Your HD DVD Resource » Blog Archive » Transformers Sets HD Sales Record) and still beat Spider-Man 3 two weeks later (Spider-Man 3 swings strong sales - 11/2/2007 - Video Business)

Roll-fucking-eyes. It's clear that you hold a bias against either Blu-ray or Sony, or probably both. I mean, look at the reasons you listed for 'hating' an information storage medium. Dumb name? Dumb packaging? Hate the PS3? Holy shit, could you find something more irrelevant? The only semi-valid reason you listed is region protection, though even that is not going to affect more a tiny fraction of customers.

And please stop using the word 'moneyhats' to criticise a corporation if you want anyone to take you seriously.

If your spin cycle is set to "desperation"...I think you better quit while you're ahead.

Please tell me I don't need to explain to you the concept of one movie vs all movies in terms of sales. Please.

Um, having crappy player requirements isn't a reason to dislike Blu-Ray? And most of that was a rant I wrote at 3 in the morning after the internet declares a winner is Blu-ray.

So in conclusion, JasonTerminator, as an HD-DVD owner, enjoys anal sex.

Did anyone mention that New Line also became Blu-ray exclusive?

Lots of misinformation in this thread. How many of you have actually had experience with both formats, with real HD equipment? Doesn't sound like too many.

Although I have plenty of releases from both parties, I prefer HD-DVD.

http://isaf.sitesled.com/CIMG0683.JPG

Let me correct some of the misconceptions regarding Blu-ray.

1. Blu-ray is better because it has a higher peak bitrate.

Incorrect. This is only relevant in regards to MPEG-2 transfers, which require a high bitrate for quality transfers. The main reason why Blu-ray has a higher peak bitrate is that the media was originally designed for MPEG-2, so it was mandatory for the spec. However, in light of advanced and highly efficient codecs such as VC-1 and AVC, this peak bitrate is unnecessary. Some releases such as F4: ROTSS have video bitrates that peak higher than the HD-DVD spec, so theoretically, the BD version would look superior. However, my opinion is that BD's bitrate simply allows the studios to encode their transfers in a more relaxed fashion, meaning less effort and reliance on advanced compression techniques to ensure a top quality transfer...but ultimately, you would get a transfer that would look identical on both formats due to how flexible the next-generation codecs are.

Also, let's keep in mind that a majority of films released in both formats have been far superior on the HD-DVD format. One particular example is Silent Hill, which was a considerable disaster in light of the superior transfer offered by the overseas German release on HD-DVD. Silent Hill on Blu-ray was encoded in MPEG-2, while the HD-DVD version was encoded in VC-1. Even with BD's high bitrate, Silent Hill's transfer was dissapointing, with some very obvious noise in scenes. The German release was far superior, with no such deficiencies. So ultimately, it's really all about the efficiency of the codec, not the bitrate capability. And the HD-DVD format has used the best codecs since day one.

2. The audio on Blu-ray is always better because there is usually some form of lossless track.

Incorrect. Although most titles have PCM tracks, few of the tracks represent the original masters. This is because a large percentage of these tracks have been downgraded from 24-bit to 16-bit, which is arguably much more damaging than creating a lossy version of a 24-bit track. When you degrade the bit-depth of a track, we're talking about losses not only in dynamic range (which is the most noticeable side effect of basic compression), but changes in the actual fidelity of the audio...bass that isn't as tight, highs that aren't as clean...etc. So when you look at the back of a Blu-ray case and it says "lossless" it isn't lying to you...but keep in mind that it isn't the best audio track possible either. I guess you could consider most of the PCM tracks on Blu-ray to be .wav files compressed into a high-quality .mpc, then re-encoded back into a lossless format...but that would be a gross exaggeration, since let's face it...the PCM tracks still sound very good. However, only a small percentage of them are indeed the cream of the crop...which are only on a handful of titles, most of them by Disney, such as the POTC discs, which are all 24-bit/48kHz, and are identical to the original masters. Although a 16-bit master sometimes is the best you will get, since the master was originally 16-bit to begin with, such as Spider-Man 1.

Also, it is inappropriate to call audio on releases such as Transformers to be a dissapointment, just because it isn't a lossless track. There's what I said before, about how a 24-bit/48kHz track compressed into 1.5mbps would sound potentially better than a lossless track created from a 16-bit version. But you simply don't know unless you are the actual person doing the sound mix. In many cases, 1.5mbps is absolutely indistinguishable from the original master, which is why many releases simply do not bother with a lossless track. Although in Transformer's case, I think it could have been an excuse for them to release another version with a lossless track whenever the sequel rolls around. Ultimately, anything at or over 1.5mbps should be considered "HD" audio...although the correct term should be high-fidelity, since HD is more of a video term. It is, afterall, more than twice the bitrate of the standard DD peak of 640kbps.

I actually just came back from Joke Buy with three BDs for $27:

http://isaf.sitesled.com/CIMG0684.JPG

I'm not sure if I want to keep them, since the blue cases really do seem juvenile, especially for catalog releases.

Who said receiving, buddy?

Doesn't HD-DVD use a superior video codec? I heard much talk (several months ago) about how the Blu-ray was inferior in video quality because of this. Has this changed?

Additional Spam:
Shit, I posted before Megalith's post appeared here. What he said.

Uh, well, you just did.

Meanwhile, back in casual land, those people could care less about those specs you mentioned. It's what movies go to where that will get noticed along with large amount of advertisements that go with it. "Only on Blu Ray". It's better this way weither you like one format or the other. With studios going over to to one format, it adds less to the confusion and more price drops for future investments. By April we'll be seeing stand alone Blu Ray players as low as $349. By the end of May we just might be seeing Paramount and Universal switch over to Blu Ray.

Additional Spam:
This should help you out between the two.

Blu-ray vs HD DVD: State of the Division - Engadget

The difference is the support from studios. There are less studios supporting HD DVD. Warner being the latest to switch over along with New Line.

I forgot...HD-DVD still has this to be excited about:

YouTube Video

Alright, HD-DVD wins the internet.

I've been on the line for a while now about whether or not I'm going to purchase a PS3 or 360 once money magically falls out of the sky, but it seems that Warner has finally made the decision for me (Well, that and the fact that the whole PSP connectivity thing seems pretty sweet). I jumped into the HD fray last November when Walmart had the $99 Toshiba sale. Since then, I have built up a collection of fifteen HD DVDs through Christmas gifts and my own purchases (I'm still waiting on my five free movies Toshiba :argh:.) Twelve of these are Warner Brothers releases.

I've grown to detest the Blu Ray camp over the last year or so due to their unbridled arrogance and the fact that most PS3 owners seem to think the type of DVD you watch sets the stage for some sort of dick-slapping contest. It's seems I'm not really going to have much of a choice though if I want to continue enjoying my movies in glorious 720p with stereo sound (I'm a bottom of the line HD consumer, shut up.)

Also, why is Megalith the only person in the world besides me who thinks HD DVD cases look sleek and professional while Blu Ray cases look like ass. Yeah yeah it's the movie that matters and all that. SHIT LOOKS LIKE ASS.

Um, I said that in the first post of the thread.

Yeah, WTF Blu-Ray.

So the look of a case should justifty a consumers purchase? :rolleyes: Thank god you're the minority.

It's weird, but the Flyboys case is royal blue, unlike every other release:

http://era-hd.ru/upimg/large/1162.jpg

Much more tolerable than the standard bright blue BD case. Hopefully someone will start selling the darker ones seperately.

Hey, XBox games are bright green (look at the bottom rung of Megalith's shelf). Building up a tolerance should be a piece of cake.

why the fuck does he persist in posting all of this technical information on a forum that is clearly uninterested in AV discussions? gamingforce is simply not an AV forum. honestly, no ones here gives two shits, and quite frankly, it's embarrassing to watch him continually humiliate himself by spewing such technical mumbo-jumbo. it's akin to pissing in the wind, or discussing quantum string theory with the fuckin' amish.

therefore, i can logically deduce he's already been banned from AVS forums? typical.

anyway, warner choosing to support blu-ray is unfortunate, but i, like many others, are ready for the format war to be over. ultimately, future blu-ray releases will be bit-for-bit identical in A/V to their hd-dvd counterparts -- considering sony has finally wised up and adopted the next-gen codecs -- so the entire discussion of the superiority of one format over the other is really a moot point.

both mediums are more or less identical, and so are the players. the exact same blue spectrum technology is utilized in hd-dvd and blu-ray. same technology, different brand names. now that the codecs are in place, all that's relevant at this point is stuido support, as someone with a brain already pointed out in this thread. and based on the latest developments, blu-ray WILL win now.

call it.

What the fucking Christ people? you're arguing about case color? You make my balls hurt. seriously.

Um, region coding? Player requirements?

Player requirements - that´s a problem of player manufacturers, isn´t it? I as a consumer require it to play what is on the disc, whatever it takes to do so. ^^

Also both systems support region coding - are there examples of different region locks in HD and BR releases?

HD-DVD doesn't have region coding.

HD-DVD has more minimum requirements for manufacturing a HD-DVD player. In other words, cheaper HD-DVD players are guaranteed to come with more features.

God, just stop already. Please. This is a pointless discussion that's come down to nothing but fanboyism and griping.

Agreed. The Warner merger is quite the obvious sign of who's going to win. By the end of May, we'll see what happens as a whole and more than likely, we'll hear more and more bitching and moaning from the HD DVD camp. I'm still waiting on investing on either side until a very clear winner is picked. So far, Blu Ray is looking like the chosen winner and it looks to continue to be so.

I love how you agree with the man, and then continue to be a fanboy.

Actually, he stated he hasn't picked a side yet. It's in there. In the middle. But my point is, we're rehashing the same arguments over and over again. Nothing new has been said in a long while, here.

His wording of his opinion on the situation is hardly neutral.

But yes, this bickering is pointless.

It's too bad that outputting 1080p is not one of the minimum requirements for an hd-dvd player.

As far as I know, it isn't one for Blu-ray either, so it's just a matter of time.

Are you even reading your own posts? I don't own either HD players as I'm living in a dorm room right now with no room for a decent TV, but it seems like Blu-Ray is definitely the favored media right now. As he is able to recognize that Warner's committing to Blu-Ray is an indication of the devices rising strength, kainlightwind is without a doubt a fanboy.

My black pot and kettle sensors are off the charts right now. I have seen surprisingly little fanboyism in this thread except for your starting post complaining about Blu-Ray because you don't like the PS3, although that was good for a chuckle.

I always thought it was pretty clear one form of the media would win out over the other by being the first to buy commitments from the majority of major studios. It looks like Sony was more willing to lay down the money than Toshiba. Complaining because you bought a player with a very uncertain future is awfully silly.

A picture is worth a thousand words. Pic of the CES convention:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c1..._dvd_war_2.jpg

Additional Spam:
It's nice to want things, isn't it? ;)

I'm sure BluRayFreak has the least possibly out of context pictures around.

So lemme get this straight. Kain defends Blu-ray, he's not a fanboy. I defend HD-DVD, I am a fanboy?

i have defended hd-dvd since the beginning of the format war, and i still support hd-dvd over blu-ray, but it's time to accept the reality. all major electronic publications are reporting the same news, and toshiba's corporate damage control has been dismal at best. the hd-dvd is not even attempting to comeback from an obvious death-blow, so that in itself is telling enough.

blu-ray won this time. it's over.

PS- thread needs to be closed. most of it being inaccurate/misleading information.

Sounds good to me.