Counting multiplatform, I doubt it. I could believe 40 or 50, but not that many. It would be nice to know the top5 or whatever for any franchise.

Yes it would, but there was a chart on GAF recently that had Mario and his various games taking up the first 5 spots on the top ten best selling games. Either way, at least Mario's changed what he does in the games, while ole Mega's been stuck in a rut for a while now.

I heard in the new MegaMan game, he steals powers from baddies. True story.

I've enjoyed MegaMan though. Despite its the same thing all the time, the powers and levels have always been (or at least on the NES :D) fun to navigate and find energy tanks and such.

It's been a very long time since I've played Ms. Pacman, I could be wrong about it.
Doesn't explain the shit 3D games.

Oh yeah, opinions are fact. Forgot, sorry.

One game to account for every game they make.
Not to mention the most advanced, comprehensive, and interactive pet simulator ever made, according to popular opinion. And I mean very popular, several million people opinion.

Yeah. Same goes for Nintendo.
Also, I've played Kingdom Hearts. People say it's good but the gameplay sucks. Square is terrible at actual gameplay.

If you'd paid attention, I wasn't naming games that were original, I was naming games that don't have spin-offs.

I don't even know what you're arguing about anymore. I think you're just trying to argue against whatever I say, regardless of what it is, meaning that your argument is so flawed and inconsistent that it doesn't make sense.

Now an honest question:
Do you have the capacity for fun? I mean, can you literally have fun?
Because I'm sort of doubting it. And I'd pity you for that, but I'm having trouble there, too.
I mean, I don't go brew trouble in the Sony forum for no reason.

You know, that's fine and all, but at least keep refining it rather than leaving it as it was over a decade ago. They could keep tweaking it to perfection, work on the art, story, etc... but they've let the series, as a whole, stagnate.

And finding energy tanks/upgrades is pretty damn fun, especially when they're tricky spots.

I count at least 41, which doesn't even include remakes or the alternate editions of Pokemon Megaman Battle Network. 42 if you think the spin-off Misadventures of Tron Bonne counts. And few of those are wierdass titles like 'Mario Tennis', so Capcom could easily teach Nintendo a thing or two about cracking the marrow from the bones of the dead horse.

When have I EVER mentioned the PSP? And when have I ever defended it? The PSP has a few remakes, such as Breath of Fire III and Lemmings, but I don't even own one so it doesn't matter.

I didn't say this either. You took those words out of my mouth, and I did not say them. I clearly said that Nintendo is milking Mario, and they are. I don't think that half of the spinoff Mario games are better than the Mario titles themself, but that's because you only see an actual Mario title once in a blue moon.

Enjoy your DDR Mario Mix and then come back to me. It doesn't necessarily need to be good or bad, Mario is still in it, probably along with other commercialized characters.

Again, I didn't say that. I happen to like Kart, but that's only because at the time there wasn't anything else to play.

Yet again, stop taking words out of my mouth. I remember, and I quote, "If Nintendo spent more time with their franchising as they did with their Mario titles, we'd have a proper Mario game by now." And I stand by this, because aside from Mario 64 I have not seen a proper sequel.

I thought you were badmouthing the many Mario games. Regardless, check out the "New Mario Game" thread in the Warp Room. Its got screenies and everything. Original Mario right there.

That's exactly what I though when I first saw the different versions of Battle Network available, and Capcom could very well give Nintendo a run for their money if the latter ever slows down.

You are wrong about it. How can you honestly say that Nintendo are doing a better job of handling Pacman over Namco? THEY INVENTED IT.

One game says alot. I'm sure I could think of more examples, such as the Pikachu 64DD shit they concucted up like, years ago. That was reeeeal necessary.

Yeah, Tamigotchi was real popular. Except it isn't an original Nintendo product, it's a stolen idea and it's basically the same as the Tamigotchis. Sure, you have puppies, they never die, and you can virtually touch them, but it's nothing more than a gimmick that appeals to both sexes. It also isn't a game.

I thought you said it wasn't about gameplay, but about originality and then you raffled off a bunch of original games without spinoffs? Right.

I have fun, and when I do it usually doesn't include Nintendo material. Why? Because Nintendo is history and they're trying to outlive themselves. Sure, me saying that may sound harsh, and you may not like it, but it's basically true. They've resorted to coming up with retarded conclusions(see: Nintendo Revolution controller) and "innovation" with their games as a last resort. They've managed to push back Twilight Princess to the launch of the Revolution -- which indicates that they're uncertain about how successful their Revolution launch will be, and you're eventually going to see some sort of cashing project involving a bunch of characters.

I can see it now. "Super Smash Bros Revolution."

No, but you seem to do a good job of it anyway.

But it isn't for the Revolution, and that's what we're talking about. It isn't a console Mario title which will follow from Mario 2, 3, World, Mario 64, Sunshine and Wind Waker. I don't think it counts in that department.

So I can base a console or a company on just one game? Can I base the PS2 on a game like Extermination?



But this is very different. Or can we claim that Atari "invented" racing games and everyone else is copying them with their Gran Turismo?

So can we. Thanks for the anticipation.

Aww shit, I thought it was a handheld console. What is it? A handheld thinger-majig?

There is no such thing as a handheld console. It's a handheld, that's it. Consoles and handhelds are too different, otherwise you would be calling the N-Gage a console as well. And that makes no sense.

Half of the stuff you replied to wasn't for you anyway. Nintendogs is basically an advanced tamigotchi simulator, and I'm pretty sure others can see and think that for themselves. It just feels like a borrowed idea.

You don't see many of those these days. Gran Turismo is a racing simulator, and you see hundreds of them. Why? I don't know, perhaps because they're popular - but that would bring me to my next question - Nintendogs is popular, but because it's treated as a Nintendo game, and "unique", it sells well. Not only is that a great reason to point the finger at Nintendo, but it also shows that you can rehash any popular product which has died and make it popular again without even taking into consideration people's views.

Ultimately, Nintendogs is a rehashed idea of the Tamagotchi. It's true.

Outside of japan, how many "Train a ____, level a _____, grow a _____" games do you see? Of course there's Pokemon which is by Nintendo, and of course RPGs don't count. So, how many pet levelling/training simulators are on the PS2 and xbox? Not many, if any. If there ARE any, they're probably still inside japan.

Getting back to the point I was trying to make - Nintendogs wasn't an original idea like he said it was. It was basically yet again, another project to earn money. Take a simple idea, add some content, don't overdo it, and make it replayability, and you have katamaria great game which appeals to basically everybody in the entire universe. That doesn't mean to say it hasn't been done before, though.

I'm not trying to derail, troll, or offend anybody here. Nobody can seem to grasp the fact that Nintendo have milked Mario and concepts in the past and have gotten away with it. What does this say for the Revolution? Not much, considering it'll be the 3rd parties that make the quality this time, not Mr. "2 quality games per year" Miyamoto.

But you're doing such a good job of it. =\

Your argument has literally made NO SENSE. I've read this entire travesty in one go from OP to this post, and I couldn't see what point you were trying to make. You say that Nintendo has milked Mario, and imply that these games are inferior because of this milking, then you try and defend OTHER companies doing the exact same thing. The ONLY difference is that these other companies have not done it for AS LONG, which makes it COMPLETELY acceptable in your eyes. To which, I call bullshit. You CANNOT bash Nintendo for milking, then turn around and defend other companies doing the same thing by using the excuse that the other companies haven't done it as long.

We're not saying that Nintendo hasn't milked it, there's no doubt that they have, and it annoys me a bit when I walk into a Target and I see "Super Mario Strikers DEMO" and "DDR Mario Mix" in the kiosk (Granted, Super Mario Strikers is rather fun, but the last soccer game I played was... FIFA '95, I think, so I can't really tell how original it is). But we're not arguing that Nintendo hasn't milked them, we're arguing that you're bashing Nintendo unfairly for milking, when companies that do the same thing earn your praise.

Your problem is that you keep trying to make exceptions where other consoles are just as "guilty." You say that Nintendogs is recycling an old idea. Hey, guess what, PEOPLE LIKE IT! I don't understand why you're trash-talking a successful product.

In that case, Halo 2 just uses the characters and weapons and stuff from the first one...and umm, makes things a little different!

^Yes, yes it does. And you know what, some people like it. Thus, making more of it. Franchises like Mario are profitable. The more of it, the more money. I don't see the problem.

Off to work I go.

You manage to miscontrue EVERYTHING I say. I'm fairly impressed.
Thomas Edison invented the motion picture. I'd say Kubrick and Godard and Tarantino have used it more effectively.
Anyway, I'm not saying that the connectivity game is better than Pacman, or even Ms. Pacman (which you must be a HUGE fan of, defending it so staunchly). But it is better than the game it came with, the 3D Pacman game, made by Namco, which was shit. It's the best one in recent years.

You lose for resorting to calling it a gimmick. Most over-used fanboyism of the year.
Anyway, it's a really brilliantly designed game (or nongame, if your PURE GAMER SOUL won't permit me to call it a game), and lots of people like it. A lot more than they like the PSP, apparently. Gimmick for the win.

I don't even know what the fuck you're saying here. I never said anything "wasn't about gameplay", and I never mentioned originality. I think you're making shit up, unless you can come up with a quote from me that says just that.
Again, I didn't call those original games. I called them Nintendo franchises that had no (or just one) spin-offs.
To point out the sheer number of franchises that don't face the multi-genre treatment (which I'm not opposed to, but which I don't buy into).

All of this is just Nintendo whining. I don't even think you made a valid point.
And yes, SSBRevolution. It'll be awesome.

What.
If you haven't noticed, you're the one that EVERYONE ELSE is arguing against. And don't pull some underdog is right bullshit either, because you're not the underdog and you're not right.

BWAgjaeifnaekflm.
I never said that. Ever. Please, for Christ's sake, stop making shit up.

Um, right. So are we just forgetting MGS2 and DMC2 because they sucked in most people's books, then? I think both series are pretty overrated, anyways. I own every Metal Gear game, and personally I prefer the original NES version over all the others. Hell, I like MGS for GBA better than 1 and 2.

Haha, wow. No, I could complain about just about any of them for any length of time. Of course, let's just disregard the fact that it's entirely subjective, because you seem to prefer to do that a lot.

I did play it for very long, mind you, and Sunshine was just awesome in my view. About as good as Mario 64; they each had their ups and downs. Mario Sunshine's level design isn't as good, but that's actually because it has better gameplay - but gameplay that relies on water. Mario Sunshine is actually more difficult than Mario 64. It also has the Warp Zones, which are far more awesome than anything in Mario 64.

Mario 128, which for a long time had been rumored to come out towards the end of the Gamecube's lifespan, is now purportedly a Revolution launch title. Of course, it instantly sucks because it uses a controller you have never used and hate.

I can't argue that the Mario Party series aren't milking Mario out, but that's about it. So I don't buy them or play them, apparently some people do and enjoy them. Who cares. I don't particularly like sports games in general, but I find the Mario sports titles to be a helluva lot less boring than others. Not that I've ever even personally bought one of them.

And of course, let's not even mention the Mario and Luigi games, because they're kickass awesome.

Lastly, in case you forgot, your beloved Square-Enix is making Mario Basketball for the DS. SUP. NOW.

Oh, okay, so since I own 40+ Gamecube and 6 PS2 games I consider worth playing, I guess I must be living in an alternate dimension or something. One where people can have opinions.

You're a fucking tard. This is the Warp Room.

I believe the point of of any company to make money. A cash project is always a good thing.

Double Post:
Not true. The N-Gage is a handheld console. Handheld is a pretty vague term. A dildo can be handheld. Does that mean a dildo is a handheld console?

What ISN'T a borrowed idea? Answer me that.

Who cares about people's views, ultimately YOUR VIEWS. The game sells, people love it, Nintendo stays in business. It's what a company does. Do you not fucking understand this? No company wants to go bankrupt, especially to satisfy a bitchy, whiny New Zealander.

Next time they'll try harder, just for you.

How many handheld console games have you seen where you RAISE A DOG?

So what if it's been done before? There's tons of skyscrapers but only one Empire State Building. Get my drift?

EVERYBODY in the game industry milks it. Get over it. Quit bitching.

Your points hold no actual ground.

What is this about Dr. Mario being a Tetris clone.

I think this is about Dr. Mario not being a real Doctor and prescribing prescriptions of MILK which ultimately satisfied his patients.

But that doesn't seem to matter.

-_-'' MY THREAD!!!!!!!

(gee a 6hr sleep and this thread goes from 1 to 3 pages... two pages worth of off-topic stuff)

I suppose if I were to make something decent out of all this hoopla, it would seem people here would want a revolution. Elixir seems to be tired off all these "Mario Evolutions" (the evolution of the soccer genre because of Mario etc.), wanting some kind of Mario revolution. Isn't that good, Nintendo faboys?

Who here wouldn't mind just a visual upgrade (and advanced gameplay/physics engines)?

Something original, which apparently Nintendo are full of. Yet things like Nintendogs aren't original whatsoever.

NO other company has milked their characters as much as Nintendo.

Are you seriously trying to say that RPGs are a borrowed idea from the tamagotchi? Because that's what you're implying. RPGs don't count simply because there are only a very small portion of RPGs which let you raise animals. Nintendogs is a borrowed idea and is nothing original. It doesn't matter how popular it is, it's an advanced tamagotchi simulator.

There's always Animal Crossing, but nobody but myself probably would of thought of that considering it's a Nintendo release. See how biased this is?

Yeah, Microsoft didn't fuck it up(as much) as what they did with the travesties made after Mario 64.

Hypocrite.

Why are you evading the truth? You clearly said that you like Nintendo because their stuff is original. I presented Nintendogs to you, and now you're denying you ever said that. What, do I need to spell it out for you?

Except I am, and you're missing the point. I'll spell it out. Nintendo are milking their characters over other companies. Understand? Other companies have done this, but not to the extent of what Nintendo has.

Who cares. It's the same with Brain Training - take a small idea, add something to it, but don't overdo it. It sells because it appeals to the thousands of asians who flock to the study hall for learning, and not only do you have kids buying it you also have adults buying it for their kids. That applies to Nintendogs as well.

I don't know what's so fucking difficult to understand. Nintendo are stringing their characters along, not making any real games, yet you have victims like StarmanDX who sit there, proud, with their 40+ Gamecube collection to brag. Sure, it looks impressive, but with the lack of games you'll end up buying Tony Hawk's Underground or Burnout 2, or something like that, just to entertain yourself. Gamecube never did have the variety that the PS2 and xbox did, but people seem to think that every Gamecube title released is made out of gold. This concept is more overrated then Chrono Trigger.

What they're doing is quite simple. Nintendo are selling out. They have been, and post-1997 they've done so more. Every company does this, BUT NOT AS MUCH AS NINTENDO. That's why I expect to see Mario Soccer and stuff on the Revolution.

When the Revolution is released, a SSBM upgrade will come out. A Zelda game won't be released, because Twilight Princess has been stalled to the launch. This pretty much shows that they're concerned about the sucess of their launch. Perfect plot. Then you'll have the typical games from Ubisoft and EA, and eventually, a few months down the track, a good game will appear. Then a few months later, it will happen again. It seems to happen in bursts wuith Nintendo going by what anything the Gamecube was.

It's pretty predictable overall. You have this weird, basic remote which developers now have to work with(much like how developers work with the touchscreen of the DS, even though they can perfectly release a game without even using it once), you'll have your variety of games which are pretty average, and then you'll have the bunch of games you'll actually play.

$10 bucks says people use the Revolution for backwards compatibility in the 2-4 month "worthwhile release" period.

Hahaha, oh yes, I'm such a victim of having games that I enjoy. Those numbers are after trading in the ones I didn't like, mind you. I would actually feel like a victim, however, if I had to pay for as many PS2's as my sister has just to have a working one, or had I bought most of the PS2 games I've played.

Oh, and good job avoiding everything else I said.

Because, as everyone knows, unlike other companies, Nintendo totally tries to appeal to casual gamers with sex/gore/violence, and will allow any crappy game made by any developer onto their systems. That certainly isn't selling out by any means.

Meh, I'm pretty satisfied with graphics the way they are now, no need to pay hundreds of dollards (and thousand(s) for an HDTV) just so I can have slightly shinier graphics. Maybe in a few years when there's better technology.

As far as advanced gameplay goes, that's what we'll be getting with Revolution.

More enemies on screen/better AI would certainly be nice to have, but as far as physics go the Source Engine is more than capable, and that ran on Xbox.

But that would've stretched Xbox, wouldn't it? Resi 4 on GCN stretched the machine's power (some sections I've played had minor frame rate issues) so would the Revolution benefited from more from more power?

I personally would like a revolution because ever since the current generation of gaming consoles I've become more of a casual gamer than anything. I feel like I've been playing more of the same thing over and over again. And if the only big thing last generation was online gaming, what for now? The DS brought back the gamer side of me, though, with the new interface and the concept of playing games from another perspective.

Alternatively, I could argue that we don't need it, since there's still a potential market for conventional gaming. There is still a large amount of non-gamers out there who may have missed out on gaming and with the introduction of more sophisticated graphics, physics and AI, gaming wouldn't be seen as nerdy (therefore allowing new consumers to enter the gaming world). Ya, I know, the Playstation broke that sterotype but PS3 and Xbox360 may open that realm further.

I might have said something hypocritical in the course of my argument.
Those two quotes, however, are not remotely hypocritical, even when you took them out of context. So I don't follow.

Yes, exactly, please. In my own words, quote it word for word what I said, and show me where I said it. Cuz I swear, I've looked through the thread and you must be seeing something I'm not.
I said Nintendo was innovative, you posted a picture of Nintendogs. I respond like so:
Not once in that response do I mention Nintendogs being original. Good, but not original. Tamigotchi wasn't original, because PETS EXIST.
You said this in response:
You also mentioned Tamigotchi again, for some reason.

And then, this is the coup de grace, you say this:
Which I never said. Fuckin' check it if you like. I said Nintendo is innovative, and you posted a picture of Nintendogs and somehow assumed I meant that game. I never did.
Metroid, Zelda, Pikmin, Earthbound, all extremely original games.
I think Shadow of the Colossus is original. Fighting big enemies isn't original at all, but it's an innovative game in many ways. The same goes for a multitude of Nintendo games.

Anyway, I like how Nintendogs is the only consistent example you have for Nintendo's lack of originality.
Nintendogs is not original. But it expanded the borders of virtual pet games far beyond what they'd ever been before.

Also, in regards to this quote:
Don't misconstrue what I'm saying. Kingdom Hearts is original, I was interested in it. But when I saw it, the gameplay was shit. Utter shit.
I like Nintendo because they have original games and original GAMEPLAY. Gameplay is the most important thing to me in games. I don't know what is to you. Probably arguing about them.

So you'd prefer a revolution than just evolution? (In desperation of avoiding this thread's closure -_-')