So Germany's Gonna Ban Scientology
 

news story to confirm I'm not making this shit up

The question is should they? Freedom of speech and religion is something that at least Americans hold dear, and moves to ban an ideology can leave a bad taste.


As far as I'm concerned, so long as the "banning" doesn't equate to a free speech violation and only bars Scientology from being recognized as a religion then I'm all for it. Scientology is basically a scam anyways, and our decision to recognize it in the 90's has definitely been one of the most retarded.

It's like Mormonism, only they didn't have time to make their own state.

Also talk about how much you hate Scientology if you're so inclined.

If it was really a religion, I'd be opposed. But it's not. It's a typical pyramid scheme scam advertised by a bunch of celebrities. Mormons don't require financial contributions to get in or learn the rules of their religion.

Joseph Smith was like the L. Ron Hubbard of his day, though. Hieing to Kolob and all.

I've tried learning about it but I still don't know the fuck scientology is.

I'm also assuming that Germany isn't as liberal as we are in the states when it comes to religion. Just about anything can qualify as a religion here, especially in Hollywood. Man, when I used to live there it was insane how many times I'd drive by some pop up stand religion that I'd never heard of. They were as frequent as taco trucks.

Especially considering the fact that the U.S. government knew just what Scientology was capable of doing and willing to do.

I don't think it'd be that bad if we had a Scientology Holocaust. We'd be rid of a lot of terrible actors.

That being said, I agree that there shouldn't be a "buy-in" requirement for any religion to be considered a legitimate member, and I commend the German government for being not as stupid as the rest of the world that acknowledges Scientology.

I doubt that they're going to kick people out of the country or anything, but lack of recognition is more than enough. I doubt it'll do anything to make the Scientologists any less crazy though.

It should be noted that the Germans aren't considering a ban on Scientology because of the religion, but for the reasons that Styphon has pointed out.

Essentially, they cover their asses by stealing government documents in order to commit tax evasion (all the while living luxuriously off the fees that their congregations pay to them).

Sounds pretty awesome.

German Constitution wouldn't even allow a ban based on religious reasons, that should be made clear right here. The freedom of religion is an extremely high value in this country.

I don't know what to think about this. I don't really care about it, most honestly. And I don't really know whether they do care because Germany is just one country out of many and as long as they're allowed to do business in the United States, there shouldn't really be a problem for them.

honestly though banning mormonism back in that day would not be objectionable to me.

These days Mormons are just christians who had the turn of fortune to be descendants of those gullable saps. The only reason they don't convert to catholicism or baptism or something is because Grandma would be so pissed.

prove me wrong!

YouTube Video

not basically Christian in any way

Oh but they do care. See, Germany is a First World nation, so their reviewing over whether Scientology should be banned creates bad press for Scientologists. They have the most gigantic victim mentality in the history of forever, and enough money to sue the pants off of anybody who even so much as mentions it.

It also creates the additional worry that should Germany follow through and ban Scientology, other countries would follow suit and pursue legal action.

Belgium, for example, is heading in the same direction as Germany.

Good for them. Too bad a ban like that wouldn't work in the United States. The whole evidence about the subversion of the state was probably the last straw for the Germans.

"I know I as a finite being can't become an infinite being. It's a logical fallacy."

Why is that the best line of the entire video.

Plus also it's basically true.

Well, it's got a good amount of half-truths, I'll give it that.

Does this make Germany fair game? Because I can totally see Sea Org landing an invasion force in Kiel.

Scientology is less a religion than a pyramid scheme that suckers people who don't know any better in using glorified multimeters. I can't say that I'd be too broken up if they get shut down.

I thought that only the US and Australia recognized Scientology in the first place. What's the difference between before and now?

Except that it's filled with good, old-fashioned Christian moralizing. "They teach that Joseph Smith did more for us than any other man... even more than Jesus!?"

Still, why wouldn't "Elohim"'s name by Yahweh, as it is in the Old Testament?

Despite what you and Starman may think, there's no way to make Mormonism sound less crazy. Sorry fellas. :(

Whoa, that video was kind of fascinating.

I'd really like a Mormon's opinion on it--obviously it has an agenda, but how much of it is true?

I guess we just find it humorous to hear Christians making shit like this, as if their religion wasn't just as fantastical.

And that's not even true. The quote actually comes from John Taylor, not Smith, and they omitted a "save Jesus only" between "more" and "for."

I think it's something along the lines of, in the original Hebrew, Elohim referring to God and Yahweh/Jehovah actually referring to Christ, at least from a Mormon perspective.

And you've got one's. It's pretty much half-truths mixed with flat-out lies, the only completely true part being from 3:38-4:32 about the Book of Mormon. I could go through every other comment and point out how it's at least not accurate if not pure crap, but most notable is the sci-fi stuff (lol "Starbase" Kolob) and anything elevating Smith above the position of a prophet like Moses, Noah, etc.

No, it's really not. The idea of God in Christian mythology is much more vague and beyond perception than Mormon Jesus from Kolob.

At the very least Christianity did not practice institutional racism. Of course, the Mormons stopped that once the President had a visitation telling him it was ok for blacks to be priests. After centuries of protestant development, Joseph Smith starts a cult about Space Jesus that sets up a new pope.

Elohim is the Hebrew word that is translated into "God" in the English Bible. It's a valid, if unspecific name.

YHWH is translated into "the LORD", even though it's not what it means. Ancient Jews, paranoid about pronouncing the holy name, instead said "Adonai", which is the actual Hebrew word for "lord". To help remind themselves of this, they wrote "YHWH" with "Adonai"'s vowels. Early Bible scholars misunderstood the purpose of this and read it as "Iehovah".

This is all moot in this case, since Mormons do believe that Jehovah is pre-human Jesus Christ and Elohim as God.

You'll find that the majority of Mormons don't even know their own beliefs, and many have yet to read any of their church's other literature (spoken straight from the mouths of their so-called prophets) other than this oh-so-fantastical Book of Mormon.

And that line has nothing to do with the quote from John Taylor, but it has more to do with Smith's own declaration that he was greater than Jesus:
And of course there is plenty more to be had just like this, but don't waste your time on these idiots, they are so far brainwashed that it wouldn't matter what you tell or show them.

They'll probably spout some bullshit like the words of the living prophet are more important than the words of a dead prophet. Their so-called god has a hell of a time making up his mind, seeing as they keep changing things around. That is hardly perfect at all. Fuck Mormonism.


And a side topic, I find that the South Park episodes dealing with these two so-called religions are pretty much spot on. There's no hidden bullshit that you have to sift through or listen to.

I have read said literature, and am fully aware that Smith wasn't perfect. Furthermore, your source is like asking a Chevy dealer about a Ford.

Anyways thanks for storming in here touting your massive hate-boner; your contribution has been noted.

Segregation is intitutional racism last I checked, and I know plenty of Christian churches that still practice it.

Was it racism when God only granted the Levites the priesthood?

This may sound strange, but I was under the impression that this was a thread about Scientology, not Mormonism.

I went to a scientology church to do their test.... Wow! What a horrible religion, they pressure you to give them money and to answer the questions in the way they want you too. They want to make you think that you absolutely need to join their religion because you are weak. So if germany wants to ban them... I don't blame em!

I look at Scientology as a form of comedy rather then a religion because watching celebrities dish in money for it is just plain hilarious

That may be because they have millions of dollars, but think of all poor and weak people around that scientology abuse (telling them that they need scientology to improve their weak and useless selves) and then force to pay huge amounts of money they don't have. Scientology is a money machine, and if anyone tells it in public they'll sue and harass them to get rid of the opposition. That about Xenu may be damn fun and hilarious, but the whole organization is scarier than that if you read into it. I totally support banning Scientology as it is not a religion and it should be obvious with all the evidence there is against it.

I'm guessing most of you have been on xenu.net before, but if you haven't check it out.

In Britain at least, there are certain tax breaks available for religious buildings and ministers, I imagine the same is true in Germany. By not recognising Scientology as a religion they are being denied those tax breaks (Rightly so). There have been some calls for it to be banned as a cult over here too along with that Kabbalah crap but then most of our politicians are Masons or Opus Dei so Scientology has never been hugely popular with the powers that be.