I'm pretty sure I have a valid point, RR.

EDIT Eh, nevermind

That's not monogamy, buddy. That's celibacy... And celibacy can kill you.

That's right. Your NUTS WILL EXPLODE.

Agreed his Christian point is pretty stupid, but I don't see the problem with the rest of his post. Also, I imagine he isn't Catholic, as your child-fucking comment would seem to suggest.

We're talking about dating within a certain age range. Not about philosophy of civilizations and customs.

And I wasn't making a Catholic-exclusive statement. Religion generally has a pro-reproduction stance on their followers, in order to up the number of people following the path of that particular religion.

Some religions allow for the marriage of underage children to an adult. That is, in my book, "child-fucking." Not that I was accusing the guy of doing this at all - or even being a part of a religion that condones this behavior - but that religion really shouldn't be a part of this thought process at all, not to mention the topic at hand.

It's amazing how my stupidity from 5 years ago sparked such a debate by accident... Here's something that I found particularly odd. Alot of people found out that I asked that girl out and even knowing what our ages were, no one seemed to think there was anything wrong with it. I thought for sure everyone was going to think I was a creep after that.

So you're saying that people from eastern, latino, black, native american, and any other group you can think of have the same exact pressures and interpretations of what "mature" mean as WASPy New England?

vs.




I also imagine "child-fucking" was more acceptable in the old days because people didn't live as long. I don't imagine many women would have been able to bear kids into their mid/late 30s, so if they were going to pump out enough babies to help work on the farm they needed to get started pretty darned young (of course, the irony is how now girls are starting puberty younger than back then).

This maturity discussion is stupid and poorly placed.

First off, yes, teenagers can be significantly more mature than their contemporaries through merit of personality, the rigors of a shitty childhood, or the drive of their educations.

But learning the valuable skill of delayed gratification doesn't make you ahead of the curve in other areas. By this I mean; how is having a savings account going to help you develop a Boyfriend Bullshit Detector (BBD)? How is being well-read going to tell you what career you'll build for yourself? That's what I mean by being misplaced. Just because a kid can pass as an adult in certain situations doesn't make them dateable to adults. Don't be pissed off at that.

But feel free to continue the debate re: old decrepit people telling kids that they're kids; kids replying 'nuh-uh'

Are you saying that my ideas of "maturity" are centered from "WASPy" New England?

I'm pretty sure I used the dictionary for my definition. Maybe it's me?

No, you're right. But it's still endorsed by many religions. Hell, out here in "WASPy" New England, I had a friend who was Hindu who got married off at the ripe age of 15. She had to drop out of high school for that marriage.

My point, however, remains that religion has no place in a conversation about "maturity." While some cultures may not all be on the same page as to what "maturity" means, there is a general standard.

And I can't think of a better place for the standard than in a conversation regarding dating and what each person considers a good "age gap" therein.

Age / 2 + 7

Christ on a stick.

Yay, I can date 17-year-olds!

Well, in what may be a vain attempt to get this thread back on track, my own range would be about 4-6 years either way. I'm 28 (soon to be 29) and a 22 year old woman is about as young as I can go. And they'd have to be a mature 22, at that. I could see myself dating a somewhat older woman, though - I just wonder how loudly her biological clock would be ticking, given that I want to be a bit more settled before entretianing the possibility of becoming a parent. So there it is.

So you're saying some white college guy on the internet is able to make statements about WASPs from New England?

(See, I can play ball and sound like a conceited asshole too - but I'm not on staff, so its not tolerated.)

Thank you.


I've dated women much older than myself, they still melt and giggle like women my own age when you know what you're doing. Doesn't matter. Might if I was going to get serious or get married, but for dating? Nah.

I didn't even think it was legal to drop out of high school when you're that young. Yeah, I know some states allow marriages at ridiculessly young ages, but I thought most of them forced you to stay in school till you're a certain age.

Hey, no need to get prissy about my religious views. It's not like I'm yakking my mouth off about God or something, merely a passive statement (albeit stupid in your eyes) that might have an effect on thought. That is, unless from what I read your hate for Christians.


I didn't drag in religion to explain maturity, more as an added possible element to an already complicated question. Choose and discard at your whim.

Definition: Monogamy is the custom or condition of having only one mate in a relationship, thus forming a couple.

I'm sure I'm sticking pretty close to that one.



edit: screw that wall-of-text. It started to look more and more like my paper for class. New question: what's too old? Demi Moore and Ashton Kutcher?

You're misreading the definition, mate. Monogamy is only fucking the person you're dating. Not only ever fucking one person all the way until you're married. It means you don't cheat in relationships, not that you wait until marriage. So you're actually using it wrong, the word you want is celibacy, not monogamy. I date girl A, I fuck girl A. I break up with girl A. I date girl B, I fuck girl B, I break up with girl B. I date girl C, I fuck girl C, I break up with girl C. I've been monogamous with all of them. See the difference?

Now, you all know I'd love to just wade in here swinging with ethnographic content about maturity and concepts of the young bride phenomenon, but it's really sort of out of place in this argument. The question at hand is about how old or young a person must be for you to date. Not whether it's acceptable or decent or even if it's remotely rational. Take a deep breath people, you're arguing morality and religion in a thread about not wanting to fuck cougars.

P.S.

Stop throwing around terms like psychological and social. They hint at a definite definition, which you aren't using at all here. You're just flailing to make a point, and it isn't working.

Cougars. Seriously. Let's move on.

Well, thats the problem with religious people. Everything you say or have a thought on is based on your religious beliefs and everyone else perceives it that way.

Like Bruce Hornsby said "Thats just the way it is".

Ah, right. My fault then.


Well. Shit.

Actually that doesn't sound normal at all. It sounds like you are a repressed square. Please seek help.

Two people as boring as you and your girl (must be to like you) are most likely going to have a successful, turmoil-free relationship no matter what the age difference.

Really that bad, huh?

Pretty much. Two praying mantises trapped in the same jar won't fight if they're already dead.

It's not exactly as if I have no interests ... I do go snowboarding, I'm in a band, regularly attend tactical paintball games .. and various other crap.

Ugh ... sounds like I'm placing myself in a love column advert.

Where did you use the definition out of the dictionary?

You know, come to think of it, has anyone actually defined what "maturity" actually is? I mean, I understand how one can become "more mature," but how do you actually decide when someone is "mature enough?" If you ask someone that's 70 years old how mature someone should be before X do you really think it'll be the same answer as someone that's 30?


But, see, if someone's religion gives them strength and helps them do whatever a 'mature' person does, then shouldn't their religion be pertinent to their level of maturity?

Maybe maturity is like how only those that understand how wise they aren't are truly wise.

I'm a white college guy from the North East that grew up in a town where him being half-jew made him one of the most diverse students in his graduating class of 750. I think I have experience living with a bunch of WASPs.


crimsonsabre, some people just don't mesh with the more laid back lifestyle.