I'm poor with no where to live and it will take years to save up for a house. I should be able to go break into one and live in it god dammit.

I'm a good person really. I just want to survive. So it's okay for me to break the law. :D

Shit if that is the case, I am poor too! GIVE ME, GIVE ME, and GIVE ME MORE!

Geez, there is no such thing as a free hand out. Someone always has to pay the bill and as a tax paying American I am really fucking tired of having to pay for these law breaking fucking illegal immigrants! So gukarma if you are so keen on helping these people why don't you go to Mexico and do it, don't try and force your stupid ideals of what the US should do, because really I don't care what you think should happen and I am pretty sure the majory of people don't care either.

I don't try to force my ideas on what you should do.

I have the inherent right to voice them in this country.

Well, you don't have to read them, or respond to them, do you? This is a discussion, and if you aren't comfortable with what I want to say, fuck off.

Because I don't want to. I want to defend their right to an honest life and hard work in the country that I live and love.

----

Having a house is a luxury. You could pay the rent, or lived in a homeless shelter. I've volunteered at a homeless shelter before, it ain't all that bad.

These illegal immigrants just want work and an honest life.

No, what you want to do is give them a right that they have no claim to. Besides, nobody in this country has a right to "honest life and hard work." You have to find those things for yourself.

Work, yes. If they were really wanting to be honest, however, they would go through the proper channels. Living in the country unregistered, and not paying taxes, is an undeniably dishonest way to live.

I think "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" entitle one in the very least to honest and HARD work, and in the best of cases easy work.


Calling that dishonest is twisting things. It's not legal. That's something else.

So how is it honest work? How can somebody who circumvents established laws in order to work making an honest living?

Which would mean something if the Declaration of Independance actually entitled us to anything other than our autonomy from Britain.

It's honest work because it is done with the intent of a greater good and survival through something other than stealing or murdering.


I am sure those words mean something to those who love this country.

You know, defrauding American taxpayers is a form of theft, gukarma. This is exactly what your beloved illegal immigrants are guilty of.

I don't understand, wouldn't legalizing illegal immigrants currently in the country solve the problem of them draining our resources? If they become citizens they will have to abide by all of our laws just like everyone else, including paying taxes. They will no longer have the benefit of legal anonymity and will therefore be accountable.

legalizing them is a very bad idea unless we can shut down the flow of illegals first. (Of course legal immigrants are welcome) We need to stop the flow of illegals before we even think about legalizing them. Otherwise, such a law would just provide an incentive for even more illegals to run across so that can be legal when the law passed.

I propose using the god damned national guard. Isn't in in the constitution that the national guard is to protect border security... yeah it is. Forget legalization... we need to start in the front before moving to the back.

My copy of the Constitution doesn't mention the National Guard at all, let alone border security being their assigned duty. What version are you reading?

It's already been said, but how can people that have illegally entered the country perform truly honest work? The Department of Immigration exists for a reason, and to enter the country without running the risk of deportation you must undergo the legal process of entering the country, regardless of how long it might take you (and the length itself is indicative of the level of importance the government places on immigrants' credentials).

Granting amnesty to illegal immigrants only encourages further illegal border crossings by showing that the government will not take these matters seriously or make any strong attempt to enforce borders.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...n/3758105.html

Enough of the Mexican flag crap already. This is the United States of America..its not Mexico!!! These punk kids have alot of nerve getting their free education paid for by American taxpayers, yet they want to leave class and protest. I'm sure they'd get a fine education in Nuevo Laredo, why not just go there if fucking Mexico is so dear to their hearts.

Comment: Theodore Roosevelt on Immigrants and being an AMERICAN in 1907.

"In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes
here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he
shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an
outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or
birthplace, or origin. But. this is predicated upon the man's becoming
in very fact an American, and nothing but an American. There can be no
divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but
something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one
flag, the American flag ... and this excludes the red flag, which
symbolizes all wars against liberty and civilization, just as much as it
excludes any foreign flag of a nation to which we are hostile. We have
room for but one language here, and that is the English language. And
we have room for but one sole loyalty, and that is a loyalty to the
American people."

Theodore Roosevelt 1907

From the article: "The whole thing just makes my blood boil," said Bruce R. Wing, a 52-year-old Missouri City resident. "I want them all out of here."

I fucking love the name on that quote.

And what's the problem with foreign flags? Is it now such a bad thing to remember and honour one's background? Around here, you see people with all kinds of flags from other nations. Those of American backgrounds have American flags, English have English flags, Australian, Australian flags, French flags, German flags, all kinds of flags. It'd be a little unfair to an American if we disallowed them from bearing that flag, and they'd be a little upset, no?

This does not mean that they do not respect or appreciate the country that they call home now. Just that they still feel a connection, either directly, or through family to the other country.

And what's the problem with protests now? Other than you've implied that they are illegals (which is not substantiated in the article), there is no reason that these students shouldn't be able to express themselves as much as any other citizen.

Why is there 'room for but one language..' anyways? What's the reasoning behind it?

Going into someone else's country illegally, demanding free hand-outs while waving your own flag should be enough to get your ass kicked. These people are entitled to nothing, except free deportation services.

While I have very strong objections to the way illegal immigrants are treated in the US, I will say that it is completely and utterly stupid to be waving a Mexican flag while protesting. Most people here are right in that regard - you are an illegal, and you are taking US services up that you aren't pay for, so at least have the kindness to show that you respect what they give you, instead of waving that flag. If you want acceptance in the US, show it, don't act like you're just here for the money.

Beyond that though, I also strongly believe that we need to completely reform immigration. The US is after all a nation of immigrants, and we need to be more open to people. Then again, I'm outraged about the entire way the US handles visitors even to this country. Getting a visa for a foreigner is so fucking hard, its all needless paranoia over a false threat of terrorism.

It doesn't really matter whether or not they wave the Mexican flag instead of an American one. The end result will still be the same. Congress will pretend to be sensitive, or hard, or smart, to rile up their bases, and nothing will ever get enforced because our military is tied up in Iraq, and border states are pretty much on their own.

That's going on the assumption that they are all illegals. Nothing in the last article I read said anything to that effect. It's easy to assume that those protesting are illegals, but it's only assumption. Isn't it likely that many people feel sorry for the illegals, or know some, and that is why they are protesting or wearing those colours? Gukarma is defending their position, does that mean that he is an illegal?

And border security is something that no one has a workable, or even plausible solution to.

No one is demanding free hand-outs. All the illegal immigrants I know are just hard-working people who want to do nothing but cover the jobs that Americans don't want.

Do you get pissed off when you see the Irish flag, too? I see those all the time here in Boston.

So someone who committed one crime, arguably out of sheer necessity - for survival - is dishonest for LIFE?

I am sure all of these illegal immigrants would have come legally if the process took one or two years, maybe even three. 10-15 years is fucking crazy! These people would HAVE DIED before that.

It's like the process exists just to turn people AWAY from immigrating legally, or doing it at all!

There is a difference though. The Mexican flag is being waved during a protest in which many want to see the illegals evicted. As they are not Americans and people are debating their alligience to the nation, its a bit absurd to wave around you're flag.

In Boston and almost any other place, they're waved around as a homeland recognition thing, and are already US citizens. It doesn't matter for them because they're already citizens and not fighting anything.

Drunk Bostonian Irish though, ugh >.<

Hey that i remember they where also waving the american flag. The media just chose to cover where the mexican flags where showing.

I really hope you aren't that stupid. So, the Poles and Italians and Germans who came over should have just kept speaking their native language. I'm sure they would have melded with society just fine without knowing English. Do we want a Blakanized country with every group having its own little enclave, or do we want a united country. And just how successful can a person be in this country if he doesn't know English?

As to your flag comments, sure, everyone can have a flag of their former coutry at home. wave it if you want, but don't fly a foreign flag over a U.S. government school!!

But that's a fucking choice.

One is free to do whatever he wants in America - that's the beauty of the country. Hell, if a Mexican works in a mexican restaurant, shops in mexican establishments, and rarely ever comes in contact with Americans why would he NEED english?

What I am saying is you CANNOT force anyone to do what they don't want. If one doesn't want to learn English, more power to him/her.

If you are gonna say "BUT I CANT UNDERSTAND THEM AT THE SUPERMARKET!!," well, the supermarket's fault. They should hire people who speak English already for positions that need customer interaction, and only use immigrants who have not yet learned the language for cleaning or stocking.

Indeed, language is one area where I strongly believe that immigrants and all people in general, cannot be told or forced to learn English. The US is a land of immigrants, and simply put, if people wish to retain their language thats fine. However, remember that learning english is a practical necessity because its impossible to do much in the country without it, so in that sense a very good middle ground on the issue has been reached. Theres no reason to alter the status quo in that regard.

Apparently i am that stupid. My question was not whether or not having English as the native language was good/bad. Nor was it whether or not people should learn it. I believe they should as a common ground with everyone from everywhere in the country. My question, from the quote provided, was why there was no room for any other language.

The quote sure makes it sound like it's English all the way, and that all other languages should stop at the border. This is the part that I was questioning.



Why?*

*And please no comment about how stupid I may or not be for inquiring as to the reasons and logic behind the argument. Thanks.