She's made it very clear, Devo. Quit trying to stir shit up.

Did you even read my post, Devo. ;_; I beg you to go back and re-read.

That's my point, see. I don't mind Christians, Muslims, Mormons, Scientologists - if they stay out of my life.

So you're just here to pick a fight then. WELL.

Nova, I was in the same boat as you. I was raised Roman Catholic by an agnostic man who wanted us to have some religion in our lives. My sister and I went through the whole thing - like you did.

And we ended up about the same way, I imagine. Catholicism. Gotta love it.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here. I'm gonna guess that Christians who preach are the ones that preach, and Christians that don't... are the ones that don't. I might have that backwards though. Someone clarify if I don't as I really don't wanna come off looking foolish here!

And come on Devo, don't intercede a battle with a side battle. =\

<3

To: Sassafrass
CC: Capo

Subject: My point

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g1...POW-KC-135.jpg

I'm confused. At which point did anyone say "all Christians" evangelize? Or made any "blanket statements?" Like I said, the majority of Christians I know are really cool people who have their own beliefs (that's in reference to ones I KNOW, not a generalization about ALL of them) I've since been to churches (even at a GFF meet!), and yea, most of these religious congregations don't push. I don't know why you think anyone is saying all of Christianity pushes - packrat kind of implied it with the "success" of "Christianity," but that can be twisted easily.

ALL of the Christians I know don't bother with evangelism. (There's probably a reason for this: I don't think I'd want a friend who preached to me a whole bunch). My issue was with LordSword who thinks that "Biblical" truth is actual truth.

Packrat, instead of using a giant image to say we missed your point, could you maybe clarify?

He'd have gotten less props for that, though.

Poison or Cure? Religious Belief in the Modern World

Thread over. Christopher Hitchens machine guns the theological argument in less than 20 minutes starting at roughly the 6:00 minute mark. I would ask our believers here to watch (at least partly) this video and please give us a serious answer to the points Hitchens raises. I highly recommend this to the forum infidels and skeptics too so that you may replenish your ammunition and have a few good chuckles along the way.

"Why was the Amish woman excommunicated?"
"Too Mennonite (2 men a night)"
*ba dum pssh*

Just an observation, but I'm disappointed that many of our defenders of reason here are pulling their punches in their criticism of religion which is wholly fair (the criticism).

Who said anyone was pulling punches? If you have some mystical magical OMG LOOK THE FUCK OUT knockout blow, then come with it (and your YouTube clip AIN'T it). And what kind of douchebag moseys on into a thread and just goes "OMG LOOK AT THIS LOL GAME OVER!"

In the words of the greatest man in sports entertainment, The Rock...
http://www.sccs.swarthmore.edu/users/03/carey/talk.jpg
...who is this roody poo candy ass?

(I apologize. I've just always wanted to do that to someone.)

Deuteronomy 6:5 You shall love
the LORD your God with all your heart,
and with all your soul, and with all your
might.

1 Peter 3:15 but in your hearts
sanctify Christ as Lord. Always be ready
to make your defense to anyone who
demands from you an accounting for the
hope that is in you;

John 14:15 "If you love me, you
will keep my commandments.

God is the judge of my preformance not people. This is my priority.

My reply to Kinkymagic & Packrat-->
1 Corinthians 2:11-15........Those who are
unspiritual do not receive the gifts of
God's Spirit, for they are foolishness to
them, and they are unable to understand
them because they are spiritually
discerned.
Those who are
spiritual discern all things, and they are
themselves subject to no one else's
scrutiny.

Biblical correction is attached to following biblical teaching. Until you can obey the book dont pretend to teach from it.

I'm sorry. I didnt complete my thought because I was interrupted.
I volunteer to help homeless people in my community. I have sat down and talked with them. I know for a fact that their opinion of Christians isn't based just on the services. They know that we use our time because of what is written in the book:

Matthew 25:35-40 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'

"Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?'

"The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'

This last passage is the basis for ALL Christian service in many areas of community this is why people go running to thier local church when there is a catastrophe because there is the assumption that help is available.

Where is the basis for an atheist or agnostic to serve in their community?

No one here, from what I can tell, is judging you as a person - something you haven't been as generous with in regards to judging us.

We (and I say we because a lot of us have stated this in the thread) are annoyed that you're preaching to people who have their own faith and their own beliefs.

Not just us atheists, either.

And why do you keep quoting scripture? We know you <3 the bible.

Maybe I should start quoting random books, too.

You think that because a person doesn't believe in anything means they can't "serve their community?"

I can't tell you how many favors I've done for perfect strangers in my life. I see a person in need who I have the ability to help, I will try my best to offer my help to them. Not everyone is like this, of course - but personally, I think helping a person in need when I can is one of the most important things I can do in life.

I "serve my community" because I value my community. I want it to be the best it can be. I don't need religion to do it. If I live there, if I benefit from the community - why the hell should I NOT serve it?

You think only of serving your god. I think only of serving humanity. (And heaven knows it could use some help.)

Then why dd you even ask for correction if you weren't going to accept it? How many more insane rules are you going to invent? From now on you will not respond to anyone who uses the letter 'e'?

Sassafrass has the right idea, every time you quote the bible I will quote a better book that reveals a greater truth. This time it's Snow Crash.

Until a man is twenty-five, he still thinks, every so often, that under the right circumstances he could be the baddest motherfucker in the world. If I moved to a martial-arts monastery in China and studied real hard for ten years. If my family was wiped out by Colombian drug dealers and I swore myself to revenge. If I got a fatal disease, had one year to live, and devoted it to wiping out street crime. If I just dropped out and devoted my life to being bad.

Chapter 36.

Last I heard this is a message board for discussing things. Saying lack of belief in the book's lessons makes it impossible to understand what they truly convey is an exercise in ignorance. It's possible to be literate and have common sense and not believe in things, and still yet understand them! We call this "intelligence".

Also, obeying a book? Really? I mean, I understand the euphemism, but the way you keep wording things makes them seem so debasing.

If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death. Leviticus 20;9.

If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death. Leviticus 20:13

If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the girl’s virginity can be found, she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done a disgraceful thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. Deuteronomy 22:20-21

God is not a man, that he should lie, nor a son of man, that he should change his mind. -Numbers 23:19



Knowledge, not belief, is the basis of understanding, son. Until you learn the difference, you seriously need to shut the fuck up and quit acting like you get to make arbitrary rules just because you're losing the argument.

You quote scripture to prove your point, we quote scripture to point out holes in the book you take as law. We quote from books we find life changing and important. We don't need your permission to prove you wrong.

Deni wins. QED.

(I think I'm falling in love.)

I quote scripture for a reason. Everything I do is for a reason that is easily found in the bible.
Go ahead a quote the books you want. You are free to do that.

"Heaven knows" is right. By serving my God I serve my community. I'm not hurting anybody by advertising for Jesus. If you are "fine" lets just leave it at that, why do you have to try to stop the message of Jesus from getting to people who may need it?

I was a dope head who got off drugs thanks to the bible. If you dont like the biblical message why dont you take my place and show people how to be "fine" like you?

So the unreligious can say to the religious person:
"Hey you're practicing your religion in the wrong way! We dont believe your book but do as we say anyway!!"
C'mon folks, who is being unreasonable now?

No you don't and whatever proof you have I hope it works for you. I just make my case its my job. People tell me to shut up but look, i'm still here thanks to the freedom some people believe in.
From what I can see the unreligious folks are into censorship and taking freedom away from others.
My God is into freedom & equality for everybody. My religion means freedom for all people no matter what their position.

So... What if there really is no such thing as a God? Will any of those scripture quotes mean anything if the truth about the nonexistence of God is actually true?

That's a silly question to ask, really, but many scriptures contain philosophical reflections and "truths" that can be appreciated even from a non religious point of view, yes.

Oh. Ok. I think I get what you're saying.

Sounds like you've replaced one crutch with another.

http://www.myconfinedspace.com/wp-co....thumbnail.jpg

Still you. You asked for biblical correction and then refused to acknowledge it.

Hey, the only advertisers on this site pay the fees to keep it going. I think Miles should start charging you if you're openly advertising.

Was?

Who said you were practicing it in the wrong way? We just don't want you preaching to us. Everyone else has their personal beliefs, and perhaps if you want to talk about those beliefs you should hang out with more people who believe those beliefs instead of cramming them down the throats of the VAST MAJORITY, and by that I mean damn near everyone else, that don't want to hear it.

As far as the book goes, there are people who don't believe in Christianity BECAUSE of the Bible.



Yet thanks to Christian Fundies, I can't watch the fucking Teletubbies without someone telling me that I'm watching homosexuality at work. That last quote is the most ironic, and yet down right most idiotic statement you have made thus far. Don't fucking sit there and say "freedom of speech" when it's your fucking right wing organizations that want to control what we say and do the most. You can go right to hell.

So go join a forum that WANTS your scripture. Here, on this forum, scripture is not evidence of jack shit.

Because you're imposing your belief on people who don't want it in most cases.

I'm glad your religion straightened you out.

I don't need religion to straighten out. I did it on my own. It's called using your head.

I don't think that's what he said at all.

With the way you interpret text, I worry about how you're interpreting the bible.

At which point did anyone even attempt to take away your freedom?

You can, legally, preach as much as you want to whomever will listen.

But if you preach on my property, you're getting a police escort out.

No one is taking away your freedom. If anyone is doing that to anyone else, it's the church meddling in my business and teaching my kids that evolution isn't real.

You better start respecting the rights of other people, then.

Let's open another can of worms!
How do you feel about gay marriage, and/or homosexuality as a whole?

:cool:

He calls himself a Christian so his view is very clear. Both are an abomination to God in which death is the only possible and suitable punishment. If he gives some bullshit response then he is clearly not a Christian and is instead (something I have long suspected) just some weak sauce vague person of faith who takes his theology a la carte. Why do so many Americans oppose same sex mariage and homosexuality? Because the book says homosexuality is a sin.

In either case, it should be a hilarious explanation.