You Can't Make This Shit Up
 

YouTube Video

Veteran Removes Illegal Mexican Flag, May Be Charged
In fact, it's not illegal. Flag laws codify flag etiquette, but they can't be enforced without violating the Constitution, and don't even clarify penalties for violating the codes.

Well, crap, Brady made the post I was going to make before I even read the thread.

I respect what the guy did and all, but unfortunately the law's not on his side for this one. Even if it WAS we have a system for justice, not vigilante justice.

Never actually read all the way through the flag code.

But what other trunks could Rocky have worn? :(

You say pro choice, I say pro-flag burning.

I'll never understand why people make such a fuss over a piece of fabric.

Um, i'm for my country and all, but is it really that big of a deal? Nevermind the fact it is or isn't illegal, I just think it's pointless to get so angry over which flag is on top. Obviously, the person who had both flags loved America and his nationality, Mexico. He was giving props to both, but one dude gets personally hurt because the Mexican flag touches the sky higher than the American flag. I just...don't get it.

This is why certain people abuse the term "unpatriotic." Now, notice, neither of you say you disagree with the view, you just say you don't understand it.

It's pretty simple. A country's flag represents said country, this is the reason flag-burning is such a strong form of protest, you're saying, "What this country is doing is so awful I'm going to let them up." If someone destroyed an object that held sentimental value for you with the knowledge that you held it in such high regard you would, doubtless, be upset.

Well, it is assumed that one's flag holds that kind of value for every citizen, and it's assumed by a great many more that such value is instilled in every generation.

I'm not commenting one way or another on what I think of this (or US Flag boxers), but you should at least understand how important the flag is to some people, and why they'll go to such lengths.

Johnny Cash's take.

I misspoke. I completely understand the reason and sentimentality behind this, I just disagree with it.

I'm glad Brady cleared up the law because I was about to ask how Olympic ceremonies in the US are meant to go if this was the case.

hottie in a stars and stripes bikini: patriotic
fat hairy dude in a stars and stripes speedo: arrested immediately

Are you objecting to this? I didn't know you were gay russ.

Here in canada, we believe in equal rights. Noone would have gone tearing down another man's home flag. Actually, some wigger probably would just to be an ass. But otherwise, as patriotic as we are, we still respect other's lineage.

I don't care if the owner isn't actually punishable, it's complete bullshit that he flew the Mexican flag above the American. Fly a home nation's flag below any other and you'll get this same reaction from somebody out there.

He needs to cough up the money for a second flagpole if he wants to show solidarity.

Pretty much.

I am in no way, shape, or form objecting to my specific example.

Well you've already stated that you agree the owner isn't punishable by any law, so why exactly does he need to buy another flag pole?

The fuck does this have to do with equal rights? Nobody saying he can't fly the Mexican flag. Nobody's saying he needs to GTFO&STFU. This isn't about his right to fly another nation's flag, it's about whether he should fly any flag above the Stars n' Bars.

Go look around Winnipeg and see how many flags are flying above the Maple Leaf, I doubt there are any.

Also, Canada is awesome, and even I shit candy when I was there.

Additional Spam:
I think he's merely stating his agreement with the posted flag ettiquete, and his belief that the owner of the liquor store should pony up the dough to pay the proper respect. Another addition: Canadian flag etiquette. I don't suppose anyone knows Mexico's national flag ettiquette?

EDIT: Fresh Frank has the right idea about what I'm saying.

I don't agree that nothing can be done to him, since I don't know the laws applying to infractions against proper flag usage. All I'm saying there is "in the event that nothing can be done to him..."

It should also be a given that my comment is opinionated and the use of "need" shouldn't be seen as "need, because his life/livelihood is at stake". But then again, if he continues to fly it below the Mexican flag, I wouldn't be surprised if the place becomes a target for vandalism.

Well, bottom line here, the vet both vandalized and stole the store owner's property. That store owner doesn't owe anybody jack squat.

Naw, I've seen other flags over the canadian flag all the time. Down in st boniface, the major french community in winnipeg here, you see the french flag over top the maple leaf all the time. I've never heard of anyone shitting bricks about it though. And there have been several other occasions where I've noticed another flag above the maple leaf on a pole.

He's not a goddamn hero for cutting the flag down and running with it, but what the owner did was ignorant, insulting and inflammatory. The vet's reaction, while not justified, is understandable.

Didn't mean to imply he did, or what the veteren did was legal/right. Just trying to help clarify the Generic Badass's comments. :/

And Smelnick? Well.. hell. Just one more way y'all up north are different.

I'd love to see the public reaction to someone hanging the Crescent and Star above the Stars and Stripes. To show solidarity with peaceful muslims of course.

To capo's comment. I'm pretty sure that flying the mexican flag above our own was disrespectful. I'm also pretty sure that eroding people's respect for their nation is not conducive to its survival.

What I also don't understand is why he chose the mexican flag as the particular medium for showing his solidarity with mexican immigrants. I mean, aren't they here to ultimately be a part of the U.S.? I mean, they all left Mexico. Why use that as the foundation of their unity, and then place it over their desired destination?

I'm more inclined to think he wanted to be an ass.

Oh PLEASE.

We invade another soverign nation on evidence we knew before the fact was false? Oops.
We abuse people's fear to take away the very liberties that are supposed to be the source of our greatness? Oh well, can't let those towelheads nuke my farm!
We violate decades of policy and countless international laws by torturing and holding indefinitely without charge prisoners both foreign and domestic? Lalala, I can't hear you.

But heaven forbid someone fly a piece of cloth above another piece of cloth. That erodes my respect for this nation!

Because since the first three do it so much more, the last doesn't do it at all? What, logic?

No, someone burning or raising a piece of cloth does not effect my respect for this nation. I judge the nation on its actions rather than its symbols.

Big things are made up of smaller things, Arainach. Nobody's comparing improper flag etiquette to torture, so don't you go discouting what that piece of cloth means.

Additional Spam:
And as the symbol of that nation, doesn't one's use and treatment of said "peice of cloth" mean something? Why the hell do you think people burn flags? Because they ran out of clean sheets?

I didn't realize we were talking about your respect for the nation, Arainach. I'm pretty sure that's been pretty well established anyway. What would be far more meaningful would be to talk about the people as a whole. I would say a significant portion of the population would be affected. Ergo and so forth.

I can also understand some domestic crimes because damnit that bitch was mouthin' off and needed a good shankin.

Some people being insulting and inflammatory, intentionally or not, is what people have to deal with in a free society. Whether or not the store owner intended to be an asshole is irrelevant, because how he arranges his property is his business and nobody else's.

People are free to take offense, they're not free to steal somebody else's property and violate their freedom of expression.

Aw man, Ice Burn. You totally got him there. :rolleyes:

Which is why I didn't say he had every right to take down the flag. I said he wasn't justified.

The problem with just writing this up as "racy free speech" is that there isn't a law that says I can't be a racist motherfucker, while there is a law that says I can't fly a national flag over another national flag, that I can't burn the flag unless the stars are cut off from the stripes, or whatever else. Punishable or not, the guy as a decent US citizen would want avoid breaking any sort of law.

So you're saying that we should all think of the store owner as a big fat jerk because he broke a law that if enforced would violate his Constitutional rights?

Do you think it's right to do anything as long as it's legal? =\

If you were mexican, or any other countrymen, why would you have another countries flag over yours?

Let me try to explain,

I don't think the shop owner was doing it to be an ass or try to make a "I hate US" statement. It just would not have felt right to him to have a flag over his home countys' flag. The vet's anger is perfectly understandable, though I think there could have been a better way to handle that.

Why wouldn't that be his stated reason then?

I'll have to agree with that as well. In Newfoundland I've seen plenty of homes fly the flag of their own country above the actual canadian flag. I'm not aware of anybody that has really took offence to it.

I know especially back home a lot of people fly their provincial flag over the canadian flag. In Newfoundland, quite a lot of people consider themselves a Newfoundlander first, and a Canadian afterwards.

By the way if someone could enlighten me, what are the flag rules in the US/Canada in terms of states/provinces, is it illegal to fly the flag of your state or province above the the flag of your present country.

In terms of this situation. I can understand why the veteran took offence to the flag of mexico being above the american flag. He is obviously very patriotic and very proud of the country that he lives in and he doesn't want to see anything undermine that fact.

Still what he did was wrong. Bradylama is right, he did vandalize someone's private property so that he can make a statement. Their probably could of been better ways that this situation could of been handled.

Its obvious that the store-owner takes a lot of pride of his heritage and that from his possible point of view and his stance on flags that he considers himself a mexican first and an american citizen afterwards.

You kind of have to ask yourself, is when you move from own country to another you have to try your best to respect the country you live in and what they're overall laws/beliefs and morals are. A lot of countries, probably all countries take their flag very seriously, so there has to be a bit of common sense to know that somebody will take offence if you put your own flag above that nations flag.

Personally I couldn't care what flag you put over the canadian flag, but that doesn't necessarily mean that nobody doesn't care about it. This person could of been unaware of the law, you never know.

I don't nescessarily mean to add fuel to the fire, but in terms of flag identity. I would like to pose this question mainly to the residents of North America. Do you consider yourself a citizen of your province/state first or your country.

In terms of people who had to move to another country, do you classify yourself as a citizen of the country your living in, or the country of your origin.

For me I've been living in Alberta for the last year, but I do not consider myself an Albertan. I'm a Newfoundlander first and a Canadian afterwards.

Maybe the guy was just unaware. But anyhow, what was the point of stealing the guys US flag and leaving him with his Mexican flag? If I were to have been the angry old vet, I would've taken away his Mexican flag and only left him to fly the proper one.

Hey, give Rip Van Winkle a break, he just woke up from a time before the Farm Worker's Union.

He's far from justified, Brady, but I can't bring myself to make fun of the man for having an infalted sense of patriotism.

Also, Angel, many, many people have already quoted from the US Flag Ettiquette, and I linked to the Canadian one. Check the first page for these things.

Frank has the right idea. This man is only trying to protect us from the commies in the school systems, infiltrating our precious bodily fluids.

This whole thing is so impossibly banal. "Crazy old man is senile, acts cantankerously and does stupid shit". WELL FUCK, THIS IS PRIME-TIME MATERIAL

He's a crazy old man. Crazy old men go to the nursing home. Then we can all root through his house for whatever other things he's stolen to protect the nation!

... or it could be foreigners disrespecting a country's hospitality and doing so unashamedly, in full view of the public.

It's not like the fella in the video responded to why he chose to fly the Mexican flag above the US one. Maybe we should come up with CRAZY OLD MAN ideas and go STEAL THINGS.

Well, I don't know. A flag should be and only be a symbol of a nation. For the people, damaging a flag is to disrespect the whole nation. Some fanatics could burn you alive for doing it. But not me.

I don't know about tearing a flag of another country's being a crime or not. But what I know is that in my country some years around my country's independence day, some Dutch raised their flag, and an immidiate action was taken, which was to bring the flag down, tear the blue part of their flag, and raised it again, this time representing my own country.

Some fanatics heh?

That sure is something you won't see over here...
But, that doesn't really count, we Germans have huge problems with German patriotism, so you'd probably be dubbed a Nazi if you, for example, did a similar thing to a Turkish guy flying the Turkish flag above the German one. It's possible though that we also have laws for that, but I see lots of places with lots of diffrent national flags over here, mixing it with the German one, or just leaving the German flag out.

Similarly, I know a lot of people who'd dub you a Nazi or at least nationalist fuck for flying the German flag...
So, coming from a country which kind of denies itself any kind of patriotism, I have a hard time understanding such reactions in other countries.

I bet he has a stash of "Disgruntled Negro" CDs. :tpg:

A lot of this angst is a culmination of many factors. First off the guy is a grizzled war vet, therefore inherently sensitive about this sort of thing. Second, Mexican arrogance is taking its toll on their own cause. Mexicans and their whole "La Raza" attitude preaches that a section of America belongs to them.

Everyone used to think that illegal immigration was just a California problem, then predominantly Spanish speaking communities started springing up in the heartland and even up into New England. Then we have federal judges who grant rights and privileges to illegals on the taxpayer dime. This isn't exactly softening people up to the concept of taking these people in with open arms.

I'l leave at that as I don't want to derail the thread, but given all these factors, you're going to get more expressions of backlash from more of middle America such as this and potentially more violent. Somehow I don't believe that a majority of Americans would find much fault with what this man did.

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Wrestling/Bios/konan.jpg

http://l.yimg.com/img.tv.yahoo.com/t...1116141723.jpg

Political bastards.

Most people probably wouldn't know what the crescent and star meant, and would probably blame communism... or mexicans.

This man is obviously a proud Scott, as can be seen by the plaid kilt he is wearing under his unzipped pants.

Well, from what it seems he was only defending his knowledge and action of the U.S. Constitution. I guess, in his mind, he was standing up for the Law of the Land.

Edit: Haha, nice picture Duo. Esa vato loco consuelo and such.