Ask a pianist.
 

Think we are just a bunch of weirdos who never leave our pretty Concert Hall hangout? Here's my chance to prove you wrong. Or not. If you have anything to ask a pianist, though, shoot away and I'll do my best to answer.

Why are you making more of these threads, Face? =/

Why not? It's certainly not any dumber than discussing some Sudanese's misadventures with a goat or recess card games. If/when this thread takes a bad turn, I'll be more than willing to terminate it.

What concerti have you learned? I personally have learned the Rach 2nd, Tchaik 1st, Beethoven 1st and am working on the Chopin 1st :D

Do you do Hanon finger exercises, Face?

Are Debussy's etudes really that difficult?

I'll answer for myself (I want to be loved :( ) but when you start off you should do finger exercises to train your technique, whether they be Hanon or Czerny or whatever. If your technique becomes sufficient then usually just by working on your pieces your technique is being trained.

I don't know if there is any real answer to that. If you were completely forced against your will then I don't know what to say, music like any art is only truly experienced by the willing.

Whats the best way to actually get better at reading notes? I just find them so damn hard to actually read and I've been playing for 5 years!

None yet. I don't intend to make a living as a soloist, but mostly as a teacher and accompanist / chamber musician..

I could definitely see myself learn some in the future, though. Stuff I want to play before I die includes the Henselt F minor, Moscheles G minor, Prokofiev 2nd, Rach 1. I'll probably end up learning a few Mozart ones on the way, but I can't say they're my main goal.
Not anymore. One of my former teachers made me practise those for two years and it did a lot more harm than good. I'm still trying to get rid of the bad habits I developped back then, and I haven't touched those exercises in three years.

I'm not *entirely* against the concept of technical studies and exercises, but come on. Hanon wasn't a composer himself, and he was probably one hell of a shitty pianist. Why would you want to play Hanon when you have actually useful exercises by Brahms, Dohnanyi and many others? Hanon is the seemingly easy way but I think it doesn't pay off.
I haven't played any of those myself. I know a couple girls who did, though, and they sure looked like they were having a hard time.

From the little I know, I'd rate them about the same level as Chopin Etudes. Takes some work, but it's nothing an somewhat advanced student can't tackle.
You know, it only took two years of that for me to lose mine. It wasn't until five years later that I finally started to play the piano again. Except it was by my own will and without anybody's encouragements.

What kind of music do you listen to? From what I've seen I assume VGM isn't quite at the bottom of your list, is it? Why not play some of the numerous VG piano collections available? That's how I got back into the thick of things myself, even though it's a phase I eventually grew out of. I'd say, just sit back at the piano and give a go at something you like. If you're not too easily frustrated, it can be a good idea to pick something challenging, if only to give you a reason to come back at the piano again the next day.

I'd say a teacher could help, too, but it really depends on you (and on the teacher). I was lucky enough to find a fantastic one three years ago, who made my love for music grow to heights beyond imagination.

That, or you could try something different. Why not play some jazz and learn to improvise, for example? Why not try a different instrument?
Sightread a lot, daily if possible. A teacher could help you develop it faster but it's essentially a matter of practise.

Set goals for yourself. Pick a piece you don't know, play it from beginning to end and try to stay in time no matter what. Then go through it again slowly and try to get all the notes right, taking all the time you need. Then play it one last time with the same rules as the first time, and see if you have improved any.

Many believe the key to sightreading is anticipation. It's true, but it's not just that. There are many things that can help you, such as knowing typical harmonic progressions, being able to spot intervals and chords without reading all the notes (for a run in thirds for example, just read the bottom note), knowing your key signatures, knowing your keyboard, etc. When you develop all these things, anticipation just comes naturally.

I realize none of this will actually help you better at reading notes, but to be honest, learning how NOT to read notes is a lot more efficient. There's a lot that can be guessed or figured out on sight (or by ear) without having to read everything. Study harmony if you get the chance, it's really a great help.

What's it called when you mash three fingers down on your piano keys and it sounds good and in tune?

Why, a perfect chord. Musical terms actually make sense sometimes!

What is, out of the pieces you've ever learned, your favorite piece? (That is, if you can even name a few as opposed to many.)

Chopin's Nocturne in C minor (Op. 48 No. 1). Something I'll remember and play all my life for sure.

Hmmm... probably either the Rach 2nd or the Chopin 3rd Sonata.

Double Post:
I love the prokofiev 2nd. Been working on the 1st movement quite a bit, got most of the 1st movement done. The cadenza is a beast and possible one of the biggest musical feats ever! Good luck with that, it's doable but will take LOTS of time.

The Rach 1 is such an underrated masterpiece... luckily this weekend I get to see it live :D

What's your favourite

Schubert
Haydn
Milhaud

piano literature?

On a related note to my previous question, what piece(s) do you aspire to play one day? Rather, what works--that you haven't already studied and played and practiced--make you enjoy what you do even more? (So, I had trouble coming up with the second question >_>)

This might be a bit strange, but stick with me.

Whenever I listen to classical music - and I mean listen as in actively listen and do nothing else - I always have a story playing in my mind. It quite similar to what happens when I read a book. I feel like the composer is trying, with all his/her might, to tell me something, and I just let my mind wander and hope it'll come to me.

For example, I was listening to Peter Tchaikovsky - Capriccio Italien Op 45 last night, and I kept ... daydreaming I guess is the right word, about this young girl going to her first ball. This being set somewhere in the 18th century. There's a lot more to it - my imagination tends to get the better of me in moments like this, and I must admit it is quite enjoyable.

Is this what I am "supposed" to do? Should I just enjoy the music and not think if there perhaps is a deeper meaning as I most likely could not discern it?
Or is it supposed to be open ended and I should expect to come away with only my interpretation?


Slightly offtopic - what is with the naming conventions? What is an opus? How are different pieces of music classified? By length? Type?

Do you play any other instruments?

Also, do you have any tips for a beggining improviser? Other than the usually "practice your scales, riffs and learn your circle of fifths". (Hah! I rhymed :D)

Oh man, that is impossible to answer.

The rest of the Beethoven concerti, the Chopin, Rachmaninov, Prokofiev, Liszt, Mendelsshon and more concertos. The Beethoven Hammerklavier, Appasionata, Op. 111, the list goes on and on.

Double Post:
I play the cello as well.

Was there ever a time in your life where you just wanted to stop playing because it was too hard?

Not for me, but I'm different. Music has been my greatest passion since early childhood so I could never imagine quitting music. Ever.

Why, Jeff, do I get the impression that you are full of crap, when you talk about what you can play?

You know what, I don't know. I have been studying piano since I was very young, I have had good teachers and I practice 3-4 hours a day, every day. On the weekends sometimes I even practice longer. I am very serious with my studies and plan to take music as a career. With that much practice time to devote to the piano anybody can play very difficult pieces.

You think that is a lot? Many kids out there by my age have already learned the Brahms Concerti (way above my league right now), the Prokofiev 2nd, etc. What I've learned really isn't that much compared to many others.

I think it just seems to me odd that ANYONE with such talent finds their way to a gaming forum. :tpg:

Heh. Usually during my (limited) free time I play games. Usually I only get gaming time on the weekends. I just browse the board when I take breaks and stuff.

I know major concert pianists who are gamers too :D

Ah, I wish I was a better Pianist. I've only played the pieces that I have to do in my piano minor class, and I'm always terrible.

Too bad I'm a loser actor and vocalist.

Anyways, back to the topic.

I have a few questions.

I'm a big fan of Chopin, and out of all the pieces he has written, what would you consider his hardest to play?

Same question for Lizt, though I'm not such a fan of his music...I just know his music is very showy, amazing to watch, but not nessicairly to listen too. IMO.

Do any of you know when the extra keys where added to the piano (The last 5 or 6, which add an extra octave, and are ussualy all black.)?

Finally, would you ever play the piano accompinment for me, a vocalist, haha.

Chopin wrote many difficult pieces, his Sonatas, Ballades, Scherzi, Etudes (especially), some of his Preludes and concertos are all difficult. I would say the most difficult SET of music would probably be the Etudes as they focus exclusively on technique (thus they are etudes).

As for Liszt all of his music is difficult. The most overall difficult piece for me is probably his Sonata. This piece is just so deep, so musical, yet so technically demanding. Not to mention the fact that in the 30+ minute piece there are virtually NO breaks.

As for absolute technical difficulties again I would say his etudes for the same reason as the Chopin ones.

And for saying that Liszt is all show, it all depends on the pianist. May pianists tend to play Liszt as fast or loud as they can, and as a result they fail to really emphasize the more beautiful lyrical sections.

Regarding hard pieces by Liszt, right now I think that either his Hugenot's transcription, Don Juan Fantasy, Totentanz, or Feu Follets, are some of his hardest pieces.
But I have by no means managed to print out every single one of his works and tried to play them, as I would probably force my school into bankruptcy.

Oh and his William Tell Transcription (spelling?) That is ridiculously hard. I actually change my vote to that.

Well, of course I didn't expect you to play all of Lizts Music. And totentanz is probably, to my ear, one of my more enjoyed Liszt works. One has to remeber Liszt was the Paiganni of the Piano. Liszt was the far better composer, however.

Out of the Piano works I've stutied (Ive had to study a few, considering my music theory teacher is the piano teacher, heh) Chopin really knew what he was doing, he could even make those Etudes sound amazing, even though they where written for technical reasons.

Anyways, I have another question, I heard a quote somewhere from a famous pianist that said something to the extent of it being harder to play Mozart then it is Liszt, because of mozarts use of the melodic line, and it's need for interpretation. Do you agree with this?

I dislike Mozart's music, and don't listen or play it very often at all, so I cannot say that I can answer that.
And the William Tell isn't nearly as hard as any of those I listed, personally. It is on par with Rigoletto, which is not too bad.

I believe that Mozart is difficult because one must make music with such a small amount of notes. Many people overlook the difficulties of Mozart because the notation seems fairly simplistic. However with Mozart the difficulties don't lie in the technique as much as they do in the musicality and interpretation. I believe that is what he meant.

Double Post:
Oh damn, right I meant the Don Juan transcription. My bad :(

Ok, here is a question:
Do you usually memorize all the music you play, or do you keep sheets around to make sure that you get the right notes, and stuff like that?
If you memorize, what do you find to be the most effective method to memorize music?

If I am seriously learning it for like a concert or competition, then I usually memorize them. I use multiple methods to memorize. Often times it comes to muscle memory, but to really get it in my memory I usually study the score and make sure I know the score inside out. Often times memorizing backwards can work too (too lazy to explain if you don't know what I mean.) Other times I just take it line by line. It's like 12 am and I have to sleep soon :D

Does playing the piano make you any more freaky or dextrous with your fingers? e.g, can you type at the speed of light (or there abouts)?

Nope. Different kind of keyboard. The difference in detexrity of the fingers between pianists and other people isn't that much - it's just that we're trained.

I have two questions:

What's the best way to glissando on all flat keys?

What's the best way to train your ear?

I've been doing ear training exercises for the past few years, but I don't seem to be getting any better. Help?

For glissandos...grow nails. :D

For ear training...I associate intervals with phrases of popular songs. Like, a minor 2nd sounds like the Jaws theme. A perfect 4th sounds like the beginning of "I've Been Working on the Railroad." And so on. Helped me a lot.

To address Dewman's question, though...I feel piano actually does help with other things. It builds up finger strength, which translates to better overall finger dexterity in general, which is useful in a lot of situations. For example, I can beat all my friends at Guitar Hero. :D

What I want to know is have you learned Chopin's First Ballad in G minor cause I'm working on that right now and it's jawesome. Also what is your favorite piece to play?

Schubert: everything. What, do I have to pick favourites? Okay. The D.960 sonata.

Haydn: I just love the style. Some of my favourite sonatas include Hob. XVI:34 (E minor), XVI:48 (C major), and of course XVI:52 (Eb major).

Milhaud: never cared much for him.
Alkan's Grande Sonate and cello sonata, Henselt's piano concerto, Rzewki's "The People United...", Kapustin's concert etudes, Albéniz's Iberia... the list could get quite huge.

You're very lucky to be so spontaneously imaginative, I wish I were like you. I've already experienced what you're describing, but only when listening to music while I'm on the verge of falling asleep after staying awake for longer than I should have.

Really. I think it's a great gift you have. Don't worry about what you're (not) supposed to do, everyone enjoys music in their own ways and yours is perfectly valid.
Opus = work.

In a nutshell, there are two types of classifications. When a composer has one of his pieces published, it is labelled with an opus number. The first work they publish will be opus 1, and so on. Posthumous works are usually treated as extra opus numbers at the end or labelled "WoO" (without opus) and classified chronologically.

This works well with composers who published most of their works. Now, keep in mind it's quite a recent thing. Printed sheet music was quite rare and expensive until the 19th century. So we have cases of composers like Bach who wrote kilometers of music but only published a handful of works. These composers' works are usually indexed after their death, thus resulting in composer-specific methods of labelling works. BWV for Bach, kv. for Mozart, L. or K. for Scarlatti, D. for Schubert. Those aim at being chronological when the sources allow it, but it can be pretty random at times (with Scarlatti's works for example).

Of course those obscure composers did have a few works published, so you'll find opus numbers for some Schubert pieces, for example. But the more thorough classifications (D. in that case) always seems to take over.

Used to play the drums and classical percussion. I can fiddle with a guitar but nothing too serious. Also took a few violin lessons but I gave up for lack of time and haven't touched the thing in months.

I don't really have any tips, as I'm actually a complete beginner at improvising myself.
No.
Chopin: everything he wrote is hard, because however easy it might look to get the notes right, expression is another matter. So when getting the notes right isn't a piece of cake either, we pianists are in for a bit of work. Ballades, Etudes, Scherzi and Sonatas come to mind, not to mention individual pieces like the Berceuse and Barcarolle. They're all so hard I don't really make a difference anymore.

Liszt: I'm not quite familiar enough with his works to give you a definitive answer. I'm tempted to say the B minor sonata, though, if only for the gigantic scope of the work.

I don't know when these extra keys were added, but I'd say early 20th century. The information can probably be googled easily enough. I've recently gotten the chance to play on a Bösendorfer grand that had 4 extra keys and it was certainly an interesting experience. I think it's a Bösendorfer-specific feature.

And I certainly would!

I don't know, never really had to try or use a method per se. I automatically memorize anything within one or two weeks of practising it. It just happens, and I'm thankful for that. I like to keep the sheets around when practising, though, for reference and all. I may remember a piece from start to finish but have doubts about where a specific crescendo begins and ends.
Absolutely not, actually I'm probably the most clumpsy person you can ever hope to encounter. Playing the piano is just about the only thing I can do with my hands.

I do type at light speed (and mostly with my index fingers), but it has absolutely nothing to do with the piano.
I usually recommend using the nails for glissandos, but it doesn't seem to work as well as I'd like on the black keys. So I do it with the tips of my 2-3-4 fingers (NOT the back!)

As for ear training, you're probably asking the wrong person. I have a (pretty basic) form of perfect pitch which has allowed me to get this far without really having to train my ears per se. Of course I've developped some things over time, but I'm not sure how it happened exactly.
Nope, I haven't. I sure would like to give it a go when I'm ready for it, though.

My favourite piece to play these times is Granados's Concert Allegro, because it's really rewarding and fulfilling.

I can type pretty damn fast, but then I suppose I spend more time typing than practicing piano >.<

Is there any way at all I can improve my timing? I'm getting there with other techniques but my biggest short-coming is my timing.

Also, have you ever attempted to play "Flight of the Bumblebee"?

Yeah if you haven't heard his Ballad in g minor it's on the pianist soundtrack if you have that or seen the movie. Otherwise I could send it to you somehow. Let me know. It's definately worth listening to.

Have you ever had sex on the piano?
Have you ever met some hot chick (or dude, whatever you prefer) while playing piano?
When are you going to get new recordings?

Is reading notes kinda like reading arrows in DDR? What i mean is that do you eventually get so good at it that it requires no thought... like you could play and talk at the same time. Thats how it is now that i've been playing DDR for just over a year. I no longer have to concentrate on the arrows... i just kinda "know" where to move. Is piano similar?

I have learned the Chopin G minor and have performed it several times. It is really a wonderful piece, I especially love that coda at the end :D

Double Post:
I have never had sex on the piano.

If you mean met like in a relationship, then no. But I have caught the attention of hot chicks while playing :D

Um, I am not really sure. I don't plan when I get them, I just do when I feel like it :D

Double Post:
In a way. It is very difficult to explain. It's actually almost exactly like reading words in a book. You don't necessarily read every word, you just need the shape of it to tell what it is. When you are comfortable enough with reading then it does become second nature. HOWEVER, it is still difficult (of course) to sightread through certain pieces (cough Prok 2nd, Rach 3rd, Brahms 2nd, etc)

Not really. Well I probably sightread some transcription once but I can't say I got hooked.

What do you mean by improving your timing, precisely? Staying in a tempo without slowing down/speeding up? Playing complex rhythms correctly? Please enlighten me there.
I've heard it more times than I care to remember, and I have more versions of it than I care to count. I was actually first introduced to it by the recording on that soundtrack, though!
No.
Yes, a girl once came into my practise room to confess her undying love for me. I'm positive the C minor nocturne helped a great deal with seducing her.
New recordings coming by the end of the week if all goes as planned.
I can sightread and talk at the same time, though it's difficult, yeah. Eventually you don't have to "say" every note in your head, hand/eye coordination develops itself to the point that you'll instictively play the right notes upon seeing them. Still requires a lot of concentration, and it's probably harder than DDR, but yeah, I guess you could make a connection.

what should I do to become virtuoso? must I study piano like the pianoholic? 10 hours per day playing hanon?

You ain't got no talent son get out of here.



Hey I got a question: in your time, how many jokes have you encountered regarding the fact that "pianist" sounds so much like "penis"?

More than I care to remember.:juggler:

Quote:

Originally Posted by neus This might be a bit strange, but stick with me. Whenever I listen to classical music - and I mean listen as in actively listen and do nothing else - I always have a story playing in my mind. It quite similar to what happens when I read a book. I feel like the composer is trying, with all his/her might, to tell me something, and I just let my mind wander and hope it'll come to me. For example, I was listening to Peter Tchaikovsky - Capriccio Italien Op 45 last night, and I kept ... daydreaming I guess is the right word, about this young girl going to her first ball. This being set somewhere in the 18th century. There's a lot more to it - my imagination tends to get the better of me in moments like this, and I must admit it is quite enjoyable. Is this what I am "supposed" to do? Should I just enjoy the music and not think if there perhaps is a deeper meaning as I most likely could not discern it? Or is it supposed to be open ended and I should expect to come away with only my interpretation?

That's the same with me. Whenever I really listen to a song, automatically, a story forms within my head; as if in a dream. It also happens to me vise versa. I can see a story/event and hear the music. I think this is what you're supposed to do. I think many people naturally do this, they just don't realize it.
This is how I did it.
1. I bought a tuner.
2. I started small with notes C, D, E and tried to sing them.
3. I tested if I hit the right pitch.
4. After learning and able to sing any note at will, I got some sheet music and sightread. I tried to sing the notes out loud.
5. After you get good at that, listen to some songs, start out with the basics, i.e. Mary Had A Little Lamb and try to transpose the piece into notes.
6. Once you get good at the easy pieces, start listening to harder pieces and try to transpose them. Eventually, you'll get good and you'll be able to hear music in your head by just looking at sheet music and able to see sheet music by listening to just music. :P

Yeah I first heard it there and have been trying to learn it for a while...the hardest thing is finding the time to practice it seriously. Yeah I also love the coda and playing the double octaves violently down the keys :) eheheh.

What should I play right now?

Yeah, that's actualy the piano I was thinking off, I'll have to look into the history of that.

You might not know the answer to this, but do you know of any other composer that used those lower notes other then Bartok?

:guitarist:



Either that, or the Khatchaturian Piano Concerto.

Double Post:
Also, does anyone know if there was a piano made that could accomadate that extremely high chord that Scriabin has in his 7th Sonata? The chord that literally goes off the keyboard.

NO. Fuck no. Get a good teacher and practise as they advise, that's all anyone should need. If you intend to teach yourself, you'd better damn well read books and essays about technique and expression if you intend to have a clue what you're doing (but I personally doubt you can get very far that way).

There's so much a pianist needs to know, I wouldn't know where to begin. Really, get a teacher.
Never. I've thought about it, though, but only because the similarity is somewhat more disturbing in English than it is in my language.
Depends, what are you in the mood for? And how much effort are you willing to invest?

Have you played any of Brahms's Intermezzi/Klavierstücke? I've recently rediscovered those and they are lovely. I'll definitely look into those when I'm done with my current programme.
Messiaen used the lower notes in his Vingt regards de l'enfant Jésus.
I think the Bösendorfer Imperial might also have extra keys in the treble, but I can't tell for sure.

No, the Borsendorfer only has the extra notes in the bass. I can't remember the brand of piano which has the higher notes - it begins with S. There's another method to hit those notes - have a toy piano on the music stand so it's conveniently close to you when the chord comes, or use a synth. :)

It helps if you say it incorrectly amongst younger people. as they're the ones more likely to laugh.

Can anyone play Pachelbel Cannon in D?
How long did it take you to learn that song? Can you play it well?

I've learned so many versions of Canon in D I can't remember how many there are. THere are very simplistic versions and then there are more complex versions. The actual original piano version isn't too tricky though.

Heh. Considering my skill level, I took one look at it and never bothered with it ever again.

I suppose both of those; it's just timing in general. Would practicing with a metronome regularly be a good idea at all? I find it quite hard to stay with those.

Dear sir,

I have a question for you. How long do you think it would take a person that doesn't know how to read music, but has played the piano by ear for years to learn how to?

Thank you,
~Lady Miyomi~

I actually once "learned" and recorded a rather easy arrangement of it, just to spite a former member of these forums who was renowned for loathing the piece.

If you'd like to hear it for yourself. It was some time ago, though, and very little practise went into it (just went over it a couple times before recording it, so it was mostly sightreading). Please don't judge me on that.
If you're having trouble staying with a metronome, then yeah, I think you need to practise with one for a bit. The metronome is essentially a phase every musician has to grow out of (I barely use mine anymore), but that shouldn't be skipped.

Complex rhythms will become easier with practise. Remember anything can be slowed down and subdivided for practising purposes.

Timing issues often have something to do with technique issues, though. Why do we all naturally tend to slow down when playing softly and to speed up when playing loudly? Because we don't produce sound the same way (using various degrees of strength and velocity). But no matter the intensity, your hands should be resting comfortably at the bottom of the keyboard on every note. I've seen this referred to as "fingerprint memory" in a great book I've read. Because feeling uncomfortable will definitely affect your timing, and that happens a lot when trying to play pianissimo for example, since we naturally don't "dare" to reach for the bottom of the keyboard. I could expand on this for hours, but these few ideas should be enough to get you started.

You can pretty much understand it on the spot if someone explains you how it works. At least the general principles. Of course there are countless details to master, but those come easily once you've got the basics down.

Now, knowing how to decipher music doesn't mean you'll be able to read it proficiently and sightread a piece on the spot. This takes months if not years of daily practise.

I got a few questions,

1. How often should one practice per day/week?

2. Do you ever have a general perference for a Key signature?

3. What inspires you to continuosly practice a song?

Cheers!

1. It all depends on what you want to get at. If you want to stay at a level where you can play simple stuff, and melodies and chords, then, for me, about once a week is good.
If you want to be able to play much more complex stuff, I would suggest like once every other day.
If you want to play the insane stuff, practice every day for 10 hours straight.

2. I am very partial to onces with lots of sharps or flats, preferrably minor.

3. A piece that I hear/sing/replay in my head that I want to play, and the satisfaction of having that realized.

1. Depends on your level and ambitions. I need six hours a day to fulfill mine, but that's because I'm not quite as good as I ought to be considering my age. If you just want to maintain a level, just keeping in touch with the instrument a few times a week should be enough.

2. I don't know. Used to be C# minor, but now I have a thing for the splendid, luminous keys such as C# major (Granados Concert Allegro) or F# major (Chopin's Barcarolle). And when I improvise, I always seem to end up in G minor for some reason.

3. I end up loving most of the music I play, so that's enough to give me the ambition of playing it as well as I can, and therefore, practising my hardest. I've never gotten very far with pieces that bored me out of my mind (but there have been few instances).

How can you play a piece for more than a month and still find it interesting?

Messing with the nuances of the music itself.
I am just starting to venture into this exciting realm which I had never considered.

Like, play it so that every upbeat is accented, or certain harmonies are louder than other harmonies, or even the melody.
Stuff like that.
After having mastering a piece, you twist it up.
Like, the 2nd movement of the moonlit sonata is a blast to play with erratic but comical rhythm and tempo.

I don't remember from your videos, but when you play the piano, do you bob your head up and down like a complete retard. Do you fake it?

Have you played Fantasie Impromptu by Chopin? How long did it take you to play it? Me - 4 years! =D

When I'm jamming especially with others I'm bound to be bobbing head/body cause music is amazing and you just gotta get into it.

Another random question for you Pianists out there, who is your most respecteted pianist, and which one do you look up to the most?

Hamelin, without a doubt.
He has amazing talent, and it appears that one of his goals in life is to revive and bring to the fore previously unknown or forgotten music, rather than show off how awesome he is at the popular songs that everyone always wants to hear.

If that's what it takes to master it, my motivation will remain intact. If I can master a piece faster than that, I'll usually move on as soon as I'm satisfied with my work.
1. No, I don't think I do. And I don't fake anything while playing, I do have quirks but they are beyond my control.

2. No. Well, yes, at some point I was kinda wondering if I should learn it, but I lost interest after sightreading it a few times and I don't think it's going to come back.

And Rangel, t(-_-t) took the words right out of my mouth. Gotta add Sokolov and Radu Lupu, though, since they are gods to me as far as interpretation goes (especially Schubert). So is Arrau, but he's dead.

Those classical prodigies are amazing and watching them is insane but my favorite pianist and respected is Ben Folds his style and innovative ways of playing the piano are absolutely amazing. His aggressive playing and manners of improvising are also incredible.

Like Hamelin another great pianist who has partially devoted his career to exposing lesser known masterpieces is Stephen Hough. His CD called "The Piano Album" is probably one of my favorite CDs, and virtually none of the pieces are well known. Just gives you an idea of what we are missing out on :D

I understand Hough's often controversial interpretations, but keep in mind that for example his performance of the Rach 2nd and 3rd (which were extremely fast) follow the metrenome markings that Rachmaninoff himself indicated. I even checked it myself and he is right on the money. Strange how music has slowed down. Just try following the Chopin 1st with the metrenome set exactly as Chopin wrote it, you'll be surprised.

pianist question
 

could anybody give a suggestion for a really hard level 3 piece?

In what level system are you operating in?

For me, it was 8-9th grade. Before that, it was just under parental pressure that I continued to play piano. I slowly began to enjoy it more and more, when I discovered other genres of music. I am however, slowly mingling back into classical.

Question:
Finished my Grade 10 with 74, so I wasn't eligible for ARCT. In uni now, practicing all my FFPC favourites for fun. Haven't touched technique since last June, I believe. No ear training since early last year for a little bit. Should I go back to take the retest (by that mean supplemental ear test) for that one percent more that I needed to advance to ARCT?

I think ARCT is only a rank in Ontario having to do with the Royal Conservatory of Toronto or something, so outside of here, what comes after Grade 10?

What did you have to play for your Grade 10 exam? Just so I get an idea of how your level system works.

I take rcm too although i didn't take Piano gr 10 - your pratical exam is only valid (as in to get your gr. 10 certificate meaning that you've taken your pratical gr10, harmony and history for that level - i think it's lv4) for 4 years since you've taken it. If you're keen on getting any artc, I'd say take it. If not, then don't bother the extra price in order to qualify to artc if you're not planing to take it. - I thought you had to have a 70+ to qualify over artc :\ or did they come with a new syllabus in the last 3 years?

Ya I guess the syllabus changed. At least I don't have to take the actual practical exam again, I just need an ear test to supplement and boost my mark.

Pieces
------
Waltz in e-, Chopin
Snow Games, Tsitaros
Clair De Lune, Debussy
Pathetique Sonata (1st and 2nd movs.), Beethoven
French Suite (Allemande and Gigue), Bach

Gallop, Tsitsaros
(study), Lyadov

just a general music question..
i'm a pianist myself but i'm also interesting in directing(conducting)...
but apparently if you wanna be a conducter you need perfect pitch (absolute pitch).
Is this true?

Please explain to me the words symphony, opus, etude, movement, sonata, etc. with the piano terms. What is he differewnce and what makes a song a cretain 'type' of that music?

I believe the world Symphony literally translates to "sounding together," which is why in a Symphony you will always hear many different instruments playing together.

Opus was a word that was used to number a composer's compositions. It's translated meaning means work.

An etude is a work that is used as a study on technique. For example, Chopin's Revolutionary Etude focused on left hand runs. His Op. 25 No. 6 focused on thirds. Many composers known for their Etudes are Liszt, Chopin, Rachmaninov, Debussy, Czerny among others.

A movement is a large portion of an even larger work of music. For example, a movement of a Symphony or a Sonata, which I will get into next.

A sonata is a work that often consists of may different movements. The traditional sonata style would have a fast first movement, a slower second movement often in a different key, and an exciting finale which was often a Rondo. However that form has changed and evolved during time and even people such as Beethoven and Haydn often broke from that tradition. The translation literally means "to sound."

As for the last question I'm not entirely sure what you are asking...

Is this bollocks?


You do need to be extremely good at reading obscure clefs and transposing on sight, though. But that has little to do with perfect pitch.

tell me face, is it true that you have a grand 12-inch pianist... err grand 12-foot piano?

What it boils down to is structure, style and the instruments invovled. A symphony is a sonata for orchestra. A concerto is a sonata for orchestra and soloist. A quartet is a sonata for 4 musicians, etc.

About structure, take a waltz for example. It has 3/4 time signature and the theme is 8 measures long. The first 8 measures of a waltz is always the theme. A mazurka (a kind of Polish dance) is like a waltz only the theme is 4 measures long and it has a certain rhythm usually that it would be hard for me to explain here.

Style would be how you would classify a nocturne, for example. It's a nocturne because of how it sounds, not because of who's playing it or what the structure is (although they do typically have a definite structure, the structure is so common that it alone can't classify a piece as being a nocturne).

Out of curiousity, what is the difference between an etude/study and a virtuoso study? I mean, how do you tell the difference? (I've actually never seen a study called a virtuoso study before).

I would venture to guess that a virtuoso study has things that you would have to spend years on and never truly master. I mean like a typical Czerny study would be ridiculously easy in comparison to say, Revolutionary Etude?

We have stuff like 4 on 3, "running" octaves, cadenzic scale passages, lengthy pieces (endurance and stamina come into play)...as compared to a 1/2 page study.

How do you maintain your composure when you're performing for a crowd of people?

Really the best way is through experience. Try to grab as many performing oppertunities you can. Try to gather friends to watch you. Also, try to focus less on the audience and more into the music, it helps.

If any piece is called a "virtuoso study", thats kind of bombastic and probably the editor's doing and not the composer. As far as the difference goes, a virtuoso etude would just be an etude that would take a virtuoso (someone who has mastered the instrument) to play. Basically something that separates the men from the boys.

Hiya! Just wondering if you have any tips on how to find SHEET MUSIC for Rachmaninoff's "Italian Polka" (/ "Polka Italienne"), but transcribed for solo piano, not 4 hands. I think Volodos did a 'piano reduction' for piano solo, but in my surfings on the Net, I haven't found any reference to any published sheet music for it, and my local classical music sheet-music shop doesn't have it / know of it either. I love the Italian Polka (heard it recently on "From the Top" radio show), and would love to learn it. It's quite rollicking.

Any suggestions?

Thanks!

insect_sister

Nope, Fjordor, it's not there... but thanks for link!
 

Hi, Fjordor, I just looked for the aforementioned piece (Rachmaninoff Italian Polka, for 2 hands not 4 hands) at the link, and it ain't there... but it's a good link to have, thanks!

*

Maybe there's more to the link, but it's freezing here in the computer room and I'll explore that page more some other time.

Thanks.

insect_sister

The thread is a classical sheet music REQUEST thread.
If you are looking for sheet music, ask for it there.

Thanks
 

Sorry, thanks. Like I said, it's cold in here, I didn't dally to read the page fully, doing other stuff online... but I'll request it there!

Ciao.

insect_sister

What bad habit or technical flaw bothers you most in a pianist?

Can you play Spinach Rag for me?

Speaking of 'rag', have you ever considered playing any Joplin pieces or is the ragtime genre not your thing?

which is harder chopin or liszt

Vladimir Horowitz....

Also, Dr. John.... Art Tatum...

... and not for his technique, but for his music -- Thelonius Monk. And Fats Waller for his music and humor. I also like Sunnyland Slim, for blues piano. And Tom Waits for his style and writing.... yeh, I know they're not classical, but had to mention.

But Vladimir Horowitz is the man. Heard him 2 or 3 times in Ann Arbor Michigan. Not only could he play amazing, powerful pieces (Rach 3, etc. -- though that I've only heard in recordings), but when he played Schumann's 'Traumerei' (sp?), somehow even the two opening notes -- just a simple interval, just a fourth -- were miraculous and beautiful. He flowed right into the piano. And I believe I heard him play the "Stars & Stripes Forever" transcription live too....

Vlad's the man.

insect_sister
new to this forum but reading away

Oh yeh, and Bill Evans and McCoy Tyner were no slouches either... and I've enjoyed Dave Brubeck from time to time...

I can play the drink milk love life song.... & its very slow! but my GF playes... & I always have a fond ear to the piano... I always ask her to play songs but me, I personally like songs that she has created rather then her do a cover song... same with me playing guitar, I would rather play my own than rip off someones song; not like its much of a rip off!

One of my favorite pianists is Murray Perahia. His interpretations are almost always very lyrical and sensitive. Horowitz was great as well but I thought most of his recordings were very bangy and percussive. However, he has had some very wonderful moments though certainly deserves to be well recognized.

i would say my favourite pianist at the moment is Vladimir Horowitz.
I change my taste all the time...
it really depends on who's works the pianists are playing.
they each have different style so it's pretty hard to tell who you like the best.

By the way i just got a question here...
anyone know how hard is it to play Chopin Nocturne op.48 no.1?
What level would this piece be rank at?

Not as hard as you think. Why don't you give it a try?

On the whole, Liszt is usually much more difficult than Chopin e.g. Symphonic Transcriptions, the earlier versions of the Transcendental Etudes and Paganini etudes.

Another question! I only recently started going to live classical music concerts and I was wondering.. is it common practice for a pianist who is playing in a concert or even in a recital to play with sheet music in front of them?

It depends. It's not unheard of. Especially if he is playing with a chamber ensemble.

Fair enough. What about in a competition? Would adjudicators deduct marks from you for having sheet music there? I was always lead to believe that looking at sheet music was a sign of lack of preparation on the pianist's behalf.

thanks, i did played it through a few times....
but dunno if my teacher will let me learn it so i want to know how difficult this piece is, and if it's possible for me to ask him to teach me this piece.
So any ideas or what grade you would place this piece (chopin Nocturne op48 no.1) in?

The music is all that matters. If you play well, I don't see why it would matter. Generally, if you don't know the piece, you won't play it well, though.


I've never really understood the grading system. If you've got big hands, it shouldn't be a problem for you. If not, hopefully you're good at jumps and broken chords.

lol i think i have alright length hands...not very big but better than most other people in my gender =P
i guess i'll ask my teacher after i've done my assessment and see what he says about it.
thanks a lot

I have a question. On the sheets for certain songs, such as Gackt's "blue", and "Brave new heart" from Leaf piano collection (which I believe was actually transcribed by face) it seems that you have to play three different parts at the same time. Is it actually possible for one person to play this on their own?

It depends. If the 3rd line's print is smaller than it is meant for a 2nd person. However if all 3 are the same size and there is no indication that a 2nd person is needed then all 3 should be played by one person. A few examples of pieces with 3 lines are the Prokofiev 2nd's 1st movement cadenza and the first time the main theme is played in the Mazeppa Etude.

It is possible and having 3 lines makes it easier to read most of the time. They do that because if they put all the notes in just 2 lines then it would be too cluttered.

wait until you set your eye on Rach's 3rd prelude :D it has 4 LINES!!! :lolsign:

Anywho the above answer is probebly the right one however if it does ever occur having 3 lines all the same size without defining a second person or what so ever, it's probebly spaced out proprely so you don't need to be mutated into 3 hands to play.

But since you DID say Gackt (being a band and all), the top line is probebly the melody (singing?) and the bottom two would be the piano accompaniment to the song.

Depends on the adjudicator - sometimes they will sometimes they won't; the best thing to determine this is to sit in a few of their adjudications and see how they mark and what they like to emphasize on (style, technique, difficulty etc) before you get to your "class" for adjudication. For some people, the sheet music might actualy distract the performer in being focused into the page instead of style (depending on your piece really because it's nice to have it there if you're doing a Bach prelude per say) and for others it's sort of a security blanket that makes them less nervous. But since you're asking for an adjudication specificaly, it really depends how they like to mark or if they're given a bench mark of some sort then check into that (ie. exam sessions are likely to deduct you marks for unmemorized pieces however may let you use the sheet music for study pieces etc)

^ Ah ok, it makes sense now.

I'm pretty sure the Gackt song "blue" has no singing.
I don't even really like it, I was just trying to think of examples...

Anyway, thank you both for your help!

does anyone know that if there's any differences between these two pieces
or are they the same (it's by Mendelssohn)
"Andante & Rondo Caprricio" and "Rondo Caprricio"

They're both the same. Mendelssohn's famous Rondo Capriccioso starts with an andante section.

thanks Minion
now i get it =)
By the way do you think this rondo capriccio by Mendelssohn is harder or chopin's nocturne op27 no2, Schumann's Faschingsschwank aus Wien or Khachaturian's toccata?
Out of the four which one do you reckon is the hardest to learn and perform?

Well, I hate Schumann, so I'm gonna ignore that one. Definitely not the nocturne. Probably the Rondo is the most difficult to play well (pay special attention to the articulation).

I like the Rondo Capriccio the best out of all the recommended pieces i got given...but guess my teacher doesn't want me to play it yet....(but he was the one who recommended the piece to me and then 2 days later he regreted) =(
The schumann one i only the intermezzo part...
Chopin sounds okay...but apparently my piano teacher really wants me to play Khachaturian's toccata or the Schumann one.
I was thinking picking one from either Debussy's Pour le Piano, Chopin Nocturne or Mendelssohn's Rondo....

try some Debussy :) you just might like it! (some of them does sound sketchy for me... oh impressionists :p )

I'm don't think I recall how that Schumann song looks like but most of his pieces are for BIG HANDS (ie. reach a 10th mind you T__T ...)

strange fact: I actually like gackt's piano solo 'blue', also I think that his malice mizer 'regret' was kind of nifty too.

bishounens can sometimes be useful ;(

If you're deciding between Schumann and anything else, choose anything else.

Thanks for both of your suggestions Luckee Cookie and Minion
I'll chat to my teacher next week and see what he says about each song as well.
Schumann's song sounds okay but not my style, i only like the last two parts and reaching 10th is kind of okay for me so don't worring about that =)
Minion it seems you hate Schumann so much...but i reckon his piano pieces are much better than Mozart =P

I'm not Mozart's biggest fan, but he is leaps and bounds better than Schumann.

Yeah but to be fair so is well... anybody.

Oh, c'mon. There's gotta be someone worse than Schumann.

I live close by Manhattan. By port authority, there is this bum I guess or maybe just a crazy guy, but he has a drum set and he just sits there playing nonsense in the most unenthusiastic way imaginable. That guy is probably worse than Schumann.

sorry for disappearing for a while...
was busy with exams...
my final decision (or shall i say my teacher's final decision) is learning Khachaturian's toccata
so no Schumann =P

how do you manage practicing every day and get so good??

i've got another question here and i don't know if anyone can please answer this question for me. I've been looking for an answer for quite a long time but even searching online or library didn't help.
So the question is
Does anyone know if Rachmaninoff played the cello or not? Or was piano his only instrument?

any one like the Prokofiev 2nd piano concerto?
I can play the 3rd movement, I want to find a ochestra accompany recording, like the music minus one once, does anyone has it?

The only things I've heard from Hamelin are his recordings of Grainger pieces. They're beautiful.

Question for any of those who play accompaniments:

From a pianist's point of view, do you enjoy playing accompaniments with other instruments, or is it more for the money? Whenever I perform a flute solo with a pianist, I always feel like they deserve more recognition.

@pianist
As far as I know, Rachmaninoff only played Piano, but I found it's questionable since he also composed some compositions for Cello isn't it?

question for you: What's the first virtuostic composition you played?

@Arienas

It's more like "I want to help my friend out." As much as I would love recognition, I am always thinking "this is her song, it's called accompaniment for a reason." Plus it's fun to see how two instruments combine to make a beautiful piece :)

@eriol
Same here i only know that Rachmaninoff played the piano, but his compositions for piano or cello are much better than most of his other works, so that's why i want to know if he played the cello. Thanks for answering.

As for your question: the first virtuostic composition......hmmmmmmm.....i don't which pieces could be consider virtuostic, would you please give a few examples?....but i can tell you that i have never ever play a piano concerto before =P

Let's see... Rachmaninoff's, Ravel's, Chopin's, or Liszt's would be an obvious example. what is the first compostion you played done by these composer?

Also, did you actually spend 8 hours per day playing that boring Hanon? My instructor said it's the absolute requirement to become professional pianist... OMG, that made me retreating my dream to become a pianist.

Anyway, I'm more interested in History of Music now. Let me know If you need resources or discussion toward a composer's life.:)

i don't spend 8 hours per day playing Hanon =P
i'm still at high school at the moment so i also busy with school works, right now i'm in holiday so i can practice more. My piano teacher didn't tell me to practice Hanon, he gave another piano technique book to use (he said this book is one of the best exercise book and it's kind of out of print already) and i have my own piano technique book as well. Say if i practice 4 hours that day, i'll spend at least half of that time practicing technique stuffs.

The first virtuostic composition i played.....let me think...
i think the first one i touch on is Ravel when i was in Grade 7 lol
then it's Chopin Nocturnes and Waltzes
I guess the Chopin Nocturne will be the first virtuostic composition i did, i cant remember exactly the name, but it's either op62 no1 or op62 no2.
I have played some virtuostic compositions alone without teacher's trainings and they are not nicely done yet and i realised i need to concentrate more on my techniques so basically i left them aside for a while.
My best playing on a virtuostic composition is probably Elegie by Rachmaninoff and it's one of my favourite piece as well =)
I still haven't decided yet if i wanted to become a professional pianist, if i do i know i need at least 6 hours of practice each day but with the amount of school works i getting from school it's impossible and i don't think my parents really want me to concentrate on music so they don't want me to spend so much time on practicing, which is annoying....

Do you study Music in Uni?
Thanks for offering help, i'll probably ask soon since as music students in our school, we need to perform at least once a term (4 times in a year, one of them is gonna be a recital) and most of the time, we are required to talk about the composers.

By the way, are you playing Hanon for 8 hours per day??

I go to college, and when ever I am free, I just let my self rot infront of the piano, hm.......I would say I practice average 10 hours if no classes. I am currently learning the Rach 2nd 1st mvt, got 1/3 down and took me a week, is that progressive, how long did it take you(who ever plays it) to learn the 1st mvt?

Uh there is no way I would do it. in the past I tried to play hanon regularly for 2 hours... and It only lasted for three days xD. I guess I'm not really interested in piano anymore...

No, but I love reading books about composers. When I was in high school, I wrote a paper about music history contains biography of Bach, Mozart, Beethoven and Chopin. :D Too bad there is no musicology at any university in my country, I wish I could enter one.

no musicology at any university in your country!? How come?
wouldn't there be at least one university to study music??
what about music colleges?

Well, my teacher said so during a consultation. There are Several universities which have music as major studies, but they are not cheap. -_-; most of music colleges here only majoring in performance I think (piano, flute, etc). I ended up in international relations instead.

The funny is, I'm more knowledgeable to music history than my friends who are studying in music colleges. They are really2 lazy to read literature.:D

next question: do you study how to compose too? What's your favorite style in composition? Baroque? Romantic? Classical? Atonal?

i see, yes it does cost quite a lot to study music and it's pretty to find a good earning job after graduate from music....maybe you can try out for music scholarships? (i don't know if it requires performing, but i think you should fine with that)

I do study composing as well but i'm not a pro on it. I have like 3 different teachers at school for music, one is our main music teacher, she teaches ous theory and musicology, the other one help us with our performing (whom is also my piano teacher =D) and the third teacher teaches us composing and i think he's pretty famous.

My favourite style in composition used to be late Classical but nowadays i'm leaning towards late Romantic style. Sometimes i compose some atonal but that usually only occur when i'm too lazy to compose and a piece of work is due =P
what about you? Do you compose as well?

Uh no, I did try to learn things or two about composition. I even bought a book of introduction to composition, but in the end it's just sleeping with dust in the shelf. Too damn hard when you have no teacher ^^; if I became a composer, I would write music in baroque style for sure xD

Oh yeah, when you compose, do you use instrument to help you composing the tunes? or you just scribble it down? (assuming you have perfect pitch and could name any tune perfectly)

At least you can still compose even without learning properly =P
I only compose baroque style for twice, the first time was a disaster anyway i normally hear a tune in my head and then i'll try to play it on the piano and write the tune down and unfortunately i'm the only one in the class who plays the piano but doesn't have perfect pitch =(
When i have absolutely no idea what i should compose, i'll just sit infront of the piano for ages =P

Oh yeah, when you do free improvisation, what key do you play at? I mostly play in Cm or C. That's because I practiced from wrong root... two years ago I started to improvise Ballade in Cm by Buergmuller. Since then my mind seems unconsciously play the motifs of that song.:(

Sigh, I really wish could play in another key. Is there any tips to practice playing in another keys? (I would love to play in Gb, my favorite key.) I feel stucked in keyboard improvisation. While people could improvise pop songs, I could only play in Cm...

As much as I want to learn piano, composition and music theory interests me far more. What suggestions can you make so I don't end up like Phillip Glass?

If you want to do composition and music theory, you will end up learning piano along the way no matter what. But I don't think you should delve into any theory or composition without understanding the fundamentals of piano. So I suggest you do the opposite of your post - learn piano :)

I've tried to get piano lessons but they're a touch expensive and I don't really have a good schedual to work it out. I have a keyboard at home and a Piano For Dummies book but I don't think its is something you teach yourself per se.

free improvisation....i don't do that often, i only do it when i'm playing in a rock band, i never go and check out the key properly i just play what ever feels okay and suit with the key. If you have perfect pitch, improvising is going to be easy for you, for people who don't have perfect pitch, it requires experience practice and preparation.
YOu can first check the style and the key the piece is in and using scales that will suit the piece first then later on you can develop your own improvisation.

You can certainly teach yourself something like music theory, there are some excellent books you can get. Even if you are not willing to spend money than there are also good websites.

Of course it is very valuable to get a teacher to work through other factors than theory such as technique, interpretation etc.

is there any easy way that i can make my playing sound more legato and flowing? and is there any way to improve the speed of my fingers easily? i'm trying to play 'can't say goodbye to yesterday'
i posted the sheet music on this thread if you would like to see what i'm so stuck with: http://www.gamingforce.com/forums/au...criptions.html

Are there any pieces that you have memorized, haven't played for awhile, and find yourself having to re-learn the entire piece again?

Wait, in addition to that, is memorizing a piece even necessary? I've been asked by instructors to do this come recitals.

@Kazyl:

1. Yes, many chopin pieces completely fall out of my hands after a few years without touching them; although I find it alot easier to pick it up (re learning) after a few good slow reads and your hand jumps back into the grove.

2. Recital wize it dosn't really matter weither you memorize or not however it always looks more proffessional with it memorized. Some people find sheet music infront of them as disstracting but others find it as a "security blanket" so that really depends how you're comfortable with it.
===========================
@ evil_mercenary

All I have to say is try to get the sustain pedal to work for you for more of a legato sound and because of some of the runs on the left hand, perhaps it might be more adquate to try half pedaling it instead here and there to try to link up some of the gaps. But other than that it's just a matter of practicing close to the keyboard and figuring if there's a better figuring (ie. instead of lifing fingers to change hand positions, you might like to hold the key and transition your hand position if there's enough time and then carry on)
===========================

Could you give me examples of good books? I'm exceedingly interested in this subject and it would really help when I do interviews.

See this link:-

http://www.gamingforce.com/forums/mu...ng-thread.html

Also check out - http://www.musictheory.net/

If you are looking to purchase a book that will give you a good start to music theory : http://www.musicroom.com/se/ID_No/018427/details.html

After going through the book from the link above you will already be well equipped to learn piano. Even after going through the first few chapters (which aren't that long) you will have learn the basics.

I don't like the Associated Board books that make you buy many books just to learn a few basics.

Heres a strange question: Is the book stupid? I want it to be stupid! I want it to be as simple and easy to understand as possible.

You will be glad to know that it is very simple. The thing is though, basic Music theory is simple to learn like many things. It is only the foundation though and so the difficult task in this context is becoming a great pianist.

Seriously, you will have no difficulty getting through this book fairly quickly. You also fill out small exercises as you go through to make sure that you've got the grasp of each section. You can check your answers are correct in the back pages as well.

Hope this helps.

I've been having trouble playing parts of songs where the left hand will play a basic eighth note melody while the right hand will play triplets.
I can almost accomplish playing these parts except my left hand will not play the eighth notes flowingly. Instead they're very jumpy, due to my right hand playing the triplets.
I know if I keep at it i'll probably get the swing of it, but I was wondering if anyone knew a piece or had some advice that could make mastering these parts quicker and/or easier for me.

In cases of off-set timeing on both hands, I ususaly do pattern practice with the left hand meaning I staggard in patterns such as long-short-short or short-long-long type of patterns because that helps out a better control of having your eigths 'flow'. But as of two hands, all I can say is just to practice very well on your left hand so when you go to play with both hands, you can go to "auto-pilot" with your left hand and it would only be a matter of fitting your right hand into time. And if all due fails, i can't have much to recomend other than just practice it out slowly until it comes second nature (hahahaha.... for all us piano geeks out there :p)

Thanks alot for the advice Luckee Cookie.
I'm sure i'll get this off-set timing soon enough :).

Hijacking threads kicks ass... heheh..